NH_Clark

Actually, I would suggest that Oscar has been a great hire for UA. I know former CO employees and CO fanboys still are struggling with it but he has been the reason why UA is recovering from the Smi$ek era.. and is still trying to undo some of the disastrous decisions made during that time.

br2k

Perhaps people have a stronger reaction to physical brutalization of a human than they do to causing financial damage, no matter how grave. I think there is some logic in that.

croints

The difference is between a spouse taking half your money versus one beating you in front of your kids.

s0ssos

Did you not see the Munoz statement? He supports UA's employees.
Does he not represent the workforce/operation/business of UA?

NH_Clark

I think it's the victim-psychology coupled with a mob-mentality fostered by social-media. The feigned "omg what a horror" and the internet's ability to give anyone/everyone a soap-box to vent their self-perceived slights/injustices without having to know the truth or the detail.

kjranabargar

I believe it will be very difficult for United to win back customers, especially HVF's like myself. I was a very loyal United customer for over 10 years amassing 1.7M lifetime flight miles. Majority of that experience was prior to the merger with Continental. I tolerated the "devaluation" of 1K status and too many MX delays & cancellations to count for about 2 years after the merger. Let's not forget about the IT "integration" debacle either. Objectively, I will not fly United anymore for the following reasons:
1) They do not value my business, even as a HVF (my spend averages $50-90k per year consistently).
2) Most importantly, United is not reliable - I have low confidence that I'll get to my destination on-time (I primarily do transcon & international routes). There is a separate thread here on FT each year for "consolidated delayed/cancelled flights" for United. I don't believe you'll see those threads on Delta or AA (if they are there, they certainly don't have the volume of posts United does for sure). It is shocking the frequency and length of MX delays and cancellations are, especially on wide-body long haul aircraft. I had one debacle shortly before I decided to pull the plug completely on United where I was stuck for over 48 hours in Shannon Ireland due to a MX issue. Root cause for the length of that delay was money pure and simple - it was cheaper for United to piss off 250+ people than it was to fly in a replacement aircraft (which they ended up needing to do in the end).

I made the switch to AA about 3 years ago and frankly didn't expect much difference in overall service, but I am MUCH more satisfied with AA. Maybe it has been just luck, but I've experienced minimal MX delays, ground and flight crew seem to be happier / definitely treat passengers better, and AA management does value HVF's. I get calls on a regular basis to ensure I'm happy with the airline. When I left United, my spend dropped off the map and frankly I expected some sort of follow up to ask why. That NEVER happened.

Chevelter

This.

BearX220

It's the fact that video exists. It's the drama of the moment, focused on a single victim. It's the tangible nature of the attack. There's no video of evil Wells Fargo execs slamming customers into phony accounts -- and no pictures of WF customers reacting. No screams. No blood. No horrified onlookers going, "Oh my God!"

As a company that operates in public, UA ought to know anything out of the ordinary is liable to be captured on smartphone video. Just more evidence the airline still thinks it's operating in an analog world where it controls its own brand and narrative.

The Flight 3411 tape could end up being UA's Zapruder film. A pivotal moment in company history captured forever.

This story also "lights up the Internet" because it crystallizes the vague, long-running United brand narrative: that it's a brutal, indifferent, unscrupulous airline that strategizes against its customers and treats them as, in the FAs' own phrase, "self-loading cargo." That storyline's been out there for years. The assault video sort of confirms it and makes it real.

Halloweverybody

the only logical solution is mandatory body cameras for gate agents

misdirected baggage

Not sure about the analogy.

Not to diminish what happened at ORD, the fallout from Wells was horrendous. Many people could not get credit, homes, cars - even jobs were affected. Yet, it wasn't dramatic enough to capture on 3 minutes of video.

Psychology studies find that people overreact to dramatic events. We use those results when trading stocks. While the ensuing social media storm about a dramatic event at UA may be justified, it's dwarfed by the carnage left by a slow-moving scandal that derailed a lot of lives - one that everyone seems to yawn about.

Just my 2 cents...

kavok

The Rosa Parks comparison is completely valid.

Both situations involved an individual who violated the law in refusing to give up their seat on a transit vehicle. Both were "escorted" off by police at the request of the transiting agency. It wasn't just a belief that Ms. Parks had to give up her seat, it was the law at the time.

bo1953

Okay, if YOU want to make that comparison, so be it. I stick to my thesis and history.

The law at this time is not targeted to one group of people, it is targeted to any passenger whose seat is needed or deemed required to transport.

This law is not based, or so I believe, on a specific set/group of individuals and can be applied to any passenger, paying or not.

Safe travels.

rwSEA

There are really two issues here that need to be addressed:

1) Errors and incompetence made by UA that could have been avoided if the gate agents knew about the deadheading crew before boarding the rest of the plane. IDB at the gate is unpleasant, but better than when you are already seated. At the gate there is also a lot less transparency to the how and why then when you are on board. Better to be IDBd because "we sold too many seats" rather than IDBd because "some of our employees need the seat we sold you".

2) Although UA called the police/rent-a-cops/TSA/whatever they were, the 'security' are responsible for the totally unreasonable use of force, the bleeding, the screaming, etc. UA is complicit in that, but at the same time, these so-called security people must be held accountable.

If I was running UA, I would apologize profusely for the communication, system, etc. problems that led to the first issue and led to a situation where there was no other choice than to avoid pulling pax off. But I would then be sure to throw these so-called police under the bus for escalating this beyond what is reasonable and hold them personally accountable for the assault.

FlyerTom111

Even Lexington might have worked. Maybe someone is halfway between Louisville and Lexington and would take the comp and a Lexington flight.

caverunner17

So what? Stocks go up and down all the time as does their market cap. Go back 3 weeks and UAL was at $65.28 after being up to almost $76 the prior month.

A few percentage point drop in a stock price doesn't mean much of anything. We're basically back at the same level as last Wednesday.