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-   -   Avoiding tipping? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travelbuzz/1167499-avoiding-tipping.html)

Captain Schmidt Jan 5, 2011 8:46 am

According to the DoL, employers must pay a minimum of $2.13 per hour with the assumption that the balance up to the federal minimum wage of $7.25 is covered by tips, however if it isn't then the employer must make up the difference. So theoretically, not paying tips would not actually dent the ability of the waiting staff to earn a "decent" wage though whether this works in practice would depend on the employer. Link here.

BearX220 Jan 5, 2011 9:14 am


Originally Posted by tuapekastar (Post 15584966)
...I checked in to a hotel in Anchorage and discovered an envelope beside my bed with a typed message exhorting me to put money in it for the housekeeping staff "because they do a great job" or something like that.

I found that quite offensive... Is tipping of housekeeping staff a common practice?

A direct appeal for housekeeping tips, such as you describe, is vulgar and indiscreet. I wouldn't have left anything either. Anchorage lodging is expensive enough.

I rarely tip housekeeping, and never for one-night stays. For multi-night stays I might leave $5 or $10 if the room was really, truly well-maintained, or if I've created a situation for the maid. One night at Bellagio in Vegas a few years ago my son threw up in his bed and housekeeping was rousted to our room at 200am. I tipped both responders $20 on the spot.

Speaking of direct appeals, the guy who delivers my Wall Street Journal stuck a Christmas card in the plastic sack a couple of weeks ago, and it contained his business card with a mailing address. The nature of the "holiday greeting" was crystal clear. I didn't like it, but I sent him $10 because I don't want my paper on the roof. :)

Camflyer Jan 5, 2011 10:00 am

Avoiding tipping by travelling to a country with a non-tipping culture.

rofly Jan 5, 2011 10:27 am


Originally Posted by Analise (Post 15587299)
How can that be? Is there a special W2 form, for waiters to submit to the IRS, geared specifically for the restaurant industry that has the restaurant populate on the form what the gross sales were (or is it net?) for the entire year at that particular restaurant or chain of restaurants?

I'd like to know from accountants and/or waiters themselves here on this thread. I'd also like to see that tax form too. Link?

When I was waitressing at a pool hall a decade ago and made $2.13/hr (selling mostly drinks, with limited bar food) the employer, a chain, reported tips to the IRS by some formula like 10% of the sales divided by the # of staff, or something of that nature. Even though I made less in tips than most restaurant waiters or bartenders, this 'reported' amount was less than half of what I actually made in tips. Maybe there are other ways of reporting tips to the IRS by the establishment, but I think the waiter comes out way ahead on the taxes. Of course, the waiter can be honest and self-report all his tips, but that never happens.

I don't like the idea of tipping and hold strong against the increasing tipping culture at hotels, but I always tip at restaurants because "that's just how things are done." If you don't like it, please lobby on behalf of the servers to have laws implemented, stop going to restaurants, etc. but don't take it out on the waiter.

Lincoln Jan 5, 2011 10:35 am

Valet parking tipping
 
While we're on the subject, how do you tip for valet parking when staying at a hotel? For example, if I stay a hotel for 3 nights and thus do three nights of valet parking, do I need to tip for every time I pick up the car, or only when checking out? I've been stingy on this before because valet has cost me more than $30-$40 a night, but I don't want to be rude either. I just don't know what the proper etiquette is here.

pinniped Jan 5, 2011 10:35 am

I see where the OP was going (I think :)). It wasn't so much intended to be another 10-page Travelbuzz thread about tipping cultures.

It's those little services where a real-time cash tip is expected. I do, indeed, avoid them because I hardly ever have cash on me. At least not in the U.S... So I have two options: let the guy carry my bag and then refuse to tip him or carry my own bag.

Since I am physically able, and since regardless of my philosophical view on the entire culture of tipping it would be uncomfortable to stiff the guy, I just carry my own bags. I also avoid valet parking whenever it's feasible. I don't fault the kid parking my car for expecting a tip, it's just that he doesn't take Amex.

