View Poll Results: Q: What is your view on FlyerTalk implementing a "Helpful" button feature?
Support
433
59.72%
Oppose
275
37.93%
No opinion
17
2.34%
Voters: 725. You may not vote on this poll
Jan 12, 2015, 9:07 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
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Some FTers are supportive of like/helpful button. Some are not. Some on both sides of the issue have questions, concerns and/or need more info. This wiki attempts to highlight them in bullet format/"cliff notes" version from the 566 posts in this thread. More detailed information regarding the pros/cons/questions/concerns/info can be garnered by reading the entire thread, where FTers on both sides of the like/helpful button have been eloquent/provided valuable input.
Pros:
* Makes Flyertalk more modern; more like Facebook, LinkedIn, and other progressive internet bulletin boards
* A like/helpful button would minimize unnecessary replies such as +1.
* Streamlines posts
* Positive feedback incentivizes quality content/FTers will post more
* Some people won’t take time to write a thank you but will post a like
* Those with more likes/helpfuls are considered knowledgable
Cons:
* Makes it easier for airlines/companies to find mistake fares/glitches/underground tricks
* Makes Flyertalk more like Facebook/dumbs it down
* FT had rating system here years ago and it did not go well
* System can be gamed/cliques develop
* Clutters up posts/takes up valuable screen space
* Will not eliminate +1s/+1s also provide positive feedback
* Posts that have inaccurate info can also get likes/doesn't mean poster is knowledgable
* If FTers post info & it doesn't get likes/helpfuls, less incentive to post more
* Some who might have posted info in the past will now just post like, so less information provided to other FTers.
* Older posts will tend to have more likes/helpfuls on average than newer posts in the same thread, which can be misleading when the information is out-of-date. [added by MSPeconomist]
Questions, concerns about how it will work, and/or information based on brief internal trial already done
* If implemented, can FTers who prefer not to utilize the like/helpful button turn it off so that they don't see it?
* Is there a software way to separate likes of posts from posters? (Limited trial indicates no; don't know if software can be changed to do so)
* Can a post/day count be implemented before implementing for FTers, similar Omni/CC? (Yes)
* Can certain forums have it turned off such as Omni? (No, current software is it's either all forums or none)
* If a sitewide trial is created, what are the metrics for success or failure?
* What is the goal of this/how will the data be used?
* If customization of current software is required, will this take away from development on other projects such as a better mobile app?
* Will or can there be a dislike/unhelpful button?
* What happens if a post that is "liked" gets its content edited and ends up having a different meaning than it initially had at the time the post was "liked"?
* Can threads or individual posts deemed helpful be bookmarked/saved?
* Can users "opt out" and select to remove all trace of the system, as is currently possible with the ignore list and removing view of signatures?
(lower right wiki corner)Some FTers are supportive of like/helpful button. Some are not. Some on both sides of the issue have questions, concerns and/or need more info. This wiki attempts to highlight them in bullet format/"cliff notes" version from the 566 posts in this thread. More detailed information regarding the pros/cons/questions/concerns/info can be garnered by reading the entire thread, where FTers on both sides of the like/helpful button have been eloquent/provided valuable input.
Pros:
* Makes Flyertalk more modern; more like Facebook, LinkedIn, and other progressive internet bulletin boards
* A like/helpful button would minimize unnecessary replies such as +1.
* Streamlines posts
* Positive feedback incentivizes quality content/FTers will post more
* Some people won’t take time to write a thank you but will post a like
* Those with more likes/helpfuls are considered knowledgable
Cons:
* Makes it easier for airlines/companies to find mistake fares/glitches/underground tricks
* Makes Flyertalk more like Facebook/dumbs it down
* FT had rating system here years ago and it did not go well
* System can be gamed/cliques develop
* Clutters up posts/takes up valuable screen space
* Will not eliminate +1s/+1s also provide positive feedback
* Posts that have inaccurate info can also get likes/doesn't mean poster is knowledgable
* If FTers post info & it doesn't get likes/helpfuls, less incentive to post more
* Some who might have posted info in the past will now just post like, so less information provided to other FTers.
* Older posts will tend to have more likes/helpfuls on average than newer posts in the same thread, which can be misleading when the information is out-of-date. [added by MSPeconomist]
Questions, concerns about how it will work, and/or information based on brief internal trial already done
* If implemented, can FTers who prefer not to utilize the like/helpful button turn it off so that they don't see it?
