Incident w/ pro tennis player, too many carryon items/oversized bag & "aggressive GA"
Jun 11, 2017, 7:42 pm
#166
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ummm, what department of the govt do you think the FAA is in? Department of Transpirtation, or as I said upthread, the DoT. The FAA IS a subcategory of the DoT. Between the previous false statement about the DoT having nothing to do with size regulations (wrong) and now this, I'm curios what information you are using to draw your conclusions from. It's bad info.
read the headline. Who does the fining for violations to airlines? Oh wow, the DoT! The man announcing it? The Secretary of Transportation, not the FAA administrator. Imagine that. Oh wait no need to imagine, that's what I said, and I explained how it works. Both were called into question. No need to question my facts. Opinions, sure, but not my facts. They're fact based. https://www.google.com/amp/amp.usatoday.com/story/89530300/
Last edited by fastair; Jun 11, 2017 at 7:57 pm
Jun 11, 2017, 7:59 pm
#167
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ummm, what department of the govt do you think the FAA is in? Department of Transpirtation, or as I said upthread, the DoT. The FAA IS a subcategory of the DoT. Between the previous false statement about the DoT having nothing to do with size regulations (wrong) and now this, I'm curios what information you are using to draw your conclusions from. It's bad info.
Jun 11, 2017, 8:09 pm
#168
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There's literally no reading of the Facebook posts that resembles the facts you posted. She had two carry-ons, one of which contained a smaller bag. She also describes how the Flight Attendant manipulated the bag to make it appear larger in the sizer.
There's no excuse for the UA agent's behavior here.
There's no excuse for the UA agent's behavior here.
..and where did the THIRD RED BAG GO ?..the one on her Facebook page (one of several photos posted).
Jun 11, 2017, 8:17 pm
#169
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But it has to happen to an asian doesn't it...typical UA.
Jun 11, 2017, 9:10 pm
#170
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the fines for violations are issued by the DoT. This is what we are referencing. https://www.transportation.gov/briefing-room/american-airlines-fined-16-million-violating-tarmac-delay-rule note, it's on Transportation dot gov, not faa dot gov, and the body clearly states who is assessing these penalties. These are DoT items
Jun 11, 2017, 9:30 pm
#171
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There is a photo of the bag IN THE SIZER. Why in gods name would you want to look at a close up picture of the bag (which makes it look big) standing up? I could take a picture of my standard roll-away that would make it look HUGE! 
But unless you goal is to try to confuse people, and make UA look better, the picture in the sizer is what matters.
This bag was slightly longer, and slightly narrower than the typical roll-away. It was not a hug gym bag, a hiking back back, or a bigger 10x16-17x24 bag (which is allowed by SWA, Alaska/VX, F9, Sun Country) all of which I think most/all agents would call out.
And by the way, I want to stress that OALs, including airlines that are all Boeing (SWA, Alaska) allow larger roll-away bags. There is no issue fitting them in the overheads, and this players bag would have fit easily.
I see no indication that the bag in the sizer is anything but her bag in the sizer. It is not after she "unpacked" the bag. But I agree with you generally, I would have said 2" more than the sizer, but given that the bottom on the bag is very thin, this will fit into an overhead bin exactly like a regular carry on roll-away would, due to the curvature of the bins i.e. take up no more space.
This is a good example where you either believe (1) rules must be followed to the letter, even if enforcing the rules provides no actual benefit to anyone, or (2) you ask the purpose of the rule is met by a hard and fast following of the rule.
I would expect most GAs to reject a 10x17x24 roll-away bag (I have one, bought to use on VX/AS flights, but would not try to use on UA/DL, I would just check it, or bring my typical 22" bag) or huge duffle bags, but view it as very very bad customer service to demand a flyer (particularly a 1K) gate check fragile sports equipment that is basically of legal size, and would fit normally in the overhead bins.
But unless you goal is to try to confuse people, and make UA look better, the picture in the sizer is what matters.This bag was slightly longer, and slightly narrower than the typical roll-away. It was not a hug gym bag, a hiking back back, or a bigger 10x16-17x24 bag (which is allowed by SWA, Alaska/VX, F9, Sun Country) all of which I think most/all agents would call out.
And by the way, I want to stress that OALs, including airlines that are all Boeing (SWA, Alaska) allow larger roll-away bags. There is no issue fitting them in the overheads, and this players bag would have fit easily.
I see no indication that the bag in the sizer is anything but her bag in the sizer. It is not after she "unpacked" the bag. But I agree with you generally, I would have said 2" more than the sizer, but given that the bottom on the bag is very thin, this will fit into an overhead bin exactly like a regular carry on roll-away would, due to the curvature of the bins i.e. take up no more space.