I don't avoid tipping waiters and cab drivers...I add the normal custom to the bill and it gets charged to my credit card. (I'm talking U.S. here...not parts of the world where you negotiate for cash cabs on the street. There, I obviously carry cash for that purpose.)

It's really hotels...bellhops, valet guys, etc. I don't tip housekeeping at a regular hotel when it's just me staying there either. Once, after a villa stay with my family (where we were embarrassingly messy :eek:), I sought out the housekeeper I'd seen most often during the week and handed her a cash tip directly.

I didn't do it because I felt the culture required it, or because I felt that the labor market for housekeepers was not functioning efficiently. I just did it because we were pigs and I felt a bit bad about it... :)

QueenOfCoach Jan 5, 2011 10:39 am


till I checked in to a hotel in Anchorage and discovered an envelope beside my bed with a typed message exhorting me to put money in it for the housekeeping staff "because they do a great job" or something like that.
That's really pushy, and I don't blame you for not tipping.

As for your question about tipping housekeeping staff in hotels in the US, here is what I do. I leave a dollar for an ordinary one night stay where I made no demands on the housekeeping staff. (No requests for extra towels, etc.)

For multiple-night stays, it is likely I have made some demands, so I leave proportionately more. I left $20 for a three night stay in Hawaii, where the housekeeper did a truly superior job and was super friendly, even greeting us by name in the hallway.

Tipping the hotel housekeeping staff is really truly optional. It's nice, especially if they went above-and-beyond for you, but not always expected nor always customary. I mentioned upthread that my husband went through college on busboy tips, so he has always been a generous tipper now that he has a college grad job and can afford to tip big. I do the same.

In my husband's eyes, every busboy, every waiter/waitress, every housekeeper is a struggling college student living on mac-and-cheese like he did when he was in their shoes.

BamaVol Jan 5, 2011 10:57 am

If you're going to visit a country where tipping customary, why not follow local customs. Have you never heard the expression, "When in Rome ..."? Would you bare you soles in a country where it is offensive? Would you reach for the communal food bowl with your right hand in a country where locals would be disgusted? We read a lot about "ugly Americans" overseas. I guess there is a counterpart to this.

Personally, I think the motivation for most who stiff the server is economic (they are cheap) whether they can admit that (even to themselves).

Mrskenny Jan 5, 2011 11:00 am

Tips for waitstaff
 
DH works at a restaurant in a major hotel chain. Tip calculation for income tax reporting is done as follows:

- His sales x 8% = minimum reported tips.

- If non-cash tips (credit cards, room charges, etc) is more than the 8%, then the actual amount of those tips, plus any cash tips reported, is what is added to his gross pay for the week.

- If non-cash tips + cash tips reported are LESS than the 8%, then then the actual is reported and the difference between actual and the 8% is reported as "allocated" tips.

Seems to me that if you have "allocated tips", it triggers some sort of federal income tax penalty for not reporting the full amount of tips.

User Name Jan 5, 2011 11:10 am


Originally Posted by BamaVol (Post 15588737)
If you're going to visit a country where tipping customary, why not follow local customs. Have you never heard the expression, "When in Rome ..."? Would you bare you soles in a country where it is offensive? Would you reach for the communal food bowl with your right hand in a country where locals would be disgusted? We read a lot about "ugly Americans" overseas. I guess there is a counterpart to this.

Personally, I think the motivation for most who stiff the server is economic (they are cheap) whether they can admit that (even to themselves).

Is this just a rant in general or is it directed at someone's post specifically? Because it has nothing whatsoever to do with the original post in this thread.

Analise Jan 5, 2011 11:32 am


Originally Posted by rofly (Post 15588519)
When I was waitressing at a pool hall a decade ago and made $2.13/hr (selling mostly drinks, with limited bar food) the employer, a chain, reported tips to the IRS by some formula like 10% of the sales divided by the # of staff, or something of that nature. Even though I made less in tips than most restaurant waiters or bartenders, this 'reported' amount was less than half of what I actually made in tips. Maybe there are other ways of reporting tips to the IRS by the establishment, but I think the waiter comes out way ahead on the taxes. Of course, the waiter can be honest and self-report all his tips, but that never happens.

