"Glenn Must Go" bracelet!
#151
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SFO South Bay
Programs: UA 2MM
Posts: 3,052
Two points are well taken here.
1) Any UA employee who wears this bracelet during their work hours or while in uniform and representing the company can rightfully be told to remove it or face disciplinary action.
2) We all want one!
So, I have a solution for the AFA. Rather than give them to your members, give them to passengers!! The FAs will not face any disciplinary action, and I think it will make a MUCH more impressive point if customers are wearing bands that say Tilton must go.
So AFA: Hand over the bracelets!!!
1) Any UA employee who wears this bracelet during their work hours or while in uniform and representing the company can rightfully be told to remove it or face disciplinary action.
2) We all want one!
So, I have a solution for the AFA. Rather than give them to your members, give them to passengers!! The FAs will not face any disciplinary action, and I think it will make a MUCH more impressive point if customers are wearing bands that say Tilton must go.
So AFA: Hand over the bracelets!!!
Even if case law allows it, it would be inconceivable (once more, apologies to Princess Pride) for UA to do so. The publicity would be suicide.
#152
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: IAD-DCA
Programs: Won Kay
Posts: 1,324
Disagree. Board/management have repeatedly demonstrated their indifference to customers, it is all about the bottom line and negotiating an exit strategy with golden parachutes. Individual letters are laughable - I seriously doubt any will even be read short of a customer boycott (not endorsing the latter).
Poor CS is a direct result of managent's attitude. Contrast with excellent service providers like Nordstrom, DirecTV even WN - where good CS is a priority and is rewarded. When you outsource CS to India, that is a strong indicator that you don't give a **** about CS. Now of course employees are responsible for their own actions, but they will ususually choose the course endorsed by management.
Poor CS is a direct result of managent's attitude. Contrast with excellent service providers like Nordstrom, DirecTV even WN - where good CS is a priority and is rewarded. When you outsource CS to India, that is a strong indicator that you don't give a **** about CS. Now of course employees are responsible for their own actions, but they will ususually choose the course endorsed by management.
And yes, employees are responsible for their own actions. However, unless UA is like the team in "Major League" I doubt they have endorsed or otherwise told employees to provide poor customer service.
IMHO, employees who provide poor CS are just using it as an excuse to "get back" at management. That's a clue that you should get another job.
I don't think you can separate bad customer service and employees under attack. Motivated employees give good customer service, that is business 101 I learned a long time ago. Example, I headed out on my last trip relatively happy and ready for a good trip. First thing I hear when I get into operations, that our union is filing a grievance because United wantonly changed our contract with regards to health insurance and prescription drugs. We have a contract, yet they just change it whenever they want because they don't care. So before I even head out on my trip, I see I'm under attack again by United. Motivation? Woop, right out the window. It is just tiring being under assault continually.
From all the posts on FT lately about the UA management-employee dysfunction, I swear it sounds like a marriage where one spouse is beating the crap out of the other, and the other one won't try to escape.
#153
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SFO South Bay
Programs: UA 2MM
Posts: 3,052
Yes, in theory employees are free to go where they can get the best job and pay. Employers are free to hire those who provide the best value for the pay. Nice theory. But in reality, there are always switching costs. Many UA employees have dedicated their careers to UA. It is not so easy to switch careers when you are 40 or 50. Emotionally and financially, long term UA employees are somewhat stuck. So the 'love it our leave it' theory of employment needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
#154
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,123
You make the assumption that because a call center is operated outsiude the US, it can't provide good custmoer service - as if Americans have a lock on that.
And yes, employees are responsible for their own actions. However, unless UA is like the team in "Major League" I doubt they have endorsed or otherwise told employees to provide poor customer service.
IMHO, employees who provide poor CS are just using it as an excuse to "get back" at management. That's a clue that you should get another job.
If UA employees are "under attack" and are still hanging around, they must either love abuse or be the stupidest employees on the face of the earth.
From all the posts on FT lately about the UA management-employee dysfunction, I swear it sounds like a marriage where one spouse is beating the crap out of the other, and the other one won't try to escape.
And yes, employees are responsible for their own actions. However, unless UA is like the team in "Major League" I doubt they have endorsed or otherwise told employees to provide poor customer service.
