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Master thread Air Canada Refunds vs credits; Class action lawsuit filed

Old Dec 10, 2020, 7:55 pm
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Last edit by: Adam Smith
As of April 13, 2021 (in conjunction with the federal government bailout), AC is providing refunds for flights cancelled due to COVID, which applies to tickets with travel after February 1, 2020, and purchased before April 13, 2021. This includes flights cancelled by customers rather than AC.

Going forward (i.e. tickets purchased on or after April 13, 2021), cancelled flights will be refunded if AC does not offer a re-booking option with departure +/- 3 hours from the original time.

AC refund portal

Online refund request form

Press release on the bailout
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Master thread Air Canada Refunds vs credits; Class action lawsuit filed

Old Apr 7, 2020, 5:03 pm
  #121  
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Originally Posted by Bogwoppit
That is what I was hoping for. My previous booking YUL to BRU for myself and hubby had a 24 hour change a few months back. I even accepted the change, and I was able to get a full refund. This was March 20th.
The no-refunds policy came in for changes/cancellations on or after March 19th. If the impact to your flight had occurred some time before that, it would still have been eligible for refund.

Calling today got me nothing like that. Agent clearly stressed, kept talking about “current situation” and “air Canada going bankrupt” etc etc.
An agent definitely shouldn't be saying things like that.

Originally Posted by dav662
If AC is going bankrupt it's obvious no one is going to accept any vouchers. All would want a refund.
I did a detailed analysis in the financial update thread about why an insolvency may well be a non-event with regards to travel credits.
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Old Apr 7, 2020, 5:37 pm
  #122  
 
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Originally Posted by Adam Smith


I did a detailed analysis in the financial update thread about why an insolvency may well be a non-event with regards to travel credits.
Saw a lot of back and forth / arguments.

What's the TLDR from that?
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Old Apr 7, 2020, 8:00 pm
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[QUOTE=capedreamer;32273888]Looks like CTA is deviating from the US and EU stance:

Passengers hoping for refunds for cancelled flights will be out of luck

Canadian airline customers whose travel plans are upended by the COVID-19 pandemic and travel restrictions can get credits from the carriers, but have no right to a refund, according to changes made by the federal government.

Canadas move to waive airlines responsibilities to give customers their money back sets it apart from Europe and the United States, where airlines have been ordered by regulators to provide refunds to people whose flights were cancelled due to the pandemic.
that's just a misleading inaccurate and incomplete presentation of the current situation. The author fails to mention the class action lawsuits and other recourses available to consumers (chargeback, small claim court)

The author is a "transportation reporter". I wonder if he's hoping to get keep getting invited to special events hosted by the airlines (route and aircraft debuts, ...)
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Old Apr 7, 2020, 9:14 pm
  #124  
 
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Originally Posted by CanadianMike
Saw a lot of back and forth / arguments.

What's the TLDR from that?
Adam knows what he is talking about and the rest of us are superficial idiots or hard over wrong.
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Old Apr 7, 2020, 9:57 pm
  #125  
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Originally Posted by CanadianMike
Saw a lot of back and forth / arguments.

What's the TLDR from that?
As someone with a fair amount of experience in insolvencies, I see it being fairly likely that travel credits are left untouched in a restructuring. If you want to know more, just read this one post.
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 6:13 am
  #126  
 
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Politicians have been always too cozy with AC unlike in most other countries. It's privately owned and yet the CTA always side with the airline. In Canada even technical reason delays or cancellations are not blind on the Airlines to provide anything like they do in the rest of the world.

I wonder what would be the legal implications of what CTA said about refunds in the court case? What if a Canadian airline goes under and not paying any refunds and their justification would be the CTA stand. Would the CTA then get sued?
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 7:25 am
  #127  
 
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Canada OKs travel vouchers for cancelled flights while U.S. and EU say passengers deserve a refund

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/air...u-us-1.5524899
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 7:33 am
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Anyone have any luck filing with DOT?
I had a flight leaving Chicago-YYZ-DEL-YYZ-YUL-ZBF
As I understand from the DOT site any flight leaving or arriving from the US is eligible for a refund if the flight is cancelled regardless of reason
I just filed with DOT and will see
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 7:46 am
  #129  
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Originally Posted by dav662
Politicians have been always too cozy with AC unlike in most other countries.
Then write to them. Politicians go where the votes are. If they start to hear from a lot of disgruntled voters/airline customers, maybe they'll do something about it.

