Adam Smith

If you get to know the concierges, you will know there are entitled, PITA SEs, and then there are people who are pleasant and who they actually enjoy seeing. Some SEs have very good relationships with concierges.

I would also point out that while the hourly cash wage is not very high, $16 an hour for a concierge is not directly comparable to $16 an hour at, say, McDonald's. Concierges are unionized, so they get health and pension benefits on top of that (and I believe they're still on a DB pension plan, which makes it tremendously valuable), plus all the travel benefits.

It's by no means the best-paying job out there, but there are plenty of worse ones.

RangerNS

Ability to deadhead anywhere AC flies is basically a FTers dream come true.

expert7700

I'm going to measure cost in concierge/hour/units for a bit.

Yesterday's announcement cost my family 1,875* concierge hours to maintain SE status post 2022

Deadhead as a concierge? How would they qualify for access to the concierge team?

//If anyone in my family worked for AC we'd be calling each other all the time "I'll be 15-20 hours late coming home tonight. Someone no-showed in J and I'd better fly round trip."

canadiancow

Uh... concierges don't deadhead.

RangerNS

OK then. Buddy pass or employee standby.

yyckerr

While I don’t have any “odd” requests of my own to share, I did get curious about this job posting and poked around the careers section of the AC website. I cannot believe that the Concierge job at YYZ pays $16/hr. $33K/yr.

willflyforfood

The $16/hour goes a long way to explaining the mindset at AC, i.e., let's put the lowest paid employees in charge of taking care of our most valuable, and arguably highest net-worth, clients.
As a business owner, it is painful to see nickel-and-diming at the absolute wrong place in the organizational model.

YOWgary

Blows my mind.

I have friends who are/were 5-star-hotel concierges, and while their base compensation wasn't enormous, they certainly weren't going home with $33k/yr.

canadiancow

I was under the impression you basically got hired as "airport agent", and then bid on the specific position you wanted. I certainly know people regularly move between general agent and concierge.

So I'm not surprised that the pay is listed as the same.

Adam Smith

You're wrong on a number of points there.

On base pay:

• Concierges aren't the lowest-paid employees. They make more than the check-in/gate agents and the call centre staff. They might be the best-paid front-line customer service staff in the company
• $16/hour is the starting wage, and it goes up with seniority. They get a bump every year they stick around.
• The base wage doesn't include overtime or shift premium for working holidays, late nights, weekends, etc.
• The bottom line is that the vast majority concierges working full time will be making far more than $33K a year ( @YOWgary )

On total compensation:

• This is a union job, which comes with excellent job security
• The health benefits and pension are much better than most positions with a similar level of base pay
• I say this with all due respect to the concierges, many of whom I know and value as people, but it's not a very high-skilled job. You don't need an advanced degree, or any degree at all, to work for AC as a concierge

Travel benefits and the airline industry in general:

• AC employees, including concierges, get access to significant flight benefits, which can be very valuable. Even though they mostly have to fly SBY, doing so (basically) for free is very attractive to many people
• Even though the passenger experience has been degraded, there's a certain level of glamour associated with the airline industry, and it often pays people less well as a result. This includes people at head office - I know people who have been at fairly senior roles at a certain airline in YYC, and even they generally were paid less than they could make in another industry

You bid on it, but AC has the discretion to pick who they want.

It's the same as a lead agent though, not every agent at the airport.

canadiancow

If you're bilingual (and not necessarily EN+FR), it's the same pay: https://careers.aircanada.com/jobs/7...ialist-airport

And I have a suspicion that if they actually have shortages, they'd take someone in YYZ who only spoke English.

Adam Smith

The agents don't have to be bilingual under the CBA. Maybe those who are get paid at the same rate as lead/concierges. But there are plenty of unilingual agents working check-in/gates.

Regardless, they're not paid better than concierges, so concierges can still be the best-paid front-line staff

willflyforfood

I beg to differ. You are in error for reading my post as a literal economic dissection of Air Canada's pay policies. I was speaking figuratively when I said 'lowest-paid', but as you can attest to below, it was also not far off,literally.
This is a thread dedicated specifically to the importance of AC Concierges, and the role they play in ensuring an EXCELLENT customer experience for the most valuable clients of the airline.
There is no thread discussing the importance of Rampies ($17.75/hour), Groomers ($15.20), or Call Centre Agents ($16.00).
Yes, Groomers are paid less than Concierges, and the same as AC and Aeroplan customer service agents, so concierges aren't literally the lowest-paid - but it's close!
Your error is taking my post literally. The position of concierge is crucial - otherwise why would airlines go to that additional expense? - and my post was merely pointing out that when you fail to pay up for excellent performance, you get middling performance. And the role of a concierge - be it in a hotel, cruise ship, or airline environment - must be treated as nothing less than vital to the overall success of the enterprise.
The posts in this thread run decidedly hot and cold with regards to AC Concierge effectiveness, pointing out the obvious failure in AC's recruiting, hiring, and retention for this important vocation.
And yes, the perks listed are to be considered. However, with ALL of those amazing perks - along with the obvious prestige of becoming an Air Canada Concierge - why would there be consistent, durable openings?

RangerNS

Its a large workforce. If AC concierges have 10% turnover (which is a low first pass guess from overall average labour stats) and they they have as few as 50 positions at YYZ (which is perhaps low), then they need 5 new people a year to keep steady.

I'm not sure an open position indicates anything except for a large labour force.

Adam Smith

You seem to ignore that the concierge job is a front-line customer service job. It requires minimal education, and no hard skills that take years to acquire (e.g. plumbing, electrical). It's not a sector that pays very well.

Is a rampie or groomer not "vital to the overall success of the enterprise"? If no one pushes the plane back, there will be no flight, and if the planes are never cleaned, surely no one would fly the airline (insert joke about AC's dirty aircraft). Cabin crew get paid a higher hourly wage, but only get paid from door close to brake set, so they don't make a lot of money either; are they not vital?

How much do you think concierges should make (base rate)? $25 an hour? $50 an hour? That's not the market for a job with this type of training/skill set.

AC has hundreds of concierges. Many of them are excellent. A few aren't. When you're hiring hundreds of people at dozens of locations, I'm not sure you can have 100% excellence, especially in a union position where it's very hard to get rid of poor performers.

YYZ has consistently been a problem for a while, and I can't answer why they've been unable to maintain a good standard of service there, but my experiences at YYC, YVR, YUL, and foreign stations (e.g. LGA, FRA, BRU) have generally been quite good.

So I disagree that AC has any systemic problem in hiring/retaining good staff in this area (outside of, perhaps, YYZ).

I concur with @RangerNS. There are lots of concierges with long tenures with AC and in the concierge position specifically (although a number of them did take attractive early retirement offers from AC during COVID).