The smallest state

These articles are merely a reaction to the continued, constant, downward spiral of AC customer service.

Rude employees, uncaring executives, bizarre rules that always seem to work out in AC's favor, missing dogs, children left overnight in airports.......................AC leaves themselves open for these attack articles. There is so much to work with, news organizations are for profit and almost every Canadian has a "one time AC really f---ed me over story". What better click bait?

An uncaring, unsympathetic, lumbering airline that has a very, very, very determined number of employees who are trying their best to undermine the entire company. This job is fairly easy as the company makes decisions that this cabal of disgruntled employees can easily exploit. These are the usual old vets, they will be generously populated by the old, the lazy, the tired, the angry at the world, the burned out, the grumpy, the pissed off, the don't give a **** FA's, phone reps, GA's.

If every single member of Flyertalk, spent an entire day, brainstorming to come up with ideas on how to degrade, punish and screw over AC, we couldn't do half as good a job as AC does to itself.

Frankly, AC has brought these articles on themselves.

Ber2dca

The first two Youtube videos showing up when I type in "Air Canada" are the infamous anti-AC rant by that chick from a few years ago and a video titled "It's over..never take Air Canada".

It's fair to say that if some drama occurred with AC beyond the usual stuff, the Canadian public would likely not be very forgiving. I have a feeling AC is generally more popular outside Canada where it is often seen through kind of a "Canada is nice, Canadians are nice" type lens.

tcook052

Folks, a number of UA related posts have been deleted as being off topic so please confine the comments to the couple in the OP or AC's overbooking policies and continue the debate about other airline policies in other FT airline fora.

tcook052
AC forum moderator

kwflyer

This is ironic on sooooo many levels

SKYEG

Besides the one incident at YUL service desk airside, I've noticed improvements in AC's CS all year, both at airports and call centers. Some above and beyond what I would get as a 1K. Haven't got dragged off a flight yet either :P too soon?

DrunkCargo

That's an interesting point. If you purchased the ticket in advance, you would have been exposed to a vastly different price curve than say T-2h which doesn't allow you to signal the true top-price you would have paid for that seat.

How about this: At the gate, bid to increase your fare paid to keep your seat via app... if no IDB would have occurred, then your bid is not charged. If IDB would have occurred, the lowest bidder gets booted? Introduce a third party to track the bids to avoid concerns of price manip.

Or better yet, ask people if their business is not important enough at the gate to bid on how "unimportant" it is. US would announce when the next flight would be, that seats would be confirmed on that flight, and what the current compensation is at... so there's no confusion like the other recent news where a VDB turns into an IDB unwittingly. Technology like kiosks and OLCI ask not only if you want to volunteer, but for how much at check-in time could also expedite this bidding process.

If your business is truly important, you will have the means in your pocket to entice another nearby airline to do what you need. And if you're really concerned, you quadruple book refundables and fly whatever you need to get there, although you might lose your status. No airline can possibly assures delivery of cargo on time. Forget IDBs: IRROPs, AC624, MH370, etc... if you need financial protection, there are casinos like Blue Cross to call on. =)


ps: Did you mean the business is worth a $25k flight, or worth $25k in entirety? (not super relevant, but...)

canadiancow

This "bidding" is exactly how VDB should work.

But I don't think IDB should be allowed. IDB fines the airline $25k per incident. Therefore, make the VDB worthwhile. I'm sure someone will give in when it reaches 4 figures.

I'm certainly not a Tango-once-a-year passenger, but $1000 starts to sound VERY enticing.

Not at all relevant for the point I was trying to make.

DrunkCargo

Do you mean IDB should not be legal, or that the airline should try very hard to resist doing it? (seems the fine would provide the objective disincentive)

Also what is to stop an airline from reporting NOSHO REACCOMMODATE? (not even a frigging English word... it's ACCOMMODATE... there's no RE)

canadiancow

Well what's the difference between making it illegal, and saying "if you do this you will pay a $25k fine"?

Same effect.

And I'm not sure what your second point is. Are you suggesting they'd lie and say you're a no show?

How much are they going to have to pay all the GAs and passengers to secure their testimony? Probably a lot more than a reasonable VDB offer.

quantumofforce

REACCOMMODATE is for a passengers 2nd+ bump of the day

DrunkCargo

I've mostly heard it used for the 1st bump, but indeed it is a reasonable neologism to represent the 2nd and beyond... similarly, the use of the word "accommodate" would suffice for 1st and subsequent accommodations.

So the couple in the OP were accommodated or reaccommodated?

Mauricio23

Red herring alert. If you want cheap fares, why not slash prices by 90%, oversell every flight by a factor of 10, and then hold a lottery at the gate? Only 10% of pax get to board but, hey, cheap fares!

By IDB'ing somebody, an airline expropriates (yes, expropriates) the value of a ticket to the passenger (minus the inadequate compensation). The only way to make this fair is by VDB'ing people at whatever compensation the market requires. Keep upping the offers. Too high? Stop overselling.

You do not go to a grocery store that sells for cheap but has a 1% chance of confiscating your goods at checkout, after you've paid, and giving you only 60% of what they were worth to you in the first place. Why would you accept that from an airline?

canopus27

This sounds right to me.

skybluesea

Could NOT have said this better - on March 26 decided to overnight in Nairobi enroute to Addis Ababa, rather than risk tight late night connection from Livingston. Headed to airport very early on morning of 27th with two boarding passes - one for Ethiopian, and the other for Kenya Airways - double-checked at airport which flight going first, and threw away other non-refundable ticket. Arrived in Addis on sched, went to my meeting, with time even for breakfast. My client is NOT paying for 2nd ticket, but allowed me peace of mind and good nights sleep - cost of sales on my part.

and CanadianCow is completely wrong about IDB - must be very careful NOT to incentivize airlines to make bad decisions to avoid such penalties, like dispatching aircraft that have faults. CC knows nothing about SMS in the aviation industry, subject which I teach, and a careful balance is required between ensuring customers are protected from fraudulent commercial practices, versus temptation of airlines in financial straights to short-cut safety. No inspection regime in the world can find every fault, and pressure by mgmt can create unreliable dispatch decisions - NOT saying this is happening at AC, just a matter of fact well known within the airline industry that this occurs when wrong policies are put in place.

And for someone like me past half way to 2017 AQD, I have NO problem with making significant payments for AC tickets that come with considerable flexibility - should everyone get this treatment when traveling once every few years...pretty simple, you get what you pay for...and AC Tariff is clear even SEMM like me don't get a guaranteed seat, and I understand and accept why.

And if it really matters that I get where I need to get to...well read the 1st para..

24left

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Regardless of what the airlines and the industry call this, expropriating is exactly what they have done. IMO.

And now, as more reports are coming in of people with paid tickets (eg. F full fare) literally being told after already in their seats, that they need to get up and get out because someone else more important is getting that seat, this will only get worse unless a better solution is found.

NO ONE disagrees with the challenges airlines face when equipment goes mechanical and needs to be swapped out and the same size isn't always available. NO ONE should misunderstand the challenges of weather or GDPs on scheduling.

But if the airlines that use IDBs as a business strategy and don't make changes (before governments get in the way), there will be a Charlton Heston moment and it won't end much better than this week's episode.