bhrubin

With China and other Asian hubs building and expanding airport capacity at record levels, there seem to be plenty of slots permitting more flights between hubs than we see in Western Europe and North America. That doesn't favor the A380 for the most part, since it's usually better for business travelers to have multiple choices of departure times rather than a single or fewer departure time with a bigger plane like the A380. It is the slot limitation at Western hub airports that created the perceived need for the A380 in the first place...but that situation hasn't yet played out in China or anywhere else in Asia for the most part. Having an A380 fly BKK-HKG or ICN-HKG might look good, but it isn't the best profit center necessarily. Again, it all depends on how future demand stacks up against supply.

Of course, there's a reason why even Asian carriers have dropped or are considering dropping their A380 orders--it's an awfully risky proposition with such considerations, when there are more lucrative equipment options available even now.

UA Fan

I find this quite difficult to believe. Isn't the A380 is high demand? EK can't seem to get enough of them.

BearX220

EK is literally the only airline on earth that has adopted that view, and all EK's competitors seem to think Emirates is insane -- possibly even dangerous. Raging overcapacity can be a serious destabilizing factor for the whole industry because it leads to fare-cutting. Remember how the first 747s were like rocks around the necks of the airlines 1970-75, flying around half empty. More seats than anyone could sell in a down economy. DL, EA, and NA quickly got rid of theirs.

UA Fan

EK's loads and fares don't seem too low, right?

bhrubin

If Emirates is the only airline that actually orders the A380 in any numbers, as it has been doing, then the A380 will never recoup its $25 billion investment. It's just that simple. There are outstanding orders, but it looks more likely that airlines besides Emirates are canceling their orders in lieu of other aircraft. Without 450-500 A380s sold, Airbus loses money on their investment.. The discounting that Airbus is doing now to help sell more A380s further increases the number they need to sell to recoup their investment. Emirates cannot sustain the A380 by itself, much as you or Airbus might want that to be true. Airbus isn't likely to recoup its investment, and that's the bottom line...no matter how much some people enjoy flying the A380.

Kagehitokiri

1+ stops are often/usually the choice of price-oriented
(i wonder if there are statistics on this somewhere..)

i meant >
xxx-hub-hub
hub-hub-yyy
xxx-hub-hub-yyy
(vs 787 nonstops)

BearX220

Remember that the current climate for global business travel is just about as good as it gets. Profits up, interest rates low, mergers and acquisitions and bonuses busting out all over. These times never last.

Yet Emirates is currently operating 50 A380s and has firm orders in for 90 more. Emirates also runs the world's largest 777 fleet and has ordered 150 777X aircraft.

If all that capacity comes online as the world's economy tanks, or gets even marginally less rosy than it is right this minute, watch what that does to loads and fares, and the health of every top megacarrier catering to the business elite.

Kagehitokiri

although, emirates and some other airlines are state-owned

wco81

Does Emirates get fuel subsidies from its govt?

Kagehitokiri

depends on where they want to recognize profits at the time?

edgewood49

A good point before we continue to bash Emirates they do buy allot of Boeing, and face it all with all those seats on the 380 awards are easier to get. I got 2 FC from LAX to Dubai and on to South Africa for a very reasonable return. The same goes for AF I have flown two r/t's to Paris on the 380 and taking the 380 from South Africa to Paris and then on to LAX in Nov all award seats, my tired "butt" !! but it's worth it

SeriouslyLost

It's Y so it's always a bit unpleasant for the most part. That's simply universal.

But you get so many bulkhead and exit rows, along with the interesting quirks (71D escape hatch!) that it's pretty easy to find a nicer seat. Where you get the extras is that it's still quiet in Y - well, from the aircraft at least. Quiet, smooth, and lots of acreage to roam about on if you want to go for a walk.

Kagehitokiri

sorry i meant between different carriers' A380s Y seating

i was surprised by how loud 757-200 was

wonder if they will do something like that with A380

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ation-hub.html

geminidreams

Emirates is continually expanding its network and using Dubai as a hub for Europe, Africa, Asia and Americas. They feed in with 777s and use the hub to load up the 380s on the trunk routes.

Currently Emirates pricing is middle of the road. 10 years ago they were were discounting a lot. Even with the current pricing they are having high load factors and making life miserable for the legacy european and Asian airlines.

Even if the market were to downturn I think there is more room for Emirates to discount than most other airlines.

Ive flown in the Emirates 380 and some US airlines and I will fly Emirates in comparison every day of the week which is why they fill planes. All I can say is that US airlines are lucky they dont fly on competitive routes to Emirates as they would be having a much tougher time of it.

joshwex90

Didn't FedEx Express want to be the launch customer of the A380? Is the A380F really that different from simply converting a passenger A380?

OP said (bolding mine)

Just because most do one thing (fly Airbus) doesn't discount WN doing something else (fly Boeing)

Example or exception? I'd say UA, and CO before them, made a big deal about getting the 787 early on