May 1, 2021, 4:06 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
This is an archive thread, the active thread is "Dynamic Award Pricing" by UA; questions, experiences, .... {Archive}
The details:
Award travel updates
Introducing a broader range of award prices
Updates to award travel are on the horizon. For flights on or after November 15, 2019, we’ll no longer publish an award chart listing the set amount of miles needed for each flight.The details:
- Some award prices will be lower than what’s currently published in our chart. You may have already seen these prices, and you’ll be able to get them immediately.
- Other award prices may be higher than what you see today, especially if you’re traveling at a popular time. These prices will take effect immediately for travel November 15 or after.
- Starting November 15, we’re removing close-in fees, so you won’t be charged the extra fee of up to $75 for booking last-minute award travel.
- A flexible award travel calendar is available on united.com or in our app.
Frequently Asked Questions
What is changing?
For travel on or after November 15, we will no longer publish an award chart listing the set amount of miles needed for award flights. Award pricing will now fluctuate based on a variety of factors, including demand. Additionally, starting November 15, we will no longer charge a fee of up to $75 for award flights booked within 21 days of departure.When will these updates take effect?
The award pricing changes apply immediately to flights on or after November 15, 2019. Until then, award prices will be the same as or lower than what’s currently published in our award chart.How many miles will I need for award travel after November 15?
Award prices will now fluctuate based on a variety of factors. Some air awards will be available for less than what’s listed in our chart, which you may have already noticed. After November 15, award prices may also be higher, especially if you’re traveling at popular times. Use our flexible award calendar to get a monthly view of the award prices for a specific destination.Why are you making these changes?
Increasing award prices for the most in-demand flights allows us to offer better returns for our shareholders. If your award travel is flexible, these updates will help you make the most of your miles.How will these updates affect award travel availability?
United MileagePlus members with Premier® status and qualifying United Chase Cardmembers can continue to book award travel without blackout dates. For other members, most award flights that are available today will continue to be available after these updates take effect.Do the lowest-priced awards have any extra flight restrictions?
No. Our lowest priced awards do not have any added restrictions; the fare rules for all award travel apply.How can I find the lowest priced award for my travel?
The award calendar on united.com or in our app will continue to show the lowest available price for your destination.Will I earn miles on my flight if I book an award?
No. As with current award bookings, award travel in the future will not be eligible to earn miles with MileagePlus or any other loyalty program.What if I need to change my existing award?
If you need to change your award ticket, you will be issued a new ticket for which new pricing and additional fees may apply.What if I purchase a close-in award before November 15
The close-in booking fee will still apply to all tickets booked within 21 days of departure prior to November 15, 2019. We will not refund fees paid prior to November 15, even if travel occurs on or after November 15.
"Dynamic Award Pricing" by UA; questions, experiences, .... {Archive}
Apr 6, 2019, 7:38 am
#631
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Chicago: ORD, MDW
Programs: United Million Mile Flyer, Hilton Silver, Marriott Gold, DL, AA WN
Posts: 514
Another devaluation! No matter what spin United puts on this announcement, we all know that most of us will not be better off as loyal customers. We might as well get used to it. United and Delta (soon, we are sure to be followed by American) are doing this because they can. We have protested about "changes you will like" in the past. There have even been lawsuits against previous changes which ultimately did no good for the frequent flyer. If we want to play this game, we have to play by their rules.
I have been retired for a few years now - after having flown with United since the creation of Mileage Plus in 1981. I am grateful for my Million Mile Gold status (which I am sure one day will eventually be revised to lower benefits again), but until then, I have been trying to use my accumulated cache to purchase upgrades (not usually successful) or for one or two more business class trips to Europe - which also might soon be out of reach.
So far, all of United's attempts to get me to use miles for non-airline trip awards have been unsuccessful. I wonder...
Apr 6, 2019, 7:46 am
#632
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BOS
Programs: UA 1K (2MM); AA LT Gold (1.9 MM); SQ; WN; DL; "Bonvoy Ambassador""
Posts: 398
Agreed. As others have mentioned, credit cards have been a huge part of the problem. Free bags, priority boarding, and the often too generous massive amounts of points handed out as bonuses. WIth so many extra points floating around, it's no wonder airlines want you to burn that liability as quickly as possible. As somebody that travels weekly, it has been frustrating watching the programs getting less and less valuable. I have to admit that I get a little upset when I see non-frequent travelers getting these perks that were once reserved for true road warriors. Lounges flooded, upgrades sold off to the highest bidder, you name it.
