Planned Diversions From SFO to OAK/SJC
Jun 13, 2018, 12:25 pm
#256
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: SJC / DPS
Programs: AS G75K, UA Silver
Posts: 1,757
It’s not inconceivable that a passenger would print a BP at home/office/hotel and show up at SFO 90 minutes before departure, go through security and not notice anything until they don’t see a flight on the board. Once they move departure airports, it’s off the SFO boards. I wonder what they’d do in that situation?
For those who print-at-home and go straight to the gate, yeah, that would suck.
Jun 18, 2018, 12:49 pm
#257
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO
Programs: AS, UA, WN, IHG Diamond Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Gold, CET 7*
Posts: 3,300
Of note, this is getting more press in the Bay Area with Chris McGinnis' (Travel Skills/San Francisco Chronicle) piece today, which also includes handy links to AS' website directly addressing this issue:
https://www.sfgate.com/chris-mcginni...s-13004295.php
https://www.alaskaair.com/content/tr...-from-bay-area
https://www.sfgate.com/chris-mcginni...s-13004295.php
https://www.alaskaair.com/content/tr...-from-bay-area
Jun 18, 2018, 1:05 pm
#258
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: UA Gold 1MM, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 548
I mostly fly on United and had never heard of this until I saw Chris McGinnis' article today. For me, this practice is totally unacceptable, and I will avoid Alaska flights at all costs. There is no way I would want to go to a different airport on short notice. Plus, the idea of traveling from the city to SFO, dealing with a ticket change and then backracking by taking a bus to OAK is ludicrous. I suppose it's a plus to fliers on other airlines because if Alaska moves flights to other airports on a bad day, then that opens up takeoff and landing slots for competitors.
Is it fair to assume this practice is mostly for shorter flights on the West Coast and that a transcon would be a safe bet for avoiding this?
Is it fair to assume this practice is mostly for shorter flights on the West Coast and that a transcon would be a safe bet for avoiding this?
Jun 18, 2018, 1:11 pm
#259
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,395
SFO ATC holds for flow control affect planes not in the air yet ("you, yes, you, no taking off until we say so") in order to make sure you don't have planes running on fumes having to circle waiting for a chance to land. Transcon = way more likely to be in the air already when the hold is declared (plus frequencies are higher for the shorthaul flights). So yes. The disparate impact will be on LAX/SFO/SEA/PDX/LAS/PHX/SLC, not so much JFK/EWR/DCA/IAD/MIA/BOS/etc.
Jun 18, 2018, 1:13 pm
#260
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO
Programs: AS, UA, WN, IHG Diamond Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Gold, CET 7*
Posts: 3,300
I mostly fly on United and had never heard of this until I saw Chris McGinnis' article today. For me, this practice is totally unacceptable, and I will avoid Alaska flights at all costs. There is no way I would want to go to a different airport on short notice. Plus, the idea of traveling from the city to SFO, dealing with a ticket change and then backracking by taking a bus to OAK is ludicrous. I suppose it's a plus to fliers on other airlines because if Alaska moves flights to other airports on a bad day, then that opens up takeoff and landing slots for competitors.
Is it fair to assume this practice is mostly for shorter flights on the West Coast and that a transcon would be a safe bet for avoiding this?
Is it fair to assume this practice is mostly for shorter flights on the West Coast and that a transcon would be a safe bet for avoiding this?
It seems to disrupt SEA/PDX-SFO the most, but there are reports in this thread of mid-cons being diverted to SJC as well. I haven't seen a t-con hit by it yet, but Summer is just beginning.
Jun 18, 2018, 1:19 pm
#261
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SFO, mostly
Posts: 2,204
Point being is that while the diversions occur at a higher rate than other airlines, there is still a 98% chance that a flight you have scheduled into SFO will operate to that airport (albeit possibly with some delay).
Jun 18, 2018, 1:30 pm
#262
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,639
If you're an actual frequent SFO flyer, even on other airlines, you should probably check your flight status before going to the airport. If your flight is diverted to OAK, you'd almost certainly learn this before going to SFO, unless you're leaving 4+ hours before your flight. For tech-unsavvy infrequent flyers, this could cause problems (as discussed upthread) but if you're posting here you should probably be savvy enough to know where your flight is operating before showing up to the airport blind.
Jun 18, 2018, 1:48 pm
#263
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO
Programs: AS, UA, WN, IHG Diamond Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Gold, CET 7*
Posts: 3,300
If you look at the publicly available data from BTS for SFO arrivals (Jan-Apr 2018), it shows that 38 Alaska flights were canceled (1.07%) and 33 were diverted to another airport (0.93%). So, basically schedule completion into SFO was at 98%. This doesn't include OO operated flights which are reported separately, although the overall diversion rate for OO into SFO (including UA branded operations) is quite low.
