Are bloggers ruining Flyertalk????
May 17, 2012, 11:34 am
#511
Suspended
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Anywhere warm & sunny
Programs: UAdbaCO-Silver, DL-Kryptonium Med, AA-Silver
Posts: 33
Isn't it amazing how little graphs can be used to make us feel good! 
Seriously, a score of around 800 is in the top 20% -- I found a graph answering my earlier question here. (With luck that snippet of information will bring me forgiveness for veering off topic.)
Seriously, a score of around 800 is in the top 20% -- I found a graph answering my earlier question here. (With luck that snippet of information will bring me forgiveness for veering off topic.)
May 17, 2012, 2:17 pm
#512
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 92
Are you referring to Frequent Miler's mention of purchasing an Amex prepaid card with an Ink Bold at Office Depot? I don't see how it was self-serving because if anything overexposure would kill the opportunity to buy a prepaid card with a credit card. I'm not aware of any referrals for prepaid cards, and the only way to get a referral from that deal is by promoting the Ink Bold, not the prepaid card, since the prepaid card needs to be purchased at an office store in order for the trick to work.
And this is still a great travel deal. By using the Ink Bold in this way, you get 5X Ultimate Rewards points on all spend. Do you know of a card that gives 5X on everything? And Ultimate Rewards points are very valuable for their flexibility. A lot of people wrote about it because it was such a great deal.
And this is still a great travel deal. By using the Ink Bold in this way, you get 5X Ultimate Rewards points on all spend. Do you know of a card that gives 5X on everything? And Ultimate Rewards points are very valuable for their flexibility. A lot of people wrote about it because it was such a great deal.
May 18, 2012, 8:29 am
#513
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: IAD
Programs: United, AA, Hilton
Posts: 340
I think the real problem isn't that information isn't free, as it is in fact free. The bloggers however, in some cases are copying information from FT to their blog and then monetizing it. That is what I have a problem with, all the sudden all these copy blogs have popped up etc, and some are constantly pushing credit cards all the time.
I have choosen not to read those, others have unique content. But those that take FT posts almost verbatim or regurgitate FT forums needs to go away (don't want to give the real name so that google tracks that as a reference)
I have choosen not to read those, others have unique content. But those that take FT posts almost verbatim or regurgitate FT forums needs to go away (don't want to give the real name so that google tracks that as a reference)
Last edited by SanDiego1K; May 18, 2012 at 10:15 am Reason: removed specific reference to a fellow FTer
May 18, 2012, 9:17 am
#514
Suspended
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Anywhere warm & sunny
Programs: UAdbaCO-Silver, DL-Kryptonium Med, AA-Silver
Posts: 33
Are you referring to Frequent Miler's mention of purchasing an Amex prepaid card with an Ink Bold at Office Depot? I don't see how it was self-serving because if anything overexposure would kill the opportunity to buy a prepaid card with a credit card. I'm not aware of any referrals for prepaid cards, and the only way to get a referral from that deal is by promoting the Ink Bold, not the prepaid card, since the prepaid card needs to be purchased at an office store in order for the trick to work.
And this is still a great travel deal. By using the Ink Bold in this way, you get 5X Ultimate Rewards points on all spend. Do you know of a card that gives 5X on everything? And Ultimate Rewards points are very valuable for their flexibility. A lot of people wrote about it because it was such a great deal.
And this is still a great travel deal. By using the Ink Bold in this way, you get 5X Ultimate Rewards points on all spend. Do you know of a card that gives 5X on everything? And Ultimate Rewards points are very valuable for their flexibility. A lot of people wrote about it because it was such a great deal.
May 18, 2012, 9:54 am
#515
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: ICT
Programs: AA ExP
Posts: 1,860
I think the real problem isn't that information isn't free, as it is in fact free. The bloggers however, in some cases are copying information from FT to their blog and then monetizing it. That is what I have a problem with, all the sudden all these copy blogs have popped up etc, and some are constantly pushing credit cards all the time.
Information is not free in the sense that it costs real time and money to develop information.
Information is also not free in the sense that it is very valuable and can produce very real profits and rewards.
I believe in freely sharing information whenever possible. (I'm a big fan of CC and FOSS.) However, the latter two reasons mean that there are times when it is too damaging to myself and my close friends to do so. Beyond such things as tricks (in the broadest sense of the word), I also do not freely share my business plan and wholesale/discount sources for my electronics business and do not freely share my travel agency's private contracts with the airlines. My electronics business brings me far more "profit" than my "travel hacking", but the same principles apply.