This is a good example where you either believe (1) rules must be followed to the letter, even if enforcing the rules provides no actual benefit to anyone, or (2) you ask the purpose of the rule is met by a hard and fast following of the rule.
I would expect most GAs to reject a 10x17x24 roll-away bag (I have one, bought to use on VX/AS flights, but would not try to use on UA/DL, I would just check it, or bring my typical 22" bag) or huge duffle bags, but view it as very very bad customer service to demand a flyer (particularly a 1K) gate check fragile sports equipment that is basically of legal size, and would fit normally in the overhead bins.
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...31&oe=59A6002D
She had 3 bags vs 2 permitted.
UA is pretty clear and generous you can bring a tennis bag with rackets and balls inside, no size limit - just that ONLY rackets and balls can be inside.
She gamed the system by putting an extra bag inside.
Her choice - check one of the three bags.
She carried on the backpack and shoulder bag with rackets and checked the red bag with we don't know what else was inside.
Rackets made it safely.
Fact is she tried to bring 3 bags on board.
Jun 11, 2017, 9:37 pm
#172
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so does this manditory retraining basicly state "take our published rules and do the opposite. Let early boarders bring anything on and check small bags of those that board late"? That is the outcome of your suggestions. I highly doubt the DoT would ignore that for very long before fines by bucketload started being issued
So you need wonder why this GA is hassling this particular passenger, let alone someone with 1K status. How much you want to bet that there must have been at least one other passenger of on this flight with a similar sized bag or mini-roller that boarded without a word from this GA? Why was this bag an issue on this particular flight rather than the countless other times this pax has flown with United with the same bags? So why is this GA deviating from common procedure and suddenly enforcing this rule so strictly? Well seasoned travelers know the rules better than your average once-a-year flier, so I have a hard time believing the pax is at fault here.
As I mentioned in my previous post, the common procedure for running out of overhead bin space is to gate check a pax traveling in economy with no status and in the last one or two boarding groups, despite every major airline having the baggage size restrictions
Jun 11, 2017, 11:32 pm
#173
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http://nextshark.com/zhang-shuai-chi...ited-airlines/
I keep thinking I might switch to UA, but apparently they still don't care about customer service.
this link includes a photo of the UA GA who allegedly was treating the Pro Tennis star poorly.
So nope. Good luck to you all. Wear a helmet when flying UA.
I keep thinking I might switch to UA, but apparently they still don't care about customer service.
this link includes a photo of the UA GA who allegedly was treating the Pro Tennis star poorly.
So nope. Good luck to you all. Wear a helmet when flying UA.
Jun 12, 2017, 1:31 am
#174
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Funny thing is that LCCs who have even stricter baggage rules have fewer or no high profile incidents, and usually provide some leeway.
To all the people quoting and bolding UA rules, please give me a break. I have had family members without any status travel with overstuffed mini-roller that clearly would not fit in the sizer, yet were allowed on many flights without a single word.
It's not like the boarding will devolve into chaos if a passenger has a slightly larger bag, let alone loyal high status passengers who are responsible for a bulk of UA's revenue. If overhead bin space is an issue, gate check some economy passenger's bag. Rest assured, that tennis bag would easily fit in the overhead bin.
UA needs to have mandatory retraining and weed out these disrespectful power-tripping FAs/GAs.
To all the people quoting and bolding UA rules, please give me a break. I have had family members without any status travel with overstuffed mini-roller that clearly would not fit in the sizer, yet were allowed on many flights without a single word.
It's not like the boarding will devolve into chaos if a passenger has a slightly larger bag, let alone loyal high status passengers who are responsible for a bulk of UA's revenue. If overhead bin space is an issue, gate check some economy passenger's bag. Rest assured, that tennis bag would easily fit in the overhead bin.
UA needs to have mandatory retraining and weed out these disrespectful power-tripping FAs/GAs.
Jun 12, 2017, 2:24 am
#176
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You missed another photo
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...31&oe=59A6002D
She had 3 bags vs 2 permitted.
UA is pretty clear and generous you can bring a tennis bag with rackets and balls inside, no size limit - just that ONLY rackets and balls can be inside.
She gamed the system by putting an extra bag inside.
Her choice - check one of the three bags.
She carried on the backpack and shoulder bag with rackets and checked the red bag with we don't know what else was inside.
Rackets made it safely.
Fact is she tried to bring 3 bags on board.
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...31&oe=59A6002D
She had 3 bags vs 2 permitted.
