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Consolidated "Airbus 380 - problems and discontinuation" thread

Consolidated "Airbus 380 - problems and discontinuation" thread

Old Aug 13, 2014, 1:03 pm
  #106  
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it's been profitable every year for 25 years, something that the other global carriers can't say
Originally Posted by geminidreams
emirates group >
http://www.theemiratesgroup.com/engl...ness-Type.aspx
emirates airline (94% of group revenue) in emirates group annual report >
wholly owned by a Government of Dubai entity...commenced commercial operations on 25 October 1985 and is designated as the International Airline of the UAE

$1,160m operating profit 5.2% margin >
$886m profit attributable to owner [76%] [withdrew 25% dividend]
$44m profit attributable to non-controlling interests [3.8%] [withdrew 85% dividend]

$80m equity non-controlling interests [1%]

[revenue breakdown]
[93.3%] transport revenue
[4.4%] sale of goods, hotel operations, destination and leisure, others
[0.1%] [$27m] [?]
[2.2%] liquidated damage and other compensation received in connection with aircraft, sale and leaseback of aircraft and parts, ancilliary services and activities incidental to Emirates' operations

$8,361m [spent on] jet fuel

82.4% economy class seat factor
79.4% passenger seat factor
66.5% load factor
64.9% break even load factor

A380 load and seat factors well above the network average, both in the premium and economy cabins

world's largest B777 operator

$27,685m total assets >
$11,907m non-current liabilities
$8,828m current liabilities
$6,948m total equity

raised in aircraft financing funded through finance and operating leases and...two corporate bonds...issue two amortising bonds - a conventional '144A / Reg S' and a Sukuk format. These pioneering amortising bond structures continue to win awards across the globe and gain recognition from the financing and investor community...first ever floating rate capital market bond backed by a COFACE (the French Export Credit Agency) guarantee. This trend-setting transaction has set a standard to be followed in the industry and comes on the back of the first ever capital market bond backed by a COFACE guarantee issued in the last financial year...last of the existing bullet bonds, SGD 150 million Singapore Dollar 2006 (Tranche B) bond and US$ 1 billion Reg S bond 2011 totaling to AED 4.1 billion, are due for repayment in June 2016 [this lists 4 to 6 bonds]

$2,743m bonds fair value [not sure how many bonds this includes]

total equity increased $681m on account of the profit for the year including $225m dividends declared to the Owner...dividend declared for the year is in line with the Owner's strategy to reinvest the majority of profit to support the Emirates' growth. This year's dividend represent 25% of the profit attributable to the owner compared with 32% last year.

page 45 independent auditor's report investments in subsidiaries, associates, and joint ventures
page 53 independent auditor's report related party transactions
page 77 group companies of Emirates
the only thing i did that is not in brackets is convert to $
the annual report stated exchange rate of 3.67 AED to $1

(for less informed people like me, load is pax + cargo)

Last edited by Kagehitokiri; Aug 13, 2014 at 8:39 pm
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 1:27 pm
  #107  
 
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That appears as if Emirates gave money to the government, not the other way round.
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 2:02 pm
  #108  
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load factor minus break even load factor =
1.6 - 2013-2014
0.6 - 2012-2013
0.8 - 2011-2012
5.3 - 2010-2011
2.4 - 2009-2010
1.0 - 2008-2009
2.7 - 2007-2008
5.2 - 2006-2007
5.6 - 2005-2006 (or 5.5)*
7.1 - 2004-2005
5.9 - 2003-2004
4.6 - 2002-2003
3.2 - 2001-2002
4.0 - 2000-2001
3.8 - 1999-2000
4.7 - 1998-1999
5.4 - 1997-1998

is this believable, regardless how "break even" is defined?
for example 5.3 in 2010-2011, although fleet is a factor

* discrepancy in one year's break even load factor
2013-2014 annual report says 60.2 for 2005-2006
http://www.theemiratesgroup.com/engl...2005-2006.aspx
emirates operating statistics at that link says 60.3
(i did not check all reports against all others)

Last edited by Kagehitokiri; Aug 13, 2014 at 8:53 pm
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 5:06 pm
  #109  
 
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Well I was amazed at Thai's A380 and the F cabin. I have been on a lot of birds, including the Concorde, and the A380 is awe inspiring.
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 5:19 pm
  #110  
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thai has room to replace lounge with a Residence-style seat
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 6:27 pm
  #111  
 
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still too early in the game to determine success or failure

come back to me in 10-15 years.