One of these days I'll shut up. I've posted far too much on this thread already. But I kinda feel like I'm one of the few middle of the road guys on this thread; it seems too many people are either virulently info-communism or virulently never-share.
May 18, 2012, 10:10 am
#516
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: NYC
Programs: AA PLT
Posts: 87
My sense is that the way bloggers "ruin" flyertalk is that they make access to inside information non-reciprocal. FT is a participatory community, in that access to deals and information is implicitly conditioned on participating in the community. People here share information with each other with a good faith expectation that others will do the same. Bloggers destroy this expectation by making the information available to people who do not participate in the community.
Of course FT lurkers don't really fit into this paradigm but FT has a pretty steep learning curve that diminishes the value of casually lurking. In order to benefit as a lurker you have to do a lot of it so that you can learn the jargon, separate the wheat from the chaff, etc. This involves a heavy investment of time which discourages the practice. What the blogs do is drastically decrease the cost of obtaining this information.
This reduced information cost allows many more people to enjoy the benefits of the information without having to participate in the community. I think this is where the feeling that FTers are entitled to deals more than outsiders comes from: FTers have spent a lot of time developing a collaborative community that encourages reciprocal information sharing for mutual benefit, and the bloggers are profiting themselves by allowing people to benefit from FT who have no interest in making the time-investment necessary to reciprocate. It's a one-sided exchange.
I'm not convinced this frustration is justified, but I certainly think it's understandable.
Of course FT lurkers don't really fit into this paradigm but FT has a pretty steep learning curve that diminishes the value of casually lurking. In order to benefit as a lurker you have to do a lot of it so that you can learn the jargon, separate the wheat from the chaff, etc. This involves a heavy investment of time which discourages the practice. What the blogs do is drastically decrease the cost of obtaining this information.
This reduced information cost allows many more people to enjoy the benefits of the information without having to participate in the community. I think this is where the feeling that FTers are entitled to deals more than outsiders comes from: FTers have spent a lot of time developing a collaborative community that encourages reciprocal information sharing for mutual benefit, and the bloggers are profiting themselves by allowing people to benefit from FT who have no interest in making the time-investment necessary to reciprocate. It's a one-sided exchange.
I'm not convinced this frustration is justified, but I certainly think it's understandable.
May 18, 2012, 10:14 am
#517
formerly known as felinaar
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SEA
Programs: UA Plat, AA Gold, AS MVPG, Hyatt Diamond, Hilton Diamond, SPG Gold
Posts: 612
I would be careful about that. Upsetting both AmEx and Chase (and Chase has some awesome travel cards) would result in a very unhappy camper if they ever decided to ban you.
May 18, 2012, 10:18 am
#518
formerly known as felinaar
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SEA
Programs: UA Plat, AA Gold, AS MVPG, Hyatt Diamond, Hilton Diamond, SPG Gold
Posts: 612
Fair enough. I don't think that card is particularly impressive, and I do wonder about some of the products that get written up. I have access to the affiliate network, but I have not been approved for any of the credit cards yet. Still, I can tell you there's a lot of trash they don't talk about.
There are a few bloggers, some of them supposedly popular, that I rarely read because they do little more than regurgitate the bank's ad or a tourism bureau pamphlet. It is unfortunate because they used to be better. I see that as a warning for my own blog. Maybe having trouble getting approved as an affiliate is a good thing (they don't like the word "Hack" in my blog's name) because I can write whatever I want and don't have to deal with ever-changing links and rules, etc.
There are a few bloggers, some of them supposedly popular, that I rarely read because they do little more than regurgitate the bank's ad or a tourism bureau pamphlet. It is unfortunate because they used to be better. I see that as a warning for my own blog. Maybe having trouble getting approved as an affiliate is a good thing (they don't like the word "Hack" in my blog's name) because I can write whatever I want and don't have to deal with ever-changing links and rules, etc.
May 18, 2012, 10:19 am
#519
formerly known as Frugal Travel Guy
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Greenville, SC
Programs: UA Gold, HH Gold, SPG Gold, Marriott Silver, Hyatt Platinum
Posts: 1,925
My sense is that the way bloggers "ruin" flyertalk is that they make access to inside information non-reciprocal. FT is a participatory community, in that access to deals and information is implicitly conditioned on participating in the community. People here share information with each other with a good faith expectation that others will do the same. Bloggers destroy this expectation by making the information available to people who do not participate in the community.