IMHO, employees who provide poor CS are just using it as an excuse to "get back" at management. That's a clue that you should get another job.
If UA employees are "under attack" and are still hanging around, they must either love abuse or be the stupidest employees on the face of the earth.
From all the posts on FT lately about the UA management-employee dysfunction, I swear it sounds like a marriage where one spouse is beating the crap out of the other, and the other one won't try to escape.
#155
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: IAD-DCA
Programs: Won Kay
Posts: 1,324
I don't love abuse, as I wouldn't think anyone would. But I have been at United over 21 years, and GT has been here 5 years I think. Who should move on I ask? Management moves on and starts over somewhere else with million dollar salaries as a senior manager. I move on and start over as a FO somewhere at the bottom of another airline making $30,000 a year until I make captain again in 20 years. So it is not as simple as you make it, thus the push to rid the airline of the ONE person versus telling the other 50,000 people they need to move on.
I guess I just have to think that if UA employees are really "under attack" - if management is making decisions to intentionally harm or put employees under duress - then why would you stay? You can make more than $30K a year doing a lot of different flying jobs.
And imagine the response you would get if all of the employees at UA agreed that Tilton must go - or they do? Tell the board that if at some date certain he is not gone, then the airline will cease to exist because there won't be any employees.
I bet that would get their attention.
#156
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,123
I understand it is not easy to start over. But there is a difference to accepting a poor work environment for a few months and doing it for several years.
I guess I just have to think that if UA employees are really "under attack" - if management is making decisions to intentionally harm or put employees under duress - then why would you stay? You can make more than $30K a year doing a lot of different flying jobs.
And imagine the response you would get if all of the employees at UA agreed that Tilton must go - or they do? Tell the board that if at some date certain he is not gone, then the airline will cease to exist because there won't be any employees.
I bet that would get their attention.
I guess I just have to think that if UA employees are really "under attack" - if management is making decisions to intentionally harm or put employees under duress - then why would you stay? You can make more than $30K a year doing a lot of different flying jobs.
And imagine the response you would get if all of the employees at UA agreed that Tilton must go - or they do? Tell the board that if at some date certain he is not gone, then the airline will cease to exist because there won't be any employees.
I bet that would get their attention.
Last edited by aluminumdriver; Aug 27, 2008 at 8:17 pm
#157
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
Where can I get one of those orange "Tilton Must Go" wrist bands?
I've been chatting with the FAs of late, and I usually wind up mentioning my disgust with Glen Tilton, particularly for ignoring the givebacks by the FAs and pilots during the bankruptcy while taking an obscene bonus for himself. Needless to say, the FAs are not exactly disappointed with my opinion -- I've even had a couple mention it to the pilot and FO, which always earns me a friendly wave from the cockpit.
Of late, I've had some truly fantastic FAs -- how so few people can manage the beverage service on a completely full 737 and still provide excellent service to F on the short LAX/SFO run is amazing. I'd like to show my support by wearing one of those "Tilton Must Go" wrist bands. Does anyone know where I can get one?
Of late, I've had some truly fantastic FAs -- how so few people can manage the beverage service on a completely full 737 and still provide excellent service to F on the short LAX/SFO run is amazing. I'd like to show my support by wearing one of those "Tilton Must Go" wrist bands. Does anyone know where I can get one?
#158
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: IAD-DCA
Programs: Won Kay
Posts: 1,324
I've been chatting with the FAs of late, and I usually wind up mentioning my disgust with Glen Tilton, particularly for ignoring the givebacks by the FAs and pilots during the bankruptcy while taking an obscene bonus for himself. Needless to say, the FAs are not exactly disappointed with my opinion -- I've even had a couple mention it to the pilot and FO, which always earns me a friendly wave from the cockpit.
Of late, I've had some truly fantastic FAs -- how so few people can manage the beverage service on a completely full 737 and still provide excellent service to F on the short LAX/SFO run is amazing. I'd like to show my support by wearing one of those "Tilton Must Go" wrist bands. Does anyone know where I can get one?
