Mar 11, 2020, 10:13 am
Last edit by: Ocn Vw 1K
In order to reduce noise in the Coronavirus / Covid-19 : general fact-based reporting thread, and to create a central place to invite any member to ask a basic question about the impact of COVID-19 on travel, your moderators have decided to open this separate "lounge" thread for related discussion that isn't strictly fact-based reporting.
Any member who can provide a constructive, helpful answer to a question; or post constructively in reply to a member's point-of-view, is welcome to post.
All FT rules apply, including avoiding personalized, snarky, political, other off-topic, commercial, and repeatedly disruptive content.
Discussion of general economic impacts of Covid-19 belongs in the OMNI forum, not here.
Discussion and critique of political/government actions to aid the economy or which is far more political than related to COVID-19 is for the OMNI/PR forum, not here.
This is a protocol for posting adopted by the forum Moderator team:Please follow this protocol, based on FlyerTalk Rules and long-standing FlyerTalk best practices. Doing so will help keep the thread open, and allow our moderator team to aid members, rather than having to resort to discipline.
•Constructive, respectful posts, views, opinions, questions, and replies, related to the topic are welcome. Avoid commenting on members personally, or posting off-topic or political messages.
•While respectful disagreement of a posted view is allowed, don’t call-out posters to prove their points. FlyerTalk has never required discussion standards at the level of a Ph.D. dissertation defense, or a trial court witness cross-examination.
•After a reasonable exchange of views on a point, please yield the floor so that others may bring up different topics, questions or points.
•Especially important in this time of pandemic, when normal life and travel have been upended: please take regular breaks from the thread.
Please stay healthy,
your FT Coronavirus and Travel Moderator Team.
Any member who can provide a constructive, helpful answer to a question; or post constructively in reply to a member's point-of-view, is welcome to post.
All FT rules apply, including avoiding personalized, snarky, political, other off-topic, commercial, and repeatedly disruptive content.
Discussion of general economic impacts of Covid-19 belongs in the OMNI forum, not here.
Discussion and critique of political/government actions to aid the economy or which is far more political than related to COVID-19 is for the OMNI/PR forum, not here.
This is a protocol for posting adopted by the forum Moderator team:Please follow this protocol, based on FlyerTalk Rules and long-standing FlyerTalk best practices. Doing so will help keep the thread open, and allow our moderator team to aid members, rather than having to resort to discipline.
•Constructive, respectful posts, views, opinions, questions, and replies, related to the topic are welcome. Avoid commenting on members personally, or posting off-topic or political messages.
•While respectful disagreement of a posted view is allowed, don’t call-out posters to prove their points. FlyerTalk has never required discussion standards at the level of a Ph.D. dissertation defense, or a trial court witness cross-examination.
•After a reasonable exchange of views on a point, please yield the floor so that others may bring up different topics, questions or points.
•Especially important in this time of pandemic, when normal life and travel have been upended: please take regular breaks from the thread.
Please stay healthy,
your FT Coronavirus and Travel Moderator Team.
COVID-19: Lounge thread for thoughts, concerns and questions
Mar 26, 2020, 6:45 pm
#1771
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
One joint? Why not compare with one cigarette per day for a completely useless statistic. My post was about the screaming news headlines about young people dying left and right, especially in California. Young people who like to consume marijuana do not smoke just one joint per day. Nor just two. And it isn't a competition between marijuana and tobacco. Smoking anything, or inhaling the output of a two-stroke leaf-blower engine, is bad for your lungs.
Yemenis and some Horn Africans smoke a lot of khat, but are they seeing a lot of hospitalized “young” from getting hit hard by this virus at this point? If so, that would be news to me.
Mar 26, 2020, 6:54 pm
#1772
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 17,422
Tonight's data out of NYC once again shows that coronavirus is a very deadly disease, but only if you are old or very sick. The percentage of deaths to victims with serious pre-existing illnesses has ticked up to a whopping 97%, and half the deaths are from people 75 years and older. In other words, almost nobody young and healthy dies from coronavirus.
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ary-deaths.pdf
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ary-deaths.pdf
Mar 26, 2020, 6:56 pm
#1773
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Madison, WI, USA
Posts: 14,162
Young people are hospitalized, though, and some end up with lung damage. It's not just about death.
Mar 26, 2020, 7:01 pm
#1774
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
Mar 26, 2020, 7:24 pm
#1775
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,353
Tonight's data out of NYC once again shows that coronavirus is a very deadly disease, but only if you are old or very sick. The percentage of deaths to victims with serious pre-existing illnesses has ticked up to a whopping 97%, and half the deaths are from people 75 years and older. In other words, almost nobody young and healthy dies from coronavirus.
