There was a busy signal when I tried to call.

Did they vote before the strike or after it was announced?


I am assuming that it was before, since their announcement was made so soon after the strike announcement. If they voted before, why do you think they didn't reveal their intentions.

Yeah, it's quite large actually with up and down escalators and 2 showers in it....but most of it is upstairs on the second level if that makes you feel better....granted so are the other two....he he

Something to look forward to next time...

Well this is shaping up to be one complete disaster... not even 12 hrs into strike and the cancellations are piling up...

I'd have to give up drinking between trips to afford that. No dice.

[QUOTE=NWsilverflyer]But the mechanics claimed that a different group was the knuckledraggers.

Psychtobe, I have to ask exactly where you live, how much you paid for your house, and what you make in a year. Why? Because you seem to think that nobody has sympathy for a mechanic making $58k per year with a family to feed. You seem to think that because it's 40% more than what the average American makes that he's well off.

I beg to differ with you on all counts. I don't have a breakdown on where NW mechanics are based, but I'm sure they have mechs based at LAX. I've seen them. I guarantee you this: Living in L.A. on one income, $58k is nothing. Fat union benefits? If I'm not mistaken, federal law requires that overtime (at the rate of 150%) be paid for any hours over 40 worked in a week. Vacation? Sick? I'd hardly call those fat union benefits either. Most people in non union jobs have those benefits as well. I have them in mine. School? Requires 2000 hours of training. It's commonly accepted that that is a 2-year degree, paid for out of the employee's own pocket.

I refuse to play the "blame the mechanic" game in this one. I have a lot of sympathy for their position, because I sincerely believe that they're not asking for a lot of money. I also believe that one of the reasons a person belongs to a union is to protect their job, like keeping them on American soil. If they gave what NW is asking, I highly doubt they would feel that they have a job even worth protecting.

Powerback time!

The vote ended at 2300 tonight.

From a source herself-We did vote no. I, for one, will be at work in a few hours.

The NW FA's website (pfaa.com) was down a bunch immediately after the vote but it's back up now.

PFAA Hotline for Friday, August 19, 2005

AMFA and NWA did not reach an agreement. AMFA is now on strike.

The PFAA strike ballots have been counted. By our members vote, a strike has been rejected. Therefore, the PFAA Executive Board is not authorized to call a strike. We recognize that there may be those Flight Attendants who refuse to cross AMFA's picket line. PFAA contends that no Flight Attendants may be disciplined for such a show of solidarity, and today pledges all available resources to defend and protect such a choice.

Pilots and FA's NOT honoring picket lines of Mechanics...according to news media reports...

"Flight attendants, ground workers and pilots at Eagan, Minn.-based Northwest said they would not join the walkout by mechanics."

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=464644 .

Nobody said that every NW mechanic making $58k a year has a mansion a yacht and a swimming pool.

Furthermore no one even assumes that every NW mechanic has a spouse and 3 kids to feed on that measley wage they make.

They picked the job, it didnt pick them.

Causing further financial difficulty for the airline is about the DUMBEST idea ever.

But then again, if they were rocket scientists they would be working for NASA, not NWA!!

Period.

Junkie

DHAST, you make some interesting points. It's true, for instance, that 58k isn't "a lot" of money; it's also true that living in LAX is likely to be more expensive than living in, say, LIT or IAH or any number of other American cities.

But facts are facts, and you are ignoring many in order to support your position.

1.
From http://www.salary.com/careers/layout...74&part=Par555

"The average yearly American salary is $39,795 per year - or $19.13 per hour."

Per my earlier post, I stand by my assertion that $58k is 40% more than $39.8k; actually, it is 45% more. I didn't double-check StSebastian's facts, as he appears to have reliable sources. Presumably, both the figures for "average American worker" and average mechanic reflect people living all over the country - including LAX and LIT and IAH and everywhere else. So if the figures cited above are correct, then mechanics do indeed make 45% more than the average worker, and I maintain the "average" worker may not feel a lot of sympathy for them on that count.