Last edited by BeanTownBoy; Apr 6, 2019 at 7:53 am
Apr 6, 2019, 8:12 am
#633
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 23,057
It's reported as a liability under frequent flyer deferred revenue. I'm quite sure Chase would have some questions to ask if there were significant changes made to this value.
Last edited by xliioper; Apr 6, 2019 at 12:56 pm
Apr 6, 2019, 8:20 am
#634
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Bucks County
Programs: UAL GS & Million Miler; Delta Lifetime Gold; Hilton Diamond; Marriott Platinum; Legion Etrangere
Posts: 1,609
DL has shown in this decade that if you run a quality airline, you can run a garbage FFP in parallel and it won't cause you harm. UA is nowhere near the point (reputationally or operationally) where people will choose to fly United in spite of a laughingstock FFP. MP has historically been the glue that kept profitable customers attached to a mediocre airline. Now that glue is being torched away.
Sure, at a macro level all travel loyalty programs deal with hyperinflation caused by their own mismanagement, e.g. huge CC bonuses. When there's too much of any currency in circulation, its value naturally sinks. The airlines and card issuers are terrible, stupid currency managers in this regard -- they pump more miles / points into their FF-spheres knowing they can never be redeemed / spent as they have encouraged consumers to anticipate.
The managers have no choice but to devalue the currency, and now in UA's case actually conceal its value, even though the outcome might be wholesale loss of faith and a currency "crash." (Every currency, from the pound sterling to Expedia Rewards points, runs on the faith and belief of its owners. No faith, no value.) A 60,000-mile signup bonus sounds great to rubes, but in this new world it might not be enough to get you from Buffalo to Boston in January.
The more customers discern that and say the hell with it, the more trouble UA, Chase, Amex, etc. are in.
Sure, at a macro level all travel loyalty programs deal with hyperinflation caused by their own mismanagement, e.g. huge CC bonuses. When there's too much of any currency in circulation, its value naturally sinks. The airlines and card issuers are terrible, stupid currency managers in this regard -- they pump more miles / points into their FF-spheres knowing they can never be redeemed / spent as they have encouraged consumers to anticipate.
The managers have no choice but to devalue the currency, and now in UA's case actually conceal its value, even though the outcome might be wholesale loss of faith and a currency "crash." (Every currency, from the pound sterling to Expedia Rewards points, runs on the faith and belief of its owners. No faith, no value.) A 60,000-mile signup bonus sounds great to rubes, but in this new world it might not be enough to get you from Buffalo to Boston in January.
The more customers discern that and say the hell with it, the more trouble UA, Chase, Amex, etc. are in.
Apr 6, 2019, 8:23 am
#635
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Montréal, Canada
Posts: 1,610
]
I would rather suffer with an unappealing FFP than endure a prolonged economic turndown. Bargain awards won't be as attractive when one is unemployed or has a diminished 401K or RRSP investment.
I would rather suffer with an unappealing FFP than endure a prolonged economic turndown. Bargain awards won't be as attractive when one is unemployed or has a diminished 401K or RRSP investment.
Apr 6, 2019, 8:24 am
#636
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 1,230
Forget about 2% I get 3.5 for travel & dining and 2.625% for all other spend on BOA card by having 100K of assets with them. Beats ANY mileage card any day !
Apr 6, 2019, 8:33 am
#637
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 710
I think there is a lot of dream thinking about airline mileage programs. It's helpful to keep in mind that these programs were created when airlines were flying 60% load factors and the seats being given away were essentially cost free to the airline. The airlines benefited from business travelers being able to steer their individual travel towards a preferred airline. Once the airlines figured out how to fly 95%+ load factors, upgrade and mileage seats represent a revenue loss to the airline. Corporations have gotten far smarter about controlling how their employees select flights, so the idea of a "loyalty" benefit to the airline is essentially non-existent. Sales of miles to credit card companies are a major revenue stream now, so those seats have to be priced at a level that compares with direct sales.
Personally, I think this is a good thing. I never sign up for grocery or gas cards. My life is far too busy to keep track of such things. Not happy with the privacy implications of such accounts and the "rewards" aren't worth it. When I buy an airplane ticket, it's based on who offers the best price, schedule and equipment, as it should be. Would I sign up for a credit card to get miles? No way - why take the haircut on airline ticket purchase with miles. Give me the cash back from the card transactions and let me directly buy the ticket I want.
Personally, I think this is a good thing. I never sign up for grocery or gas cards. My life is far too busy to keep track of such things. Not happy with the privacy implications of such accounts and the "rewards" aren't worth it. When I buy an airplane ticket, it's based on who offers the best price, schedule and equipment, as it should be. Would I sign up for a credit card to get miles? No way - why take the haircut on airline ticket purchase with miles. Give me the cash back from the card transactions and let me directly buy the ticket I want.
