[FARE GONE] AA: JFK-DEN (via LAX) in Flagship F rt $483
Oct 20, 2015, 5:17 am
#91
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: West Coast, USA
Programs: Skywards Platinum
Posts: 3,747
I would venture a guess that most of his time will be in the air, not in airports. And, more importantly lots of red-eyes to get sleep and to stay out of the airports during the wee hours.
Oct 20, 2015, 8:02 am
#92
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LA/NY/CHI
Programs: AA EXP, AS 100K, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Plat
Posts: 1,876
Back-to-back ticketing is a type of nested ticketing where a traveler tries to circumvent minimum stay requirements.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airline_booking_ploys
Oct 20, 2015, 9:15 am
#93
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LA/NY/CHI
Programs: AA EXP, AS 100K, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Plat
Posts: 1,876
Rough itinerary for this run is as follows:
Dec17 10am JFK - DEN 6:22pm
Dec17 7pm DEN - JFK 6am+1
Dec18-21 mostly 7am dep JFK. Arrive at JFK either 5am or 6am(+1)whichever is later
Dec22 JFK-DFW-HKG(arr+1)
still trynna figure out what I've gotten myself into
Oct 20, 2015, 9:19 am
#94
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SAN
Programs: Lots of faux metal
Posts: 6,424
American specifically prohibits practices commonly known as:
◾
Back-to-back ticketing: The combination of two or more roundtrip excursion fares end to end for the purpose of circumventing minimum stay requirements.
◾
Back-to-back ticketing: The combination of two or more roundtrip excursion fares end to end for the purpose of circumventing minimum stay requirements.
◾You may accrue mileage only for purchased, eligible, published-fare tickets on qualifying routes used in accordance with all applicable conditions of carriage, tariffs, rules and terms of ticketing (including but not limited to compliance with rules prohibiting hidden city, back to back and throwaway ticketing) and travel. AAdvantage mileage accrual eligibility on airline participant routes is subject to change without notice. Flights to/from Cuba are not eligible for mileage accrual.
Oct 20, 2015, 9:44 am
#95
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Munich, Algarve, Sussex or S.F Bay Area
Programs: Mucci, BA Gold, A3*Gold, AA Plat, HH Gold, IHG Plat Amb, Marriott Plat
Posts: 4,163
American specifically prohibits practices commonly known as:
◾
Back-to-back ticketing: The combination of two or more roundtrip excursion fares end to end for the purpose of circumventing minimum stay requirements.
◾
Back-to-back ticketing: The combination of two or more roundtrip excursion fares end to end for the purpose of circumventing minimum stay requirements.
Oct 20, 2015, 10:43 am
#96
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: West Coast, USA
Programs: Skywards Platinum
Posts: 3,747
I was incorrect and thinking end-on-end instead of back-to-back.
The prohibition of the nested back to back was to avoid people using the ticket to circumvent a higher priced, typically business-use ticket. They want to offer these better deals to leisure travelers and not cannibalize their high-end business revenue.
Although not permitted, OP is clearly not using back-to-back to circumvent paying for a higher cost ticket he otherwise would have bought and AA is not losing that potential revenue.
I'm not saying AA won't care, nor saying it condones the use of back-to-back, but OP isn't canceling a higher priced ticket and using back-to-back to do a planned trip cheaper. I think that is what the airline is most concerned with.
Oct 20, 2015, 10:45 am
#97
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SAN
Programs: Lots of faux metal
Posts: 6,424
Does anybody know of any airline acting on this? I don't believe it to be enforceable and I would not believe any court would side with the airline on any action related to this part of the COC. Taking any action in this direction and losing would invalidate that part of the airline's COC, so I also doubt they would risk it.
Where things are going to go sideways is when there is a weather delay and AA does not have to protect him onto to the subsequent flights causing him to no-show.
I'm not saying I haven't done what he is doing, but there is no way I would do it that many times in a row to an airport that has been shutdown down for days at a time due to weather.
Oct 20, 2015, 10:50 am
#98
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Programs: Airline nobody. Sad!
Posts: 26,062
Oct 20, 2015, 12:36 pm
#100
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Programs: Airline nobody. Sad!
Posts: 26,062
I know you were, so I posted about JFK for laughs/irony , and partly because JFK can get messy REALLY fast too all by itself. Been through enough northeast snowstorms, and was at LAX flying to BOS right before Hurricane Sandy and watched an entire day worth of LAX-JFK/IAD get canceled in one fell swoop and a completely full LAX AC with people delayed. At least DEN faces no hurricane threat .