I wonder what would be the legal implications of what CTA said about refunds in the court case?
The airlines may well cite CTA's statement in their defence, but the statement is not definitive (it does still say that cases will be examined individually) and not a ruling, so it's really not worth much.

What if a Canadian airline goes under and not paying any refunds and their justification would be the CTA stand. Would the CTA then get sued?
No.
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 8:20 am
  #130  
 
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Originally Posted by ilneigetu
Anyone have any luck filing with DOT?
I had a flight leaving Chicago-YYZ-DEL-YYZ-YUL-ZBF
As I understand from the DOT site any flight leaving or arriving from the US is eligible for a refund if the flight is cancelled regardless of reason
I just filed with DOT and will see
At this point DOT is probably just a secondary resource after chargeback. More like adding to the pile of complaints so DOT is aware of the scale of what's happening.
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 8:35 am
  #131  
 
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Originally Posted by Adam Smith
Then write to them. Politicians go where the votes are. If they start to hear from a lot of disgruntled voters/airline customers, maybe they'll do something about it.



The airlines may well cite CTA's statement in their defence, but the statement is not definitive (it does still say that cases will be examined individually) and not a ruling, so it's really not worth much.



No.
I did. I was lucky enough to get information on the airline passenger rights issue. Originally it was supposed to be like most other countries and especially EU a law. It was also supposed to be extremely close or the same as in USA and EU. Technical delays and cancellations were the responsibility of the airlines and have to provide the same compensation and alternate options. Only weather related or natural disasters were issued that no compensation need be paid. But refunds were to be paid.
Then something happened and this new rules came out. From the information I got the airlines and especially AC got it's influence to change it to what it's now.
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 8:38 am
  #132  
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Not encouraging to read from the CBC article.

The CTA has suspended its complaint operations until June 30 to focus on more urgent matters during the pandemic.
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 8:50 am
  #133  
 
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Originally Posted by SweFlyer
Canada OKs travel vouchers for cancelled flights while U.S. and EU say passengers deserve a refund

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/air...u-us-1.5524899
I think it's worth repeating that the CTA did NOT say refunds were not required. All they said, which again is not binding, is that offering vouchers was an acceptable option. Offering...So if passengers accept, then the airline wins some free loans and maybe some free cash.
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 8:59 am
  #134  
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Originally Posted by slickvik
At this point DOT is probably just a secondary resource after chargeback. More like adding to the pile of complaints so DOT is aware of the scale of what's happening.
Do both. The DoT complaint will help with the chargeback.

It was just reported this morning on AF/KL refund thread that KLM got the message and introduced a new USA COVID-19 policy allowing for refunds for changes in excess of 3 hours while the rest of KLM passengers is only getting vouchers.

UA also backtracked in their COVID-19 refund last Friday shortly after DoTs Enforcement Notice came out.

Originally Posted by tcook052
Not encouraging to read from the CBC article.

The CTA has suspended its complaint operations until June 30 to focus on more urgent matters during the pandemic.
https://otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/covid-19-and-cta-services
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Last edited by seawolf; Apr 8, 2020 at 9:05 am
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Old Apr 8, 2020, 10:53 am
  #135  
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Originally Posted by Bogwoppit
That is what I was hoping for. My previous booking YUL to BRU for myself and hubby had a 24 hour change a few months back. I even accepted the change, and I was able to get a full refund. This was March 20th.
The vast majority of fares Canada -> Europe permit a refund, minus a penalty of between 300-600$. Even in this climate. You should investigate if you don't want to dance around with the vouchers or pin your hopes on a class action that could take many many years to solve.
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