idealflyer wrote:
I'm completely unclear on how something like an email list that everyone is on is really any different than posting directly to the board. Couldn't people on the list be the very ones tipping off airlines for a profit?

As for errors, ethical discussions aside, don't you think the airline or hotels notice this when there's a flood of reservations coming in? That would happen whether it's on the board or on an emailed list. On the errors, what I've noticed from past threads is it tends to be FTers who make reservations and then call the hotel or airline to make sure their reservation will be honored who first tip the corporate folks off that they've got a mistake out there.

Find it
Book it
Post it

You snooze you lose

I've missed many a bargain.. ie.. W Times Sq @ $25 b/c I didn't read the thread, however I've also been able to jump on a few deals as well only b/c I read FT.

Not everyone is going to get these short window promo's/errors or whatever anyway so just let whomever can get them get them..

If you miss it, keep reading FT and another will come along soon enough.

I don't see the big deal

Agree very much with emailman and trojanhorse above.

There seems to be a mixup here. There are longstanding loopholes which many people know about and have been successfully used for years. These are grey areas and continue functioning if attention IS NOT called to them. The RTW that started this thing is an example.

A $0 rate is something else which will generally get stopped eventually if someone posts it or not.

Remember in life something I found out about an elephant and a zebra. After arguing for a while, the elephant said to the zebra: we are wasting our time, you see everything in black and white and I see everything in shades of grey.

I'm all for openly sharing.

But a consequence of the sharing will be that either deals will get rare or redemptions will become harder. When this board first started there were a lot of United 500 mile polls available to all - now all of them seem to be targeted. Me and my wife have got 10K NW miles each in the last 2 years due to the FFF promotions - but redemptions seem to be almost impossible for me despite my Platinum status.

And the Goldpoints Valuemag promotion seemed to have devalued the program - I did not take part in this promotion, but now my points are devalued.

I would appreciate hearing how Randy feels about this.

Yes it will be interesting to see what Randy has to say.

I think it will be interesting because I've never considered Randy's or WebFlyer/InsideFlyer's "philosophy" as having anything to do with loopholes and errors.

His publications and comments are almost always dealing with just maximizing the legit spirit of the program's policies and proceedures. I don't ever recall reading anything about loopholes in the programs, like we discuss regularly here.

Loopholes and errors have mainly been discussed by us in the realm of FlyerTalk, which has a much more limited, and different (read: hardcore) audience, IMHO.

I look at Randy's public persona, and WebFlyer/InsideFlyer as being fairly "conservative" in this regards. With FlyerTalk being the more "radical" branch of the family.


[This message has been edited by PremEx (edited 08-07-2002).]

There is more a chance of the airlines lurking than being on the list I believe and do not really see how someone could profit by telling the airlines. For every one of us that posts, there has to be about 10 people who prefer not to register and post.

Airlines like banks play by their own rules and many will with little notice, change the rules to their advantage when necessary. Therefore I cheer when the little man gets a little edge or advantage. Like someone once said, a bank will loan you an umbrella when it is sunny and will take it back when it begins raining.


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If it is such a small world, why have I been on this airplane for more than 12 hours?!?

Gee you guys can talk!!
Well I agree with ranles and Premex-I think!!

There have been FTers who've stated on threads previously that they have an arrangement where they get upgrade certs if they tell the airline about loopholes. Also, go back and read the first page of this thread.

Regarding Randy's views, I'm curious too, but wasn't the Pudding Guy caper a great example of exploiting a loophole? I believe Randy was quite impressed, as were most of us. BTW, what's interesting about that one, is while Pudding Guy didn't post about it until after he succeeded in getting the miles, another poster did share early on in one of the many Healthy Choice threads that pudding cups were available for 25 cents each. He didn't post with a thread title that said, "Hey everybody - lifetime AA status for cheap! Here's how." Instead that tip was tucked in a thread. Lots of people read it and commented on it, but no one that I know of had quite the vision (or was willing to take the risk) that Pudding Guy did. I imagine the outcome would have been much different had it all come to our attention with a thread title like I mentioned above. It probably would have been shut down very quickly, especially as Healthy Choice first balked at giving Pudding Guy the miles. Point is ... here's another example of information being shared openly, but in a discreet way that keeps it from being shut down prematurely.






[This message has been edited by letiole (edited 08-07-2002).]

Here, here!! Well said Letiole. The need to loudly advertise some of these ideas is usually just an ego thing.

I'd have to see a comprehensive list of these tricks before I could pass judgement/state an opion.

Just for the record, I don't think Healthy Choice ever balked at giving Pudding Guy his miles, I seem to recall him saying he thought he might have problems and was pleasantly surprised when the certs started arriving after never having heard a thing from HC.

My memory on this could be a little rusty as this conversation took place sometime ago, but from talking to Pudding Guy at a get-together (and I think he posted all this as well), they first told him they never received his package - this though it was large, insured, sent special delivery, etc. (I guess it's open for debate whether that was intentional or not.) Then, when they "found" it (I think he explained he had copies of everything), a company rep called him and, as I recall, said things like, You realize this violates the rules, we're really not supposed to honor this, you took advantage of the situation, etc. I do know it took a bit for them to realize they could make lemoncello out of lemons and embrace him and the positive PR he gave them.

[This message has been edited by letiole (edited 08-07-2002).]