UA is pretty clear and generous you can bring a tennis bag with rackets and balls inside, no size limit - just that ONLY rackets and balls can be inside.
She gamed the system by putting an extra bag inside.
Her choice - check one of the three bags.
She carried on the backpack and shoulder bag with rackets and checked the red bag with we don't know what else was inside.
Rackets made it safely.
Fact is she tried to bring 3 bags on board.
"As well, a pro tennis player is obviously very protective of their racquets and wants them under their own control, with them, not lost or smashed around by baggage handlers. Its not the money, its the loss of control over their the fragile tool of her trade. I don't blame her one bit for being upset! Or the classical violinist who got lightly mugged recently by a United employee for taking her very valuable violin into the United cabin. Your comment seems reasonable at first glance but actually its poorly thought out. The problems at United are real! They need this medicine!"-Rocky Bande
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Jun 12, 2017 at 3:14 am Reason: Discuss the issues, not the poster(s);merging consecutive posts by same member
Jun 12, 2017, 3:25 am
#177
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 57,601
You missed another photo
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...31&oe=59A6002D
She had 3 bags vs 2 permitted.
UA is pretty clear and generous you can bring a tennis bag with rackets and balls inside, no size limit - just that ONLY rackets and balls can be inside.
She gamed the system by putting an extra bag inside.
Her choice - check one of the three bags.
She carried on the backpack and shoulder bag with rackets and checked the red bag with we don't know what else was inside.
Rackets made it safely.
Fact is she tried to bring 3 bags on board.
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...31&oe=59A6002D
She had 3 bags vs 2 permitted.
UA is pretty clear and generous you can bring a tennis bag with rackets and balls inside, no size limit - just that ONLY rackets and balls can be inside.
She gamed the system by putting an extra bag inside.
Her choice - check one of the three bags.
She carried on the backpack and shoulder bag with rackets and checked the red bag with we don't know what else was inside.
Rackets made it safely.
Fact is she tried to bring 3 bags on board.
Don't like the rule? Check your bags or fly another airline.
Jun 12, 2017, 3:48 am
#178
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Don't know how this got twisted from 2 (1 back pack + 1 tennis bag with rackets) to 3 bags to 7 items....but anyways....
Jun 12, 2017, 4:15 am
#179
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 25
It's pretty simple actually....
Here are the rules - stand up for your rights under the rules you agreed to under the contract of carriage airlines so gladly refer to when it serves THEIR agenda, make ONE polite request to be heard, then call a supervisor, then call security with the sole purpose to have the incident documented.
Then insist on not boarding based on the refusal of the airline employee to abide by the rules under the contract, contact the airline through their call center (1K line should be a solid choice) and let them know they are about to be held liable for their actions. Give them an opportunity to fix it, then sue with a vengeance. Hire the biggest baddest law firm and not your family attorney for that final part. One that smells blood in the water and bites off a big chunk of the airline's butt. Yup, I said it!
Here are the rules on United.com:
"United accepts one item of tennis equipment as checked baggage or carry-on baggage. An item of tennis equipment consists of one tennis racket case containing tennis rackets and balls."
Sad it has come this far... oh, and I am not a member of the legal profession, just tired of a handful of a-hole employees and managers doing their very best to screw up an otherwise decent product.
This is applies to all other airlines as well, not just United by the way 😎
Then insist on not boarding based on the refusal of the airline employee to abide by the rules under the contract, contact the airline through their call center (1K line should be a solid choice) and let them know they are about to be held liable for their actions. Give them an opportunity to fix it, then sue with a vengeance. Hire the biggest baddest law firm and not your family attorney for that final part. One that smells blood in the water and bites off a big chunk of the airline's butt. Yup, I said it!
Here are the rules on United.com:
"United accepts one item of tennis equipment as checked baggage or carry-on baggage. An item of tennis equipment consists of one tennis racket case containing tennis rackets and balls."
Sad it has come this far... oh, and I am not a member of the legal profession, just tired of a handful of a-hole employees and managers doing their very best to screw up an otherwise decent product.
This is applies to all other airlines as well, not just United by the way 😎
Jun 12, 2017, 5:58 am
#180
Join Date: Apr 2017
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She had a third bag within the red tennis bag. With everything in there (and even without) this bag was too big for the sizer. She then removed the contents and placed the red bag in the sizer.... Still too big, and now with it emptied she has 3 bags and each racket counts as a separate item except for one which UA generously allows in addition to the normal allowance. 3 bags + 5 rackets - 1 racket = 7 items.
I mean really, this isn't difficult.