2.
You state that "Living in L.A. on one income, $58k is nothing." It's true that single-income households make less than dual-income households. However, I am unaware of any rule, any regulation, or any data that says that mechanics must be the only working member of a household. According to Ameristat.com (http://www.ameristat.org/Content/Nav...Households.htm)
at least 56% of all married-couple households are two-earner/dual-income; and according to a slightly dated article from the Portland Business Journal, in 2003 there were roughly 29 million dual-earner married-couple households nationwide, and only 15 million single-earner married-couple households. In other words, these days it is far more common to have 2 working adults than 1 in the typical American household; and presumably, mechanics are no more immune to this trend than you or I.

3.
Combining these two data points leads to a surprising conclusion: the mechanic salary cited by StSebastian is 33% higher than the median household income in the United States, according to the US Census (http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/incom...statemhi.html), and 5% higher than the median household income in New Jersey, the state with the highest household income in the country, even though by a 2 to 1 margin, most US married-couple households are dual income.

4.
As for benefits, you claim that "Most people in non union jobs have those benefits as well." I perhaps did not choose the best examples to make my point; according to the Department of labor, 77% of American workers have access to paid holidays and paid vacation, and 59% have access to paid sick time. But I do assert that union members continue to receive benefits surpassing that of most Americans. According to the Department of Labor (http://www.bls.gov/ncs/ebs/sp/ebsm0002.pdf), "Union members had higher rates of coverage for most benefits;" "Union members generally enjoyed greater access to benefits;" "Union members paid 11 percent of the medical care premium for single coverage while their nonunion counterparts paid 20%;" 70% of union members had access to defined benefit retirement plans compared to 16% of nonunion; 89% of union members had access to medical care compared to 67% of nonunion; 73% of union members had access to dental care compared to 43% of nonunion; 56% of union members had access to vision care compared to 26% of nonunion; 33% of union members had acces to no-premium family health care coverage compared to 7% of nonunion; 83% of union members had acess to paid jury leave compared to 68% of nonunion; 57% of union members had 10 or more paid holidays per year compared to 61% of nonunion members who had 8 or fewer paid holidays; and compared to nonunion workers, the average union worker has more days of paid vacation across the duration of his entire career, peaking at a delta of 5.6 additional paid days of vacation compared to nonunion workers after 25 years of service.

No one is "blaming the mechanics." Facts is facts. Only 1 in 12 American private sector workers is unionized; the other 11, on average, have access to lesser benefits than that 1 union worker. Unions are out of touch with reality, and the mechanics are going to learn that the hard way, I'm afraid. The public support just isn't there.

I can't speak with certainty for airplane mechanics, but I worked at an auto shop for a while after college, and I can assure you that car mechanics must supply their own tools (and tool chests). While the employer doesn't subsidize tool/chest purchases, these purchases are tax deductible as employment expenses that aren't covered by the employer...the tax deduction typically doesn't come close to making up the cost, though.

Most construction workers I've observed have their own tools, and even cable/satelitte TV installers have to do this...when I moved to RNO, I was living in a brick house and couldn't get my satelitte installed at my first appointment because the intaller didn't have a masonry bit! When I called to complain, the company said the installers were responsible for providing all their own equipment.

With regard to the reports of vandalism, it might be best to wait and see if these things realy hapened...I'm not saying they didn't happen, and if they did, it's despicable. There certainly are cases where vandalism has been committed as part of a labor disputeHowever, but I've seen some cases where reports of widespread vandalism that come out in the first hours/days turn out to http://flyertalk.com/forum/newreply.php#be false.

Frankly speaking my sympathy for the NW mechanics was used up as a NW traveller the last two weeks experiencing their shenanigans out of MSP. 1 8 (bad air con, a changed tire, bad engine latches) hour delay on a tarmac, 1 4 hour delay (backed up lavs), 1 cancelled flight=overnight stay (hydraulic fluid is leaking and the mechanic says that is "really bad")....and wow, one on time (tonight MSP-PDX- the one for sure I thought would get cancelled).

They didn't respect me while they were being paid to do a job, so f-them.