Mar 11, 2020, 10:13 am
Last edit by: Ocn Vw 1K
In order to reduce noise in the Coronavirus / Covid-19 : general fact-based reporting thread, and to create a central place to invite any member to ask a basic question about the impact of COVID-19 on travel, your moderators have decided to open this separate "lounge" thread for related discussion that isn't strictly fact-based reporting.
Any member who can provide a constructive, helpful answer to a question; or post constructively in reply to a member's point-of-view, is welcome to post.
All FT rules apply, including avoiding personalized, snarky, political, other off-topic, commercial, and repeatedly disruptive content.
Discussion of general economic impacts of Covid-19 belongs in the OMNI forum, not here.
Discussion and critique of political/government actions to aid the economy or which is far more political than related to COVID-19 is for the OMNI/PR forum, not here.
This is a protocol for posting adopted by the forum Moderator team:Please follow this protocol, based on FlyerTalk Rules and long-standing FlyerTalk best practices. Doing so will help keep the thread open, and allow our moderator team to aid members, rather than having to resort to discipline.
•Constructive, respectful posts, views, opinions, questions, and replies, related to the topic are welcome. Avoid commenting on members personally, or posting off-topic or political messages.
•While respectful disagreement of a posted view is allowed, don’t call-out posters to prove their points. FlyerTalk has never required discussion standards at the level of a Ph.D. dissertation defense, or a trial court witness cross-examination.
•After a reasonable exchange of views on a point, please yield the floor so that others may bring up different topics, questions or points.
•Especially important in this time of pandemic, when normal life and travel have been upended: please take regular breaks from the thread.
Please stay healthy,
your FT Coronavirus and Travel Moderator Team.
Any member who can provide a constructive, helpful answer to a question; or post constructively in reply to a member's point-of-view, is welcome to post.
All FT rules apply, including avoiding personalized, snarky, political, other off-topic, commercial, and repeatedly disruptive content.
Discussion of general economic impacts of Covid-19 belongs in the OMNI forum, not here.
Discussion and critique of political/government actions to aid the economy or which is far more political than related to COVID-19 is for the OMNI/PR forum, not here.
This is a protocol for posting adopted by the forum Moderator team:Please follow this protocol, based on FlyerTalk Rules and long-standing FlyerTalk best practices. Doing so will help keep the thread open, and allow our moderator team to aid members, rather than having to resort to discipline.
•Constructive, respectful posts, views, opinions, questions, and replies, related to the topic are welcome. Avoid commenting on members personally, or posting off-topic or political messages.
•While respectful disagreement of a posted view is allowed, don’t call-out posters to prove their points. FlyerTalk has never required discussion standards at the level of a Ph.D. dissertation defense, or a trial court witness cross-examination.
•After a reasonable exchange of views on a point, please yield the floor so that others may bring up different topics, questions or points.
•Especially important in this time of pandemic, when normal life and travel have been upended: please take regular breaks from the thread.
Please stay healthy,
your FT Coronavirus and Travel Moderator Team.
COVID-19: Lounge thread for thoughts, concerns and questions
Mar 9, 2020 | 7:26 pm
#271
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: MSN
Programs: AA, BAC Gold
Posts: 4,120
A problem is that the only relatively hard numbers are the rates of those who need medical care and those who die. For both flu and Covid the presumably much larger number who get a mild case and survive is not known.
Mar 9, 2020 | 7:30 pm
#272
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 637
Japan: 530 cases, 101 recovered.
South Korea: 7478 cases, 166 recovered.
Italy: 9172 cases, 724 recovered.
USA: 668 cases, 15 recovered (but I don't think enough time has elapsed on the US case count)
Not a super comforting recovery rate.
Mar 9, 2020 | 7:31 pm
#273
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
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Mar 9, 2020 | 7:44 pm
#274
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
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For people with a certain about of, what’s the term, numeracy or something like that, they are rather related. This isn’t the flu. It has very little in common with the flu.
Last edited by GadgetFreak; Mar 9, 2020 at 9:30 pm
Mar 9, 2020 | 8:33 pm
#275
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SFO, TPE, HNL
Programs: UA GS 4MM, RCC life member (paid), Marriott Lifetime Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, CLEAR
Posts: 1,944
Agree. I think we are saying similar things. When aerosol threat is serious, it is likely at closer distance and droplets become even more threatening. But it also hints at the possibility that if droplets danger is prevented then most dangers are removed. This interpretation would imply aerosol by itself is not that important.
Mar 9, 2020 | 9:43 pm
#276
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 905
There are no masks in most of Asia. Although in Thailand it’s reported that a staff member of a government minister met with a ‘businessman’ to discuss a deal to send 200 million masks to China. Where the windfall stockpile came from is unclear. Police are investigating. Christmas is coming.
Mar 9, 2020 | 9:53 pm
#277
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: SIN
Programs: EK Blue, EY Guest, AA, QR
Posts: 289
I am just thinking how people would react if there was a daily (or multiple times daily) update released on number of flu patients diagnosed and subsequebt fatalities.