* Is there a software way to separate likes of posts from posters? (Limited trial indicates no; don't know if software can be changed to do so)
* Can a post/day count be implemented before implementing for FTers, similar Omni/CC? (Yes)
* Can certain forums have it turned off such as Omni? (No, current software is it's either all forums or none)
* If a sitewide trial is created, what are the metrics for success or failure?
* What is the goal of this/how will the data be used?
* If customization of current software is required, will this take away from development on other projects such as a better mobile app?
* Will or can there be a dislike/unhelpful button?
* What happens if a post that is "liked" gets its content edited and ends up having a different meaning than it initially had at the time the post was "liked"?
* Can threads or individual posts deemed helpful be bookmarked/saved?
* Can users "opt out" and select to remove all trace of the system, as is currently possible with the ignore list and removing view of signatures?
"Like" Button?
Dec 10, 2014, 3:06 pm
#121
Moderator: Smoking Lounge; FlyerTalk Evangelist
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The content free "+<insert number here>" posts will not go away via having a like/enhancement button-reporting the post to the forum's moderators will make the "content-free" posts go away
Dec 10, 2014, 5:05 pm
#122
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SGF
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Posts: 23,194
Dec 10, 2014, 5:56 pm
#123
In Memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Durham, NC (RDU/GSO/CLT)
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Posts: 33,857
Dec 10, 2014, 9:00 pm
#124
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,417
As I posted earlier in this thread, I'm against any sort of a like button or like score on FT, although I'm still somewhat open to the possibility of being convinced otherwise.
My impression is that the "likes" system on MilePoint has been seriously detrimental. It's ridiculous when someone posts "hi" and that post immediately receives at least a dozen likes. It's much worse than meaningless as it's resulted in the development of cliques that tend to drive others away from MP. It was fun at first when people were simply positive and encouraging, but then it got out of hand. The problem continued even after Randy Petersen asked folks to stop.
My impression is that the "likes" system on MilePoint has been seriously detrimental. It's ridiculous when someone posts "hi" and that post immediately receives at least a dozen likes. It's much worse than meaningless as it's resulted in the development of cliques that tend to drive others away from MP. It was fun at first when people were simply positive and encouraging, but then it got out of hand. The problem continued even after Randy Petersen asked folks to stop.
Dec 10, 2014, 9:38 pm
#125
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,625
After reading all the feedback I have scaled this proposal back to a very limited trial run. Here's my current working draft:
TalkBoard recommends trial of a per-post reader feedback button labeled "I found this post helpful ^" in the Trip Reports forum in order to give readers a quick way to say "thank you" other than cluttering the forum with a "+1" post.
At this time TalkBoard makes no recommendation for wider use of this or any other positive feedback buttons.
Subject to implementation constraints, TalkBoard would prefer that: (a) only logged in members have the capability to provide feedback, (b) feedback totals be visible to all readers without further clicking, and (c) the handles of the individual voters become visible to all readers via a further click or mouse hovering.
TalkBoard recommends AGAINST implementing any new negative feedback feature anywhere on FlyerTalk.
TalkBoard recommends trial of a per-post reader feedback button labeled "I found this post helpful ^" in the Trip Reports forum in order to give readers a quick way to say "thank you" other than cluttering the forum with a "+1" post.
At this time TalkBoard makes no recommendation for wider use of this or any other positive feedback buttons.
Subject to implementation constraints, TalkBoard would prefer that: (a) only logged in members have the capability to provide feedback, (b) feedback totals be visible to all readers without further clicking, and (c) the handles of the individual voters become visible to all readers via a further click or mouse hovering.
TalkBoard recommends AGAINST implementing any new negative feedback feature anywhere on FlyerTalk.
Dec 11, 2014, 5:24 am
#126
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
Programs: UALifetimePremierGold, Marriott LifetimeTitanium
Posts: 71,114
I'm against the scaled back proposal as well, for the reasons given in this & the other thread. I'm starting to think this is a solution in search of a problem.
I'm also a bit perplexed why TB (although it sounds more like nsx than TB in general) are pushing for something when approximately 50% of the FTers posting are against the idea in both threads.
