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Originally Posted by wco81
(Post 7953971)
I think they had to partner with somebody.
You can't move the kind of volumes they're probably shooting for without a carrier distribution channel in this country. Look at all the expensive Nokias people import. Lot of them have WCDMA 2100, which can't be used in the US. Now if a carrier really wanted those high-end Nokias, they probably would have worked to support US networks more. But because people have to get these from eBay or smaller web sites, their sales are limited. Also the high price makes it a smaller market. And Apple obviously has to come out with a GSM product. They could have supported CDMA as well if they struck a deal with Verizon. But apparently one of the sticking points was that Verizon only wanted people to buy music through their network. No sideloading, which is buy on computer and then sync with the phone. AT&T gave up on not forcing people to buy downloads only through their network. Plus I'm sure the other part of the deal was how much AT&T was willing to share vs. the other carriers. To get as big a distribution, the choice was either AT&T or Verizon -- forget about selling unlocked because that's a niche and most iPod users who might buy the iPhone want and one-stop solution. Now would Verizon have made it more attractive? There is certainly detractors to Verizon as well. So they were going to antagonize people either way they went. |
Originally Posted by wco81
(Post 7953971)
I think they had to partner with somebody.
You can't move the kind of volumes they're probably shooting for without a carrier distribution channel in this country. Apple is the king of distribution. It would have been very simple to put them on shelves and include a link or form for people to signup with the provider since the phone is unsubsidized anyway. Now they have limited their audience to those willing to go to ATT, which rules out everyone that hates ATT or those in contract with another provider. |
They did the right thing. The main reason Macs work so well (and PCs don't) is that Apple controls the entire platform: they don't have to worry about running into wierdo Chinese video cards from 1987 and the like, so they have a closed system that they can optimize. They took the same approach with the phone. They know all the services they need are there, they're configured from the factory, and they will not be inundated with calls asking where to put the IP for their WAP gateway and whether the bearer is PS or CSD.
The only option they had was to pick a carrier with enough reach to get them worthwhile numbers. Adding T-Mobile to the mix would have doubled the complexity and doubled the risk of support nightmares. Above call quality, above how the browser renders a page, above battery life, above everything, this handset must get "the Apple experience" right on the first try or it's doomed. It has to "just work". If I were Apple, I would have done exactly the same thing. |
Sealed SIM???
I friend of mine works at an AT&T store here, and he was telling me that there have been unconfirmed rumors that the SIM card will be "sealed" in the iPhones...forcing them to work like programmable ESNs do on CDMA networks. This would have two MAJOR drawbacks if true:
1. The SIMs (according to my friend) cannot be reused or assigned to another customer. Therefore, once activated the phone could never be transferred to another user (it would only work as a iPod). 2. Any existing Cingular/AT&T user would have to ditch their current SIM and be re-assigned to the new SIM inside the iPhone. This means if you wanted to go to the beach an leave your $600 iPhone at home you wouldn't be able to pop out the SIM and put it into a "beater phone" (something I do quite frequently with my Treo and a RAZR). Both my friend and one of his co-workers said that if this turns out to be true its going to be a HUGE problem and something Apple and AT&T would have to change in any future generations. I find it hard to believe they would do something that stupid, but in looking at the pictures of the iPhone online I cannot see any discernable SIM slot (nor have I found any documentation describing one). Anyone have any insight into this? :confused: Craig |
Originally Posted by alanw
(Post 7955946)
They did the right thing. The main reason Macs work so well (and PCs don't) is that Apple controls the entire platform: they don't have to worry about running into wierdo Chinese video cards from 1987 and the like, so they have a closed system that they can optimize. They took the same approach with the phone. They know all the services they need are there, they're configured from the factory, and they will not be inundated with calls asking where to put the IP for their WAP gateway and whether the bearer is PS or CSD.
The only option they had was to pick a carrier with enough reach to get them worthwhile numbers. Adding T-Mobile to the mix would have doubled the complexity and doubled the risk of support nightmares. Above call quality, above how the browser renders a page, above battery life, above everything, this handset must get "the Apple experience" right on the first try or it's doomed. It has to "just work". If I were Apple, I would have done exactly the same thing. Companies like Motorola and Nokia have been doing this without problems for quite some time. |
Originally Posted by ScottC
(Post 7955904)
Sure you can. Apple already has a very impressive distribution channel in place. They sell more ipods in their own stores than all other retailers put together.
Apple is the king of distribution. It would have been very simple to put them on shelves and include a link or form for people to signup with the provider since the phone is unsubsidized anyway. Now they have limited their audience to those willing to go to ATT, which rules out everyone that hates ATT or those in contract with another provider. For the American market partnering with ATT probably increased their potential market. Sure they cut out a bit of the gadget geeks, but they opened up the "I don't even know what a SIM is" market - a much bigger market (and also one more in tune with Apple products :p ) As for rumours - Apple's hype machine thrives on them. Live by the sword, die by the sword. |
Originally Posted by GadgetFreak
(Post 7955980)
Companies like Motorola and Nokia have been doing this without problems for quite some time.