Of course FT lurkers don't really fit into this paradigm but FT has a pretty steep learning curve that diminishes the value of casually lurking. In order to benefit as a lurker you have to do a lot of it so that you can learn the jargon, separate the wheat from the chaff, etc. This involves a heavy investment of time which discourages the practice. What the blogs do is drastically decrease the cost of obtaining this information.
This reduced information cost allows many more people to enjoy the benefits of the information without having to participate in the community. I think this is where the feeling that FTers are entitled to deals more than outsiders comes from: FTers have spent a lot of time developing a collaborative community that encourages reciprocal information sharing for mutual benefit, and the bloggers are profiting themselves by allowing people to benefit from FT who have no interest in making the time-investment necessary to reciprocate. It's a one-sided exchange.
I'm not convinced this frustration is justified, but I certainly think it's understandable.
Of course FT lurkers don't really fit into this paradigm but FT has a pretty steep learning curve that diminishes the value of casually lurking. In order to benefit as a lurker you have to do a lot of it so that you can learn the jargon, separate the wheat from the chaff, etc. This involves a heavy investment of time which discourages the practice. What the blogs do is drastically decrease the cost of obtaining this information.
This reduced information cost allows many more people to enjoy the benefits of the information without having to participate in the community. I think this is where the feeling that FTers are entitled to deals more than outsiders comes from: FTers have spent a lot of time developing a collaborative community that encourages reciprocal information sharing for mutual benefit, and the bloggers are profiting themselves by allowing people to benefit from FT who have no interest in making the time-investment necessary to reciprocate. It's a one-sided exchange.
I'm not convinced this frustration is justified, but I certainly think it's understandable.
May 18, 2012, 10:22 am
#520
Community Director Emerita
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Anywhere warm
Posts: 33,755
I have just removed a reference to a specific blogger. It was mean spirited and inappropriate. She is an active FTer and it is against our rules to speak disparagingly of each other. More so than most of the bloggers, she actively participates on FlyerTalk. I have seen her patiently answer newbies on FT, giving well thought out and detailed information. She had the guts to participate initially in this thread, and that simply made her a target. I find that very distasteful.
Everyone is free to discuss the issue of blogging but do not personalize it.
Carol
Community Director
Everyone is free to discuss the issue of blogging but do not personalize it.
Carol
Community Director
May 18, 2012, 11:34 am
#521
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: ICT
Programs: AA ExP
Posts: 1,860
I have just removed a reference to a specific blogger. It was mean spirited and inappropriate. She is an active FTer and it is against our rules to speak disparagingly of each other. More so than most of the bloggers, she actively participates on FlyerTalk. I have seen her patiently answer newbies on FT, giving well thought out and detailed information. She had the guts to participate initially in this thread, and that simply made her a target. I find that very distasteful.
Everyone is free to discuss the issue of blogging but do not personalize it.
Carol
Community Director
Everyone is free to discuss the issue of blogging but do not personalize it.
Carol
Community Director
May 18, 2012, 3:00 pm
#522
Join Date: May 2009
Location: South Park, CO
Programs: Tegridy Elite
Posts: 5,678
I think it's ironic to have an issue with making money from information compiled from FT (and other sources). Hearing Randy Peterson's story at the Chicago seminars last fall of how he got started back in the 80s, it was from making newsletters cobbled together from airline programs' mailings, articles, etc and selling the newsletters to travelers. For that matter FT itself wasn't started just for kicks, there was also money to be made - and still to be made for the current owners.
One pet peeve I do have is with a few bloggers (none of the ones who have participated in this thread) that started on FT, still sometimes link to FT threads in their posts, but now rarely, if ever, actively participate here.
One pet peeve I do have is with a few bloggers (none of the ones who have participated in this thread) that started on FT, still sometimes link to FT threads in their posts, but now rarely, if ever, actively participate here.
May 18, 2012, 3:48 pm
#523
Join Date: Apr 2004
Programs: AA, UA, SQ, VA, QF, AF, BA
Posts: 2,865
My sense is that the way bloggers "ruin" flyertalk is that they make access to inside information non-reciprocal. FT is a participatory community, in that access to deals and information is implicitly conditioned on participating in the community. People here share information with each other with a good faith expectation that others will do the same. Bloggers destroy this expectation by making the information available to people who do not participate in the community.