Apr 6, 2019, 9:07 am
#638
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,624
Twice I redeemed UA miles for LH F, once at 67.5k and last summer at 110k. Each time I told myself "Yes, it's expensive, but it's not going to get any cheaper." The 67.5k trip was followed within less than a year by a major devaluation. Now I'll be 2 for 2 on getting in under the wire on these redemptions.
Southwest points are worth a flat 1.4 cents, but they allow you to book a fully refundable trip at the non-refundable price. That's the value proposition.
I never thought I would redeem my UR points for Rapid Rewards points, but that's now looking like the best value. For international coach, I will use Google flights to notify me of good cash fares and book those trips at 1.5 cents per point via CSR. I will miss international premium class but I will not miss the hours and hours spent hunting scarce saver seats.
I've paid my last annual fee for a United Visa. There may be a Southwest Visa in my future, purely for the 50k redeemable points (the current in-flight offer).
The experience with Delta, Southwest, JefBlue and others suggest that people find value in the credit cards even in a relatively fixed value system. Delta has seen a lot of growth in their credit cards over the past few years - I would assume it is by far the most popular airline credit card program. The cards offer companion passes, lounge access, pay with miles flexibility, etc. Delta also lets you upgrade with points, pay for drinks with points, etc. Customers evidentially find these redemption options attractive.
I never thought I would redeem my UR points for Rapid Rewards points, but that's now looking like the best value. For international coach, I will use Google flights to notify me of good cash fares and book those trips at 1.5 cents per point via CSR. I will miss international premium class but I will not miss the hours and hours spent hunting scarce saver seats.
I've paid my last annual fee for a United Visa. There may be a Southwest Visa in my future, purely for the 50k redeemable points (the current in-flight offer).
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Apr 6, 2019 at 11:49 am Reason: merging consecutive posts by same member
Apr 6, 2019, 10:08 am
#639
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: BUR / LAX
Programs: UA MM/Gold; WN A-list; HH something depending; Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,552
Maybe me in a weird way. I've used UA miles exclusively for international dream trips in business. Domestic, I'll just redeem Southwest miles or pay for a UA or Southwest ticket and be done.
Apr 6, 2019, 10:11 am
#640
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 710
I've accrued over 500K miles that I'd like to use for a couple of J tickets to the UK, but the redemption rate has been raised so high that I haven't been able to use them.
Apr 6, 2019, 10:25 am
#641
Join Date: Mar 2012
Programs: Mileage Plus 1K; Marriott Platinum; Hilton Gold
Posts: 6,355
Apr 6, 2019, 10:33 am
#642
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: LAX
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, AA EXP, Hilton Diamond, Wyndham Diamond, DL PM, Marriott Platinum, IHG Platinum
Posts: 1,305
A few years ago I shifted my spend away from co-branded credit cards (e.g. Chase's UA Club Visa) to bank point ones (e.g. Sapphire Reserve, AX Plat) to escape being held hostage to a specific loyalty program and whatever changes they decide to make.
Points earned in UR / MR / etc. remain flexible and carry a par value of sorts. Plus with cheap F fares being what they are, using points to have the bank just buy you the flights you want often cost about the same in terms of points as redeeming an award.
Anyways the takeaway for me is to drop the co-branded financial products in favor of those that earn a point that can be transferred to multiple partners or cashed out.
Points earned in UR / MR / etc. remain flexible and carry a par value of sorts. Plus with cheap F fares being what they are, using points to have the bank just buy you the flights you want often cost about the same in terms of points as redeeming an award.
Anyways the takeaway for me is to drop the co-branded financial products in favor of those that earn a point that can be transferred to multiple partners or cashed out.
Apr 6, 2019, 10:55 am
#643
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: IAH/EWR-LGA/MIA
Programs: UA Global Services 3.2 MM, Marriott Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium Elite, AA Exec Plat
Posts: 2,505
I'm around 2.65 M lifetime UA miles and will probably slog through with United and the Chase MileagePlus Club Card for a couple of more years to get to 3 M, then re-assess. Or should I switch now to AMEX Plat or Chase Sapphire Reserve even if I'll still be flying mostly all UA for a couple of more years? (Not as savvy with the CC's as I should be ...)
Apr 6, 2019, 11:22 am
#645
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 710
No - just commenting that UA has effectively raised the miles required for international J to the UK by not releasing any Saver seats. The suggestion above to look at partners was good. There do seem to be Swiss and TAP J seats open in the fall for 70K each way. Not a fan of the extra stop, but if that's what it takes.