That's so far off-base I don't even know what to say. |
Originally Posted by ScottC
(Post 7955904)
Sure you can. Apple already has a very impressive distribution channel in place. They sell more ipods in their own stores than all other retailers put together.
Apple is the king of distribution. It would have been very simple to put them on shelves and include a link or form for people to signup with the provider since the phone is unsubsidized anyway. Now they have limited their audience to those willing to go to ATT, which rules out everyone that hates ATT or those in contract with another provider. yes, Apple's logistics and distribution is really, really good. It's smaller, so it doesn't get the credit for efficient logistics and distribution that the biger boys get, but having been a part of putting together and analyzing the metrics, investigating the exceptions, as well as the execution in several capacities, it's impressive. but, there's a lot of change that takes place to bring online a new product. any product. a product that is as unique as the iPhone introduces even more change by default. Add in a seemingly simple form that people can fill out on the Web and you reach a huge tipping point. Making this happen for millions of buyers, getting the information to the service provider 100% of the time, working out the format in which that information is sent and verifying that the format is successfully transmitted and translated. There's got to be a way to log in, and the whole thing is going to involve the Web systems, the order processing systems, the systems that register products, the systems that send the information to partner systems, etc. Development, testing, implementation -- on top of what was/is already taking place -- would be insanity. Your post made me laugh inside, and I shared it with a former colleague who often laments to me about how crazy it is right now, as it is, stretching all systems and people to the limit. The best part: 06/30 is Apple's fiscal quarter end. This is when everyone in Operations already works about 1.5x-2x their normal schedule to be sure all goals are met and numbers are hit precisely. Now on top of that one of the biggest product launches in Apple's history is taking place the day before. It's fun being a part of the madness, but in this case, it's even more fun knowing the degree of madness in the sausage factory and not being a part of it. :D Back to the point: A web form may seem like a piece of cake, but there's more to it than that. |
Originally Posted by swise
(Post 7956856)
Back to the point: A web form may seem like a piece of cake, but there's more to it than that.
Amazon, InPhonic, Wirefly and 100's of other have been able to make online cellular provisioning possible. Apple of all companies could easily pull that off. |
Originally Posted by alanw
(Post 7956575)
No, they haven't.
That's so far off-base I don't even know what to say. |
Originally Posted by GadgetFreak
(Post 7956985)
Nokia and Motorola havent been selling cell phones on multiple networks for some time? Am I missing something? I dont think that I am. I can buy a Nokia or a Moto or a BB or any of a number of cell phones on 2 or 3 different US carriers and they work fine on the carrier that they are sold for. Other than looking nice, Im not sure that this is much different than any other cell phone. It does call, web, email and music. And so do a couple dozen others. It may do it nicer in terms of interface, but that doesnt mean it is inherently harder to sell than a high end Nokia for instance.
I challenge you to buy an unlocked unbranded Motorola in the local store and get it working perfectly on your network within 30 minutes. Everything from the GPRS/3G settings to the MMS gateway have to be programmed. Granted, some operators can do a decent OTA configuration, but in 9 out of 10 times only on models they sell. I bet you didn't have your TyTN up and running all that fast either. Every time I do a rom update it takes me 25 minutes to get all the settings back to normal just so I can connect, get my email and send an MMS. |
Originally Posted by drummingcraig
(Post 7955955)
I friend of mine works at an AT&T store here, and he was telling me that there have been unconfirmed rumors that the SIM card will be "sealed" in the iPhones
http://images.apple.com/iphone/galle...1_20070621.png where do these rumours come from, anyway? |
im in vegas at the moment and stopped by an AT&T store, was told that the Fashion Show mall here which has an apple store, would be selling them unlocked on the release date.
Since now i find myself without socks, im going there, and will report back. |
Originally Posted by ScottC
(Post 7957059)
What Alanw is referring to is the setup of the phone.
I challenge you to buy an unlocked unbranded Motorola in the local store and get it working perfectly on your network within 30 minutes. Everything from the GPRS/3G settings to the MMS gateway have to be programmed. Granted, some operators can do a decent OTA configuration, but in 9 out of 10 times only on models they sell. I bet you didn't have your TyTN up and running all that fast either. Every time I do a rom update it takes me 25 minutes to get all the settings back to normal just so I can connect, get my email and send an MMS. I agree with this but it isnt what I am talking about. Im not talking about unlocked and unbranded. I am talking about why they are only selling them branded on ONE network. There is no reason they cant sell them branded, and preset to either TMobile or ATT. You can buy whatever stupid Moto RazrX42 is out now on multiple networks, preset for that network and it wont require any more setup from one network to another. |
One thing that appears to be unique is the HTML mail? It probably needs a decent processor and RAM for rendering it.
Same for playing videos on the screen. I think iTunes Store videos are now 640x480, with hints of HD soon? So does it downscale to 320x480 or whatever the resolution is? |
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