Of late, I've had some truly fantastic FAs -- how so few people can manage the beverage service on a completely full 737 and still provide excellent service to F on the short LAX/SFO run is amazing. I'd like to show my support by wearing one of those "Tilton Must Go" wrist bands. Does anyone know where I can get one?
#159
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
#160
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 504
PTravel,
Roadkit's opinion is pretty well established re. the wristbands. IHO, they are unprofessional, offensive, and anyone wearing one should be fired.
I think he is actually GT himself since the company has sent letter a letter to the pilots actually threatening discipline (up to and including termination). What a bunch of punks! Anyway, my guess is that they don't have the stones to do that, but they might try if we actually handed them out to customers! I would ask you to not put them in that position...I know you wouldn't want to anyway. They are actually fairly hard to come by nowadays (supply and demand) so it's hard for any of us to get them.
I'm sure they appreciate you sharing you feelings and being supportive. I wouldn't hesitate to do that! Our (employee's and passengers) interests are way more aligned than most see. Stop in the cockpit to say hi to the pilots sometime. If we're not busy, the VAST majority really like to visit and talk with the passengers! It's just that it's hard to get out of the cockpit sometimes since we're usually on the radio coordinating one thing or another.
BTW, Thank You for your voice of reason and support!
Axl (UA Pilot)
#161
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SFO South Bay
Programs: UA 2MM
Posts: 3,052
PTravel,
Do what I did. Write a note to the UnitedAFA. I did and got one within about a week. Not sure if they are doing this broadly, though. I sent my note the day the bracelets came out.
[email protected]
Do what I did. Write a note to the UnitedAFA. I did and got one within about a week. Not sure if they are doing this broadly, though. I sent my note the day the bracelets came out.
[email protected]
#162
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
I think he is actually GT himself since the company has sent letter a letter to the pilots actually threatening discipline (up to and including termination). What a bunch of punks! Anyway, my guess is that they don't have the stones to do that, but they might try if we actually handed them out to customers! I would ask you to not put them in that position...I know you wouldn't want to anyway. They are actually fairly hard to come by nowadays (supply and demand) so it's hard for any of us to get them.
I'm sure they appreciate you sharing you feelings and being supportive. I wouldn't hesitate to do that! Our (employee's and passengers) interests are way more aligned than most see. Stop in the cockpit to say hi to the pilots sometime. If we're not busy, the VAST majority really like to visit and talk with the passengers! It's just that it's hard to get out of the cockpit sometimes since we're usually on the radio coordinating one thing or another.
BTW, Thank You for your voice of reason and support!
PTravel,
Do what I did. Write a note to the UnitedAFA. I did and got one within about a week. Not sure if they are doing this broadly, though. I sent my note the day the bracelets came out.
[email protected]
Do what I did. Write a note to the UnitedAFA. I did and got one within about a week. Not sure if they are doing this broadly, though. I sent my note the day the bracelets came out.
[email protected]
Last edited by iluv2fly; Sep 1, 2008 at 2:10 pm Reason: merge
#163
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,172
I got mine!
I'm just completing a flight as I write this - looking down at my orange GGG bracelet on my wrist! I was chatting up the FAs, talking about how much of a disgrace it all was. I also mentioned that I was *cough cough* the dedicated UAL flyer and FT user who "broke" the bracelet story - and that now everyone was clamoring for one! I mentioned that I had mailed the AFA, with no response and nothing in the mail as of yet (though it was only a week ago). One helpful FA said she'd talk to the pilots.
Lo and behold - she came back with with a bracelet! Guess they have a few spare ones in their bags. I will be sure to give a GTEM to the cockpit occupants as I deplane!
Lo and behold - she came back with with a bracelet! Guess they have a few spare ones in their bags. I will be sure to give a GTEM to the cockpit occupants as I deplane!
#164
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Not at home
Programs: MP
Posts: 2,312
They sure are getting around! My friend said several of his pax in F had the wristbands! ^
#165
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: BUR
Programs: UA 1MM, DL former Gold, AA, SPG, HH Gold, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 884
I want one too!!! I think this is an absolutely appropriate form of getting the message out. I am solidly with axl and the other UA employees in this matter. Even airline employees (and employees in other service professions) are people and not service robots without feelings. If you don't like that, then don't buy services from companies that use humans to deliver the services.