Point being is that while the diversions occur at a higher rate than other airlines, there is still a 98% chance that a flight you have scheduled into SFO will operate to that airport (albeit possibly with some delay).
Point being is that while the diversions occur at a higher rate than other airlines, there is still a 98% chance that a flight you have scheduled into SFO will operate to that airport (albeit possibly with some delay).
If you're an actual frequent SFO flyer, even on other airlines, you should probably check your flight status before going to the airport. If your flight is diverted to OAK, you'd almost certainly learn this before going to SFO, unless you're leaving 4+ hours before your flight. For tech-unsavvy infrequent flyers, this could cause problems (as discussed upthread) but if you're posting here you should probably be savvy enough to know where your flight is operating before showing up to the airport blind.
Jun 18, 2018, 4:28 pm
#264
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Danville, CA, USA;
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Just saw the story today - was not aware this was now SOP for AS. My initial view was positive as the flight delays drive me nuts, but on review I think this works best for visitors (using Uber, taxi, transit) rather than those of us who live here and often park at SFO. Cause the last thing I want to do when I get home is to wait for everyone else's checked luggage, then board a bus, sit in traffic across the bridge, and then drive back through traffic across the same route. Would be better on the outbound, as I could avoid the ground transport mess.
SJC is a non-starter for me, so not sure how this will play out for me going forward though a 1% risk of diversion is certainly tolerable, even more so if certain flights are more frequently impacted...
SJC is a non-starter for me, so not sure how this will play out for me going forward though a 1% risk of diversion is certainly tolerable, even more so if certain flights are more frequently impacted...
Jun 18, 2018, 7:04 pm
#265
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Programs: HH Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 10,458
Well, the other option is to simply cancel the flight all together, as they did with this morning's 7am flight from SEA-SFO. They cancelled it about 12 hours earlier. When my Mother called, they quoted ATC issues. My Mother would have been happy to go to OAK, rather than fighting for the last middle seat on the 10am departure.
Great job, Alaska! Cancel a Monday morning business flight to SFO, when all of your other flights are full. It sounds like their ops department is not ready for prime time.
Great job, Alaska! Cancel a Monday morning business flight to SFO, when all of your other flights are full. It sounds like their ops department is not ready for prime time.
Jun 18, 2018, 7:41 pm
#266
Join Date: Aug 2013
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold
Posts: 917
Might be worth noting that in my case, the route was MRY-SFO and the airline was United. They told us at the gate that we’d be going to SJC instead.
Jun 18, 2018, 7:51 pm
#267
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
Posts: 5,848
Hard to remember, after so long. Before 2009 at least, which is the last time I showed up to the airport only to discover that I would be going to a “point C”.
Might be worth noting that in my case, the route was MRY-SFO and the airline was United. They told us at the gate that we’d be going to SJC instead.
Jun 18, 2018, 8:49 pm
#268
Join Date: Aug 2013
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold
Posts: 917
That is not really relevant. MRY is not a hub airport for UA and if the weather is really bad on the coast--given that there are so few flights at MRY, the airport may be shut down so there is no option to just wait an hour or two to continue the flight. It is not a regular process to fly people to SJC from SFO just because it was better for UA. UA also didn't put on their website that you may be informed a few hours of whatever flight you may be taking and end up leaving or arriving at any one of three airports--we will let you know when we decide what is best for us.
Jun 18, 2018, 9:11 pm
#269
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO
Programs: AS, UA, WN, IHG Diamond Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Gold, CET 7*
Posts: 3,300
You have misinterpreted the reason I mentioned it. It merely represents the only time I've ever been headed to SFO and ended up at another Bay Area airport. Since I genuinely do not care about the fierce, go-nowhere war being waged in this thread, you shouldn't look at it as anything more than a story that highlights how a flight failing to go from "point a to point b" isn't exactly a new thing.
You also misinterpreted my quote which was in reference to knowing where your flight was operating from before going to the airport. In your example, it operated from exactly where you had booked your ticket, MRY.
It's all good though, I'm glad to see it getting more press here in the Bay Area so that other travelers aren't blindsided should this happen to them.
Jun 18, 2018, 9:11 pm
#270
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SFO, mostly
Posts: 2,204
Well, the other option is to simply cancel the flight all together, as they did with this morning's 7am flight from SEA-SFO. They cancelled it about 12 hours earlier. When my Mother called, they quoted ATC issues. My Mother would have been happy to go to OAK, rather than fighting for the last middle seat on the 10am departure.
Great job, Alaska! Cancel a Monday morning business flight to SFO, when all of your other flights are full. It sounds like their ops department is not ready for prime time.
Great job, Alaska! Cancel a Monday morning business flight to SFO, when all of your other flights are full. It sounds like their ops department is not ready for prime time.