Implementing this would require a major change to the site according to IB. I'm not sure they'd be interested in a making a major change to the site for a trial run. TB doesn't normally create forums on a trial run capacity; I'm not sure why they would start trial runs with something like this.
Cheers.
I'm also a bit perplexed why TB (although it sounds more like nsx than TB in general) are pushing for something when approximately 50% of the FTers posting are against the idea in both threads.
Implementing this would require a major change to the site according to IB. I'm not sure they'd be interested in a making a major change to the site for a trial run. TB doesn't normally create forums on a trial run capacity; I'm not sure why they would start trial runs with something like this.
Cheers.
Dec 11, 2014, 6:54 am
#127
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Either at the shooting range or anywhere good beer can be found...
Posts: 51,059
After reading all the feedback I have scaled this proposal back to a very limited trial run. Here's my current working draft:
TalkBoard recommends trial of a per-post reader feedback button labeled "I found this post helpful ^" in the Trip Reports forum in order to give readers a quick way to say "thank you" other than cluttering the forum with a "+1" post.
At this time TalkBoard makes no recommendation for wider use of this or any other positive feedback buttons.
Subject to implementation constraints, TalkBoard would prefer that: (a) only logged in members have the capability to provide feedback, (b) feedback totals be visible to all readers without further clicking, and (c) the handles of the individual voters become visible to all readers via a further click or mouse hovering.
TalkBoard recommends AGAINST implementing any new negative feedback feature anywhere on FlyerTalk.
TalkBoard recommends trial of a per-post reader feedback button labeled "I found this post helpful ^" in the Trip Reports forum in order to give readers a quick way to say "thank you" other than cluttering the forum with a "+1" post.
At this time TalkBoard makes no recommendation for wider use of this or any other positive feedback buttons.
Subject to implementation constraints, TalkBoard would prefer that: (a) only logged in members have the capability to provide feedback, (b) feedback totals be visible to all readers without further clicking, and (c) the handles of the individual voters become visible to all readers via a further click or mouse hovering.
TalkBoard recommends AGAINST implementing any new negative feedback feature anywhere on FlyerTalk.
Dec 11, 2014, 7:44 am
#128
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Formerly HPN, but then DCA and IAD for a while, and now back to HPN!
Programs: Honestly, I've been out of the travel game so long that I'm not even sure. Maybe Marriott Gold?
Posts: 10,677
I'm against the scaled back proposal as well, for the reasons given in this & the other thread. I'm starting to think this is a solution in search of a problem.
I'm also a bit perplexed why TB (although it sounds more like nsx than TB in general) are pushing for something when approximately 50% of the FTers posting are against the idea in both threads.
Implementing this would require a major change to the site according to IB. I'm not sure they'd be interested in a making a major change to the site for a trial run. TB doesn't normally create forums on a trial run capacity; I'm not sure why they would start trial runs with something like this.
Cheers.
I'm also a bit perplexed why TB (although it sounds more like nsx than TB in general) are pushing for something when approximately 50% of the FTers posting are against the idea in both threads.
Implementing this would require a major change to the site according to IB. I'm not sure they'd be interested in a making a major change to the site for a trial run. TB doesn't normally create forums on a trial run capacity; I'm not sure why they would start trial runs with something like this.
Cheers.
Dec 11, 2014, 8:44 am
#129
In Memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Durham, NC (RDU/GSO/CLT)
Programs: AA EXP/MM, DL GM, UA Platinum, HH DIA, Hyatt Explorist, IHG Platinum, Marriott Titanium, Hertz PC
Posts: 33,857
Dec 11, 2014, 11:01 am
#130
Moderator: Hilton Honors forums
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Marietta, Georgia, United States
Posts: 24,997
I for one am not against someone posting how he or she feels in response to what someone else posted — even if it is a only a ^, a 
, or a +1.
In my opinion, feedback is a gift. If someone is willing to take the time and effort to post something — whether it is in agreement or in opposition in response to content which was posted by a fellow FlyerTalk member — I find that far more valuable than a “like”; and the person can also express himself or herself in virtually any way he or she chooses.
In viewing the “like” system over at Milepoint — which has been in place for almost four years now — the amount of “likes” the content receives does not sway my opinion about the content of what was “liked”; so I find it to have little value.
