With rising cases just across the channel, rushing to open up travel would be unwise. Do we really want another wave, more deaths and another lockdown? I don’t. I know you and few others would simply go berserk if that happened.

the point of the article is there is immunity so we won’t be affected by new waves. Why do you think cases aren’t going up despite doing so in Europe? Every time this happened in the past we were hit hard.

we are testing millions of people a day yet cases are barely at 5000

with the false positives of rapid tests at that rate cases would never fall below 1000 a day even if Covid didn’t exist anymore !

Yes, at around 50% of people that currently leaves around 30 million with no immunity. That is quite a large pool of non-immune people which the infection could spread through if cases start rising again.

Hope you’re right. Here in the US we are only slightly behind in vaccinations, but cases are up and we are worried about a 4th wave like Europe is having. Of course we also have a lot of foolish behavior with big states fully open and unmasked (Florida, Texas), but even New York and New Jersey have remained stubbornly high and are trending up.
Get my first jab today!

Because the surge in cases in Europe is primarily being driven by the more transmissible “UK variant” (B1.1.7).

We already had the surge from this over Christmas and New Year. The only things that have controlled that in the UK and brought numbers down from 61,000 cases a day at the peak on 1st Jan, to 5,000 odd now, are a hard lockdown (certainly harder than Germany) and the fast pace of vaccination.

Your question is putting the rhetorical cart before the horse.

depends on the level of immunity we need for herd immunity which no one seems to
agree with.

either way cases should only go up
moderately as so many ppl are immune already.

That is not an opinion, that is a legal fact. There is a little something called European Human Rights Convention that dictates those things.
Not everything is an opinion. Your deprivation of the right to leave the country for leisure is not a deprivation of a fundamental freedom, there is no discussion on this. This is a fact.
Or in that case I can say Finnair has the best First Class, that is my opinion.

Cases are keeping well in check in UK due to the current lockdown. Effect of vaccination is purely on hospital so far. It will be soon visible in case and at the same time, the cautious re-opening will keep things in check, meaning the UK will be well placed for a great summer.
In Europe our summer is already dead, there is no tightening of restrictions in France or Germany, meaning our Summer will not be like last year.

Now come on everyone, be nice.

It's pretty clear now where the differences of opinion are on should we/ shouldn't we/ are we allowed to travel - there seems little value in going through the same old arguments, again and again. New info? Brilliant. I am all ears. Discussion about whether it's moral to travel? No one is convincing anyone else - it's Brexit all over again.

I went for a walk on the South Downs yesterday. It was lovely. I'd recommend it.

That's including the 15 million under 18s that currently there is no vaccine for and not including the immunity from previous infections.

True. In terms of the adult population we are at just over 50% now I understand so that is still maybe 20 odd million yet to have any vaccine.

I think for herd immunity we are talking minimum 70-80% - I haven't seen anyone suggest lower. We still have some way to go if that's the goal.

Yep 30.5m first doses given so far, so around 22.5m adults left and 15m odd under 18's who can't get vaccinated yet.

Israels daily vaccination rate has slowed to a snails pace at around 55% vaccinated now but their cases are dropping every day, down to just a few hundred daily now.

Yes, although to be clear the Israel number of 55% relates to percentage of the total population which has had all doses needed - the UK equivalent value for that metric is 5.4%.

Ok, the Stanley Johnson clause exists but... I honestly can't bring myself to even consider it. I've got friends who have operated flights to Male with families of 4 people going there for 2 weeks because 'daddy is getting his wisdom teeth taken out'. It might be legal, but I think I'd have too much shame to do that and say that 'excuse' to a UKBF agent. And I've done illegal things in my life, so it's not like I'm Mr Goody Two Shoes.

Is the number 55%? That seems really low. According to the economist, they are saying 93% first dose and 84% second dose. https://www.economist.com/graphic-de...ross-the-world

I'm not disputing your numbers - I'm just trying to understand - is the economist's numbers wrong?

If the actual numbers are much lower, that is good news because it means the vaccine effect overall is seen sooner.

Personally I think the easing of lockdown in England, if it goes to the plan BJ has put in place, is perfectly fine and reasonable.

Obviously I think travel can get restarted again with testing before a trip and on arrival. Lateral flow tests can open up travel, the travel and hotel industry have done so much to make travel safer, I just don't see why government is not acting on the processes available to kickstart travel again sooner.