The world is getting larger and larger
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 6:33 pm
  #112  
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Originally Posted by gunit770
still too early in the game to determine success or failure

come back to me in 10-15 years.

The world is getting larger and larger
For the next 20 years, it is nearly impossible for Airbus to even come close to breaking even with current order for the A380, and at the rate they are now discounting the A380, it would be impossible for Airbus to break even in 30 years. That would be considered a failure for Airbus, no matter how you time out the discussion. [Removed political argumentation/characterization - please take such to OMNI/PR] Airbus missed the boat on its prediction that a bigger 4 engine plane was the way to go for the future for the airline industry. Emirates is not the industry, and Airbus, and everyone else, knows it.

Last edited by cblaisd; Aug 14, 2014 at 7:24 am Reason: [Removed political argumentation/characterization - please take such to OMNI/PR]
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 8:21 pm
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Originally Posted by bhrubin
Also, the fact that your daughter or any person you know flew the A380 and saw it full has no bearing on the load factors for ALL A380 flights. When you need to provide an anecdote of a single example flight to try and prove your point, you know there is something weak with your point.
I flew to Jeddah 8 times and each time the 380 was full but I did not see this as a typical route being a short haul flight.
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 8:35 pm
  #114  
 
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Originally Posted by bhrubin
For the next 20 years, it is nearly impossible for Airbus to even come close to breaking even with current order for the A380, and at the rate they are now discounting the A380, it would be impossible for Airbus to break even in 30 years. That would be considered a failure for Airbus, no matter how you time out the discussion. [Removed quote of now-deleted material] Airbus missed the boat on its prediction that a bigger 4 engine plane was the way to go for the future for the airline industry. Emirates is not the industry, and Airbus, and everyone else, knows it.
In the mean time Airbus has made a lot of money selling A330s due to production problems Boeing has had with the 787 s. The A350 along with the revamped A 330 neo is being competitive with Boeings 787 and 777. The reality is that not all modes of anything whether planes, cars, phones or computers are successful, however there is a requirement to have all market segments covered in case there is a change in market conditions.

Having viable competition is always a good thing as is choice. The point is just as much that Airbus needs to cover Boeings market segments and vice versa or run the risk of not having the correct equipment for changing markets and finding themselves uncompetitive.

Last edited by cblaisd; Aug 14, 2014 at 7:25 am
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Old Aug 13, 2014, 8:42 pm
  #115  
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ah, for example cargo - UAE can control government-related cargo?

professionals here may be able to notice things in "related party transactions"

82.4% economy class seat factor
79.4% passenger seat factor

A380 load and seat factors well above the network average, both in the premium and economy cabins
is interesting, presumably brought down by business class?

Last edited by Kagehitokiri; Aug 13, 2014 at 8:55 pm
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Old Aug 14, 2014, 12:41 am
  #116  
 
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Originally Posted by Kagehitokiri
ah, for example cargo - UAE can control government-related cargo?

professionals here may be able to notice things in "related party transactions"


is interesting, presumably brought down by business class?
They have a lot of business class seats to fill. I getting a 75% upgrade strike rate on the 380. Then I think they preferred the foreigner not to be mixing with the pilgrims.
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Old Aug 14, 2014, 9:44 am
  #117  
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Originally Posted by geminidreams
They have a lot of business class seats to fill.
indeed what i was referring to.
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Old Aug 14, 2014, 10:57 am
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Anyone see the print edition? Was the page sponsored by Boeing or McDonald Douglas?

HA HA
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Old Aug 14, 2014, 4:14 pm
  #119  
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Originally Posted by FLgrr
Anyone see the print edition? Was the page sponsored by Boeing or McDonald Douglas?

HA HA
world's largest B777 operator
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Old Aug 25, 2014, 12:04 am
  #120  
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i heard EK recycles the water used in showers rather than having separate water for each pax
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