After giving this proposal some thought, while I am open to trying out this idea on FlyerTalk and giving it a chance — I could be wrong, after all; and it would not be the first time that has happened — I am not in favor of it for the reason I cited.
, or a +1.In my opinion, feedback is a gift. If someone is willing to take the time and effort to post something — whether it is in agreement or in opposition in response to content which was posted by a fellow FlyerTalk member — I find that far more valuable than a “like”; and the person can also express himself or herself in virtually any way he or she chooses.
In viewing the “like” system over at Milepoint — which has been in place for almost four years now — the amount of “likes” the content receives does not sway my opinion about the content of what was “liked”; so I find it to have little value.
After giving this proposal some thought, while I am open to trying out this idea on FlyerTalk and giving it a chance — I could be wrong, after all; and it would not be the first time that has happened — I am not in favor of it for the reason I cited.
Dec 11, 2014, 12:32 pm
#131
Moderator: Smoking Lounge; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: SFO
Programs: Lifetime (for now) Gold MM, HH Gold, Giving Tootsie Pops to UA employees, & a retired hockey goalie
Posts: 28,878
I'm against the scaled back proposal as well, for the reasons given in this & the other thread. I'm starting to think this is a solution in search of a problem.
I'm also a bit perplexed why TB (although it sounds more like nsx than TB in general) are pushing for something when approximately 50% of the FTers posting are against the idea in both threads.
Implementing this would require a major change to the site according to IB. I'm not sure they'd be interested in a making a major change to the site for a trial run. TB doesn't normally create forums on a trial run capacity; I'm not sure why they would start trial runs with something like this.
Cheers.
I'm also a bit perplexed why TB (although it sounds more like nsx than TB in general) are pushing for something when approximately 50% of the FTers posting are against the idea in both threads.
Implementing this would require a major change to the site according to IB. I'm not sure they'd be interested in a making a major change to the site for a trial run. TB doesn't normally create forums on a trial run capacity; I'm not sure why they would start trial runs with something like this.
Cheers.
After reading all the feedback I have scaled this proposal back to a very limited trial run. Here's my current working draft:
TalkBoard recommends trial of a per-post reader feedback button labeled "I found this post helpful ^" in the Trip Reports forum in order to give readers a quick way to say "thank you" other than cluttering the forum with a "+1" post.
At this time TalkBoard makes no recommendation for wider use of this or any other positive feedback buttons.
Subject to implementation constraints, TalkBoard would prefer that: (a) only logged in members have the capability to provide feedback, (b) feedback totals be visible to all readers without further clicking, and (c) the handles of the individual voters become visible to all readers via a further click or mouse hovering.
TalkBoard recommends AGAINST implementing any new negative feedback feature anywhere on FlyerTalk.
TalkBoard recommends trial of a per-post reader feedback button labeled "I found this post helpful ^" in the Trip Reports forum in order to give readers a quick way to say "thank you" other than cluttering the forum with a "+1" post.
At this time TalkBoard makes no recommendation for wider use of this or any other positive feedback buttons.
Subject to implementation constraints, TalkBoard would prefer that: (a) only logged in members have the capability to provide feedback, (b) feedback totals be visible to all readers without further clicking, and (c) the handles of the individual voters become visible to all readers via a further click or mouse hovering.
TalkBoard recommends AGAINST implementing any new negative feedback feature anywhere on FlyerTalk.
Dec 11, 2014, 12:36 pm
#132
In Memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Durham, NC (RDU/GSO/CLT)
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I actually think the Trip Report forum was a stroke of genius on his choice. It's got a decent, though not overwhelming amount of traffic, and it's a "safe", not controversial choice.
Dec 11, 2014, 12:52 pm
#133
Moderator: Smoking Lounge; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: SFO
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Posts: 28,878
If (n.b. if) there was to be a test forum, I personally would like to see a forum with a heavy amount of traffic as by taking the safe way out, with a forum with a lower amount of traffic you might/might not get a fair and balanced result
Dec 11, 2014, 1:03 pm
#134
In Memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Durham, NC (RDU/GSO/CLT)
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Posts: 33,857
In that case, do you have an alternate forum suggestion?
Dec 11, 2014, 1:35 pm
#135
Moderator: Smoking Lounge; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: SFO
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