, and partly because JFK can get messy REALLY fast too all by itself. Been through enough northeast snowstorms, and was at LAX flying to BOS right before Hurricane Sandy and watched an entire day worth of LAX-JFK/IAD get canceled in one fell swoop and a completely full LAX AC with people delayed. At least DEN faces no hurricane threat .
Oct 20, 2015, 1:56 pm
#101
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Northern Calif./Eastern Ida.
Programs: Amethyst Premier Plutonium Medallion
Posts: 20,643
Flights for this fare would put me around 17hours a day in the air.
Rough itinerary for this run is as follows:
Dec17 10am JFK - DEN 6:22pm
Dec17 7pm DEN - JFK 6am+1
Dec18-21 mostly 7am dep JFK. Arrive at JFK either 5am or 6am(+1)whichever is later
Dec22 JFK-DFW-HKG(arr+1)
still trynna figure out what I've gotten myself into
Rough itinerary for this run is as follows:
Dec17 10am JFK - DEN 6:22pm
Dec17 7pm DEN - JFK 6am+1
Dec18-21 mostly 7am dep JFK. Arrive at JFK either 5am or 6am(+1)whichever is later
Dec22 JFK-DFW-HKG(arr+1)
still trynna figure out what I've gotten myself intoeat well, pack some fruit. airplane food for 7 days straight is going to wreak havoc on your digestive tract.
Oct 20, 2015, 7:28 pm
#104
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LA/NY/CHI
Programs: AA EXP, AS 100K, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Plat
Posts: 1,876
I know you were, so I posted about JFK for laughs/irony , and partly because JFK can get messy REALLY fast too all by itself. Been through enough northeast snowstorms, and was at LAX flying to BOS right before Hurricane Sandy and watched an entire day worth of LAX-JFK/IAD get canceled in one fell swoop and a completely full LAX AC with people delayed. At least DEN faces no hurricane threat .
, and partly because JFK can get messy REALLY fast too all by itself. Been through enough northeast snowstorms, and was at LAX flying to BOS right before Hurricane Sandy and watched an entire day worth of LAX-JFK/IAD get canceled in one fell swoop and a completely full LAX AC with people delayed. At least DEN faces no hurricane threat .It snowed here briefly in PHL on Sunday. IN OCTOBER!!!. I hope this winter will be a pleasant one
Oct 20, 2015, 7:34 pm
#105
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LA/NY/CHI
Programs: AA EXP, AS 100K, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Plat
Posts: 1,876
Does anybody know of any airline acting on this? I don't believe it to be enforceable and I would not believe any court would side with the airline on any action related to this part of the COC. Taking any action in this direction and losing would invalidate that part of the airline's COC, so I also doubt they would risk it.
:face palm:
I was incorrect and thinking end-on-end instead of back-to-back.
The prohibition of the nested back to back was to avoid people using the ticket to circumvent a higher priced, typically business-use ticket. They want to offer these better deals to leisure travelers and not cannibalize their high-end business revenue.
Although not permitted, OP is clearly not using back-to-back to circumvent paying for a higher cost ticket he otherwise would have bought and AA is not losing that potential revenue.
I'm not saying AA won't care, nor saying it condones the use of back-to-back, but OP isn't canceling a higher priced ticket and using back-to-back to do a planned trip cheaper. I think that is what the airline is most concerned with.
I was incorrect and thinking end-on-end instead of back-to-back.
The prohibition of the nested back to back was to avoid people using the ticket to circumvent a higher priced, typically business-use ticket. They want to offer these better deals to leisure travelers and not cannibalize their high-end business revenue.
Although not permitted, OP is clearly not using back-to-back to circumvent paying for a higher cost ticket he otherwise would have bought and AA is not losing that potential revenue.
I'm not saying AA won't care, nor saying it condones the use of back-to-back, but OP isn't canceling a higher priced ticket and using back-to-back to do a planned trip cheaper. I think that is what the airline is most concerned with.
It's in the in COC and TOCs that you agree to when you buy the tickets. AA can shut down your account for violating the TOC of the program. They may let you fly, but they don't have to give you miles. There would be nothing you can do about it. That has be decided in court.
Where things are going to go sideways is when there is a weather delay and AA does not have to protect him onto to the subsequent flights causing him to no-show.
Where things are going to go sideways is when there is a weather delay and AA does not have to protect him onto to the subsequent flights causing him to no-show.
Now I'm slightly concerned about this...I know airlines usually don't act on hidden-city, back-to-back etc. But if AA does decide to decline me miles, there's not much I could do...
Hope everything will go smoothly, I'll certainly be giving y'all daily updates, or maybe turn this into a fun TR.
Although mine won't even come close to 36 rentals or 6 bottles of Dom