Of course FT lurkers don't really fit into this paradigm but FT has a pretty steep learning curve that diminishes the value of casually lurking. In order to benefit as a lurker you have to do a lot of it so that you can learn the jargon, separate the wheat from the chaff, etc. This involves a heavy investment of time which discourages the practice. What the blogs do is drastically decrease the cost of obtaining this information.
This reduced information cost allows many more people to enjoy the benefits of the information without having to participate in the community. I think this is where the feeling that FTers are entitled to deals more than outsiders comes from: FTers have spent a lot of time developing a collaborative community that encourages reciprocal information sharing for mutual benefit, and the bloggers are profiting themselves by allowing people to benefit from FT who have no interest in making the time-investment necessary to reciprocate. It's a one-sided exchange.
I'm not convinced this frustration is justified, but I certainly think it's understandable.
Of course FT lurkers don't really fit into this paradigm but FT has a pretty steep learning curve that diminishes the value of casually lurking. In order to benefit as a lurker you have to do a lot of it so that you can learn the jargon, separate the wheat from the chaff, etc. This involves a heavy investment of time which discourages the practice. What the blogs do is drastically decrease the cost of obtaining this information.
This reduced information cost allows many more people to enjoy the benefits of the information without having to participate in the community. I think this is where the feeling that FTers are entitled to deals more than outsiders comes from: FTers have spent a lot of time developing a collaborative community that encourages reciprocal information sharing for mutual benefit, and the bloggers are profiting themselves by allowing people to benefit from FT who have no interest in making the time-investment necessary to reciprocate. It's a one-sided exchange.
I'm not convinced this frustration is justified, but I certainly think it's understandable.
I avoided this thread when it went off-topic for awhile. The dynamics of an interactive forum where we are all more or less of equal stature communicating on an equal footing is completely different to a blog where one person purports him/herself to be an "expert" and market themselves as such so people will follow them and ultimately click on their links. The truth is that VERY FEW bloggers are bona-fide experts, they are just taking the collective information shared on Flyertalk freely on an equal basis and trying to make themselves look like they "know something". There are a few exceptions to this but this seems to be the trend on B.A. at least.
Now let's just hope a few B.A. bloggers don't mess up the Carlson promo with all their whining about the T&C. It wouldn't be the first time a promo has been shut down early.
May 19, 2012, 5:07 am
#524
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 308
While the card does have a PIN, it can't be used as a debit card so I'm not sure the opportunities you have in mind really exist. Correct me if I'm wrong (and I'll blog all about it to the whole world -- just kidding)
May 19, 2012, 10:47 am
#525
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: DFW
Posts: 1,387
I think bloggers help FT. Without them, I think there would be a lot more threads started by people looking for individual help.
I think there are two things ruining FT:
1) Overly-lenient mods (I should get a little heat for this one). For example: I look at MilesBuzz! - it’s supposed to be a “discussion of the latest frequent flyer & hotel program buzz...only”. I take that to mean a general discussion. Yet look at all the “help me" threads. Help me:
- plan my next trip
- pick a frequent flier/hotel program/credit card
- use my miles/points
- and my favorite: find a rental car in NYC. Seriously? How has this one been allowed to continue?
2) Lack of deals to get excited about. Credit card churning seems to be the big thing now, but I haven’t seen a “steal” of a deal in awhile: $1 coins, Valuemags, MR->CO->Amtrak->Choice->SW (not sure if I got the order right), the cheeseboard thing, signing up for double MR points for all spending even though not targeted (that went on for 16 months), etc. Heck, you can’t even launder MR points to HH at 2:1 anymore through DL or HH. The game’s not as fun as it used to be.
I think there are two things ruining FT:
1) Overly-lenient mods (I should get a little heat for this one). For example: I look at MilesBuzz! - it’s supposed to be a “discussion of the latest frequent flyer & hotel program buzz...only”. I take that to mean a general discussion. Yet look at all the “help me" threads. Help me:
- plan my next trip
- pick a frequent flier/hotel program/credit card
- use my miles/points
- and my favorite: find a rental car in NYC. Seriously? How has this one been allowed to continue?
2) Lack of deals to get excited about. Credit card churning seems to be the big thing now, but I haven’t seen a “steal” of a deal in awhile: $1 coins, Valuemags, MR->CO->Amtrak->Choice->SW (not sure if I got the order right), the cheeseboard thing, signing up for double MR points for all spending even though not targeted (that went on for 16 months), etc. Heck, you can’t even launder MR points to HH at 2:1 anymore through DL or HH. The game’s not as fun as it used to be.