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ary-deaths.pdf
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ary-deaths.pdf
Young people shouldn't panic...but they also shouldn't "almost nobody" either. It's not *just* about grandma in the nursing home.
Mar 26, 2020, 8:06 pm
#1776
Join Date: Nov 2007
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Platinum, Hilton Honors Diamond, Delta Gold
Posts: 4,349
I was thinking the same but I'm even afraid to book for July without knowing if/when all these restrictions would be lifted so I would be allowed entry at my destination and also not be required to quarantine.
Mar 26, 2020, 8:07 pm
#1777
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
Tonight's data out of NYC once again shows that coronavirus is a very deadly disease, but only if you are old or very sick. The percentage of deaths to victims with serious pre-existing illnesses has ticked up to a whopping 97%, and half the deaths are from people 75 years and older. In other words, almost nobody young and healthy dies from coronavirus.
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ary-deaths.pdf
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ary-deaths.pdf
What percentage of those infected with "serious pre-existing illnesses" die?
You're not saying 97% of people in these categories die if they get infected?
Mar 26, 2020, 8:49 pm
#1778
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bye Delta
Programs: AA EXP, HH Diamond, IHG Plat, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Plat, Nat'l Exec Elite, Avis Presidents Club
Posts: 16,273
Germophobes are having their moment but things will go back to normal.
Mar 26, 2020, 9:01 pm
#1779
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 765
No, they clearly aren’t saying that. 97% of people who died in NY were either 75+ or had an existing serious illness.
Mar 26, 2020, 9:10 pm
#1780
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 765
I think it’s pretty clear at this point that there is the usual temperature effect already known with other coronaviruses. Just have a look at how well it spreads in Europe/USA right now vs in tropical countries eg south east Asia. There was also a study out of China that showed a pretty clear relationship between transmission and temperature/humidity.
Mar 26, 2020, 9:49 pm
#1781
Join Date: May 2012
Location: BKK/SIN/YYZ/YUL
Programs: DL, AC, Bonvoy, Accor, Hilton
Posts: 2,920
The mortality rate can be discussed when we are not at the start of pandemic in the USA. Rather, a more reliable indication can be obtained 6 months after the start of the pandemic. Of greater importance is the cost of the current medical crisis. The care of the ill has disrupted medical care. There is collateral damage for patients who can no longer get a hospital bed for general surgery or cannot receive oncology treatment etc. Hospital care in the USA is expensive and ICU care can easily run into the thousands if not tens of thousands per day. If the NYC crisis is an indication of what to expect in large urban centers then the USA is about to incur a medical bill that will be massive.. You want anxiety, consider the impact of having to deal with caring for high risk relatives. We cannot just abandon 1/4 or more of society. It would cause a loss of civil society cohesion. This isn't Sparta.
Last edited by Transpacificflyer; Mar 26, 2020 at 9:55 pm
Mar 26, 2020, 10:04 pm
#1782
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Pacific Wonderland
Programs: ʙᴏɴᴠo̱ʏ Au, IHG Au, HH Dia, Nexus, Pilot FlyingJ Preferred
Posts: 5,336
For a decade or so we’ll be much better prepared to handle the next pandemic. During that time there will be no pandemic, so after a decade or so people will start to wonder whether that money could be better spent elsewhere. The funding for the measures will be picked at, bit by bit, as an easy target for funding other things. By the time the next pandemic rolls around we’ll be basically where we were this time.
Mar 26, 2020, 11:14 pm
#1783
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2014
Programs: Top Tier with all 3 alliances
Posts: 11,668
We are just in the middle of an epic pathetic failure of the CDC and the administration's lack of support for it to handle a crisis that is costing lives and destroyed the economy, and your concern is that the CDC will be too powerful and bureaucratic in the future? Unbelievable...
Mar 26, 2020, 11:16 pm
#1784
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 2,279
I've dealt with mathematical models my entire life. Predictive ones are generally uncertain, at best. Soon enough, we in the USA will have plenty of data to analyze. For the price I and my fellow Americans were coerced into paying by fiat, I want an accounting of who was right, wrong, or anywhere in between.
I just care that they were right. If they were wrong, I care about that too. This isn't a game, and we're playing with the highest stakes here, and the consequences for being right or wrong should be consistent with those stakes.
I just care that they were right. If they were wrong, I care about that too. This isn't a game, and we're playing with the highest stakes here, and the consequences for being right or wrong should be consistent with those stakes.
Mar 26, 2020, 11:22 pm
#1785
Join Date: Nov 2007
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Platinum, Hilton Honors Diamond, Delta Gold
Posts: 4,349
It sure will. The question is when.