Thank you for responding to my question. Did the restaurant's estimate of the amount of money they think you earned in tips using a formula show up in black and white as your reported income on your annual W2 from them?

rofly Jan 5, 2011 11:42 am


Originally Posted by GodAtum (Post 15572114)
How do you avoid services that need tipping? For example when at hotels I carry my own bags and avoid using room service.

Back on topic: there isn't much to add to this thread. If you don't want to tip, don't use the service. Park your car across town in the metered lot instead of using valet ;-). I firmly hold on to my bags at the hotel so they don't take them from me expecting a tip. Also when getting off the airport shuttle bus I handle my own luggage to make sure a tip is not warranted. (It is much debated whether a tip is appropriate in this case, but I feel better about not tipping when I'm not using any extra assistance.)

I staunchly hold off tipping hotel staff when they walk me to the room at check-in even when they hang around waiting for a tip. You can't avoid that service but my conscience allows me not to tip for it.

rofly Jan 5, 2011 11:47 am


Originally Posted by Analise (Post 15589032)
Thank you for responding to my question. Did the restaurant's estimate of the amount of money they think you earned in tips using a formula show up in black and white as your reported income on your annual W2 from them?

Yes, the amount was made very clear on the W2 but I'm not sure if it was listed separately under tips. It was certainly listed as some sort of income so I felt confident the IRS didn't expect me to list anything additional. Although I earned more in tips, there was no way the IRS could prove it since much of it was in cash, unless they shadowed me at work for a few days...

Analise Jan 5, 2011 12:04 pm


Originally Posted by rofly (Post 15589172)
Yes, the amount was made very clear on the W2 but I'm not sure if it was listed separately under tips. It was certainly listed as some sort of income so I felt confident the IRS didn't expect me to list anything additional. Although I earned more in tips, there was no way the IRS could prove it since much of it was in cash, unless they shadowed me at work for a few days...

I'm absolutely astonished that this practice is legal. I'm guessing that it is because your tips are underestimated like you said above, why would you or anyone else complain about this practice?

If the average estimate of tips were actually more than what people take home and there were enough people penalized by such an overestimation, I would guess that trial lawyers would come around to suing the federal, state and local gov'ts for taxing on income never actually earned but rather "estimated" to be earned thus overtaxing people.

Thank you for sharing this.

jfhscott Jan 5, 2011 1:10 pm


Originally Posted by QueenOfCoach (Post 15588600)
That's really pushy, and I don't blame you for not tipping.

As for your question about tipping housekeeping staff in hotels in the US, here is what I do. I leave a dollar for an ordinary one night stay where I made no demands on the housekeeping staff. (No requests for extra towels, etc.)

For multiple-night stays, it is likely I have made some demands, so I leave proportionately more. I left $20 for a three night stay in Hawaii, where the housekeeper did a truly superior job and was super friendly, even greeting us by name in the hallway.

Tipping the hotel housekeeping staff is really truly optional. It's nice, especially if they went above-and-beyond for you, but not always expected nor always customary. I mentioned upthread that my husband went through college on busboy tips, so he has always been a generous tipper now that he has a college grad job and can afford to tip big. I do the same.

In my husband's eyes, every busboy, every waiter/waitress, every housekeeper is a struggling college student living on mac-and-cheese like he did when he was in their shoes.

Will all admissions, this thread has gone horribly OT.

But yes, tipping the housekeeping staff is "optional" and I read somewhere (please do not ask where) that it is practiced by 27% of hotel guests. Perhaps something about the anonymity of houskeeping staff (unlike a waiter) makes it easier to depart without leaving anything.

But what really troubles me is that this generous minority ends up in a position where they make up for the hotelier's lousy wages. Somehow it just isn't right - those who follow a custom have been reduced to subsidizing others. And these more and more common, brazen, preprinted tip envelopes might as well include a request from management to the effect "would you pay our employee because we won't?"

The same applies to some extent to all aspects of tipping culture. Just wish those in tip-dependent positions were directly paid the appropriate wage (which in some situations might be low) and we could do away with it altogether.


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