If there actually were 20,000 flu related fatalities this season, you would see dozens of deaths reported every single day and hundreds of positive cases
Mar 9, 2020 | 10:43 pm
#278
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 38,543
You know what will effectively stop cruising? If insurance companies pull plug covering ships/crew and individually people taking cruises.
I'm surprised that they have not done it yet. Travel insurance companies in split second invalidate your coverage if you travel in 'known, affected areas'. Why can't cruise ships being designated such 'areas' before even cruise takes place?
I'm surprised that they have not done it yet. Travel insurance companies in split second invalidate your coverage if you travel in 'known, affected areas'. Why can't cruise ships being designated such 'areas' before even cruise takes place?
Mar 10, 2020 | 12:29 am
#279
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: HKG • Ex SFO, NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AA EXP; Marriott Amb; Hyatt Globalist; Shangri-la Diamond; IHG SpireAmb; Hilton D; Accor G
Posts: 3,326
Mar 10, 2020 | 2:20 am
#280
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: HKG • Ex SFO, NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AA EXP; Marriott Amb; Hyatt Globalist; Shangri-la Diamond; IHG SpireAmb; Hilton D; Accor G
Posts: 3,326
Or maybe they know and they just feel better playing dumb than facing a harsh reality.
We've just arrived back in the UK from Oz via Hong Kong. They take it very seriously in HK - every hotel as far as I can see checks the temperature of the guest as they come in the building, as well as when you check in. Everyone wears masks and hand sanitisers are everywhere. Seems to be working as they seem to be keeping the lid on it. We came onwards via Dubai on EK385, and on the leg from HK to Bangkok, all the air crew wore masks, and when we got to Dubai eveyone was observed with a thermal image camera, and anyone staying in Dubai had to complete a medical questionnaire and declaration. When we got back to Heathrow - what virus, nothing, no messages, no monitoring of passengers, come on and spread your germs through the airport.
Yup, HK takes it super seriously. We remember SARS (not that I was here for it)
More incompetence by local health officials. Hopefully other states are handling this better. Hopefully.
https://www.oregonlive.com/coronavir...from-feds.html
https://www.oregonlive.com/coronavir...from-feds.html
Last edited by NewbieRunner; Mar 10, 2020 at 4:59 am Reason: Merge consecutive posts by same member
Mar 10, 2020 | 3:08 am
#281
Join Date: Apr 2013
Programs: AA, United, R34 ftw
Posts: 2,060
But because of the terrible healthcare there, people that are well are invincible to stuff that kills others--typhoid fever is regarded like the common cold, and just as prevalent. And that doesn't get into the malaria, meningitis, and all the other stuff including insanitary drinking water that people live with every day. And that's the thing--they live without much basic care at all. So in a place like that, the healthcare part of the equation doesn't factor in as much as the resistance of the people to get critically sick. But due to the lack of even basic hygiene, it is going to spread like a gasoline fire.
It's sad that the world is this way.We've just arrived back in the UK from Oz via Hong Kong. They take it very seriously in HK - every hotel as far as I can see checks the temperature of the guest as they come in the building, as well as when you check in. Everyone wears masks and hand sanitisers are everywhere. Seems to be working as they seem to be keeping the lid on it. We came onwards via Dubai on EK385, and on the leg from HK to Bangkok, all the air crew wore masks, and when we got to Dubai eveyone was observed with a thermal image camera, and anyone staying in Dubai had to complete a medical questionnaire and declaration. When we got back to Heathrow - what virus, nothing, no messages, no monitoring of passengers, come on and spread your germs through the airport.
How are the hotels checking the temperature? I'm curious because I was in the hospitality industry a long time and am very curious as to how this is implemented.
Last edited by NewbieRunner; Mar 10, 2020 at 4:57 am Reason: Merge consecutive posts by same member
Mar 10, 2020 | 5:09 am
#282
Join Date: May 2010
Location: AVP & PEK
Programs: UA 1K 2MM
Posts: 7,808
Re: Checking temperature of guests/travelers/visitors
Why is this still happening?
A person without fever can have SARS-CoV-2.
A person with fever doesn't necessarily have SARS-CoV-2.
Why is this still happening?
A person without fever can have SARS-CoV-2.
A person with fever doesn't necessarily have SARS-CoV-2.
Mar 10, 2020 | 5:27 am
#283
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,512
At a guess because it’s a 3 second check and if someone does have a temperature then it is advisable if they are separated from others regardless of whether it’s Coronavirus or not.
Mar 10, 2020 | 5:32 am
#284
Join Date: May 2010
Location: AVP & PEK
Programs: UA 1K 2MM
Posts: 7,808
It's a dangerous, ineffective and misleading practice (IMO).
Mar 10, 2020 | 5:40 am
#285
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,512
That wasn’t my experience in either Hong Kong or Singapore where we were checked, there wasn’t any remote suggestion that this was a health check or that we had been given the all clear. It was simply one of many things that they were doing to identify potential carriers and separate them as early as possible. Given the progression of the disease in those countries compared to others I know where I feel much safer.