Jun 19, 2013, 9:45 pm

FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides

Last edit by: fti

People, please edit/use the wiki so same questions are not always asked.

The current CTA decision on the Yangon deal is only for tickets canceled by SWISS Airlines for the seven merged complaints/companions and tickets canceled by Jet Airways for one complainant and companions
- It's not about other carriers because each carrier submits different tariffs.
- If you are not one of the complainants or their companions above who were mentioned in the respective cases, you need to submit a case yourself for hearing.
- There's currently one person who is on Iberia for CTA decision, one can either wait for results or submit a complaint to CTA.

Result of the current case for LX in brief is:
- CTA found 5(F) in the tariff used to be unclear for canceling tickets on erroneously quoted fares.
- 5(F) is unjust and unreasonable and must be revised or taken down by July 9, 2013 (or SWISS can appeal by then)
- SWISS did not use its tariff correctly to cancel the tickets.
- SWISS must compensate one complainant's First Class ticket and any related expenses by July 18, 2013 provided with evidence.
- SWISS must transport other complainants (and their companions) in the original price charged with same booking class and routing by June 18, 2014.

Result of the current case for 9W in brief is:
- Tariff on file had no clauses for "erroneous fares" and was updated subsequently, which means it is not relevant to this event
- Therefore, 9W is to reinstate the tickets with a 1-year validity for transport between the same points and the same booking class.

CTA official news can be read here for general overview of the case.

Actual CTA case review can be found here for reference should you wish to file a complaint.

If you have a similar case that's with SWISS, you need to file with CTA to get a result through informal process first before it gets to formal process. The entire procedure can take up to 3 months for each and the result may not be same cause it's case-by-base and the reviewer of the case can be different.

To file an informal complaint with CTA, see here. Click through all of the pages to get to the online form for the informal complaint. Or click here.

To file a formal complaint after informal complaint has been closed, see here. Continue on to the next page to see the address or email address for the formal complaint.

The July 17th and 18th responses from LX can be found here:

Other Letters:

Feel free to add dates, flights, etc., in order to plan DOs, etc.

Aug 4: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612

Aug 5: ICN-SFO (UA892)
Jason8612

Aug 7: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612

Aug 11: ICN-NRT-ORD (UA78, UA882)
Jason8612

Aug 14: BOS-IAD-NRT-ICN (UA285, UA803, UA79)
Deltspygt

Aug 19: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA352)
Deltspygt

Oct 1: UA433-UA893
JeredF +1

Oct 8: UA892-UA242
JeredF +1

Oct 9: BOS-SFO-ICN (UA433, UA893)
BigJC

Oct 13: ICN-NRT-ORD-BOS (UA78, UA882, UA744)
BigJC

Oct 21: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
Sterndogg +1
flyerdude88 (SFO - ICN portion only)

Oct 23: ICN - SFO UA 892
flyerdude88

Oct 27: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-BOS UA286
Sterndogg +1

Nov 05: BOS-ORD UA521, ORD-NRT UA881
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1

Nov 11: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-IAD UA727
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1

Nov 26: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-NRT UA837, NRT-ICN UA79
thepla

Nov 27: BOS-ORD-NRT-ICN (UA501, UA881, UA196)
BigJC+1

Nov 29: Planning 2 days in TPE, been to ICN
thepla

Dec 1: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-ORD UA698, ORD-BOS UA961
thepla

Dec 1: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA822)
BigJC+1

Dec 15: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
songzm

Dec 25: BOS-IAD UA285, IAD-NRT UA803, NRT-ICN UA79
Dinoscool3 +2

Dec 30: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA444
songzm

Dec 31: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA770
Dinoscool3 +2

Jan 11: BOS-SFO UA1523, Jan 12: SFO-ICN UA893
margarita girl

Jan 12: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
Zebranz

14 Jan: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
ORDOGG

19 Jan: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-ORD UA698 to ORD-BOS UA961
ORDOGG

Jan 22: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA500
margarita girl

Feb 5: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA242
Zebranz

CMB-DFW EY F

FARE IS GONE

FARE RULES (thanks to SQ421)
FRTLK Fare Rules (RT)
FOWLK Fare Rules (OW)

WHEN ARE YOU FLYING?
Feel free to add any additional cities you're leaving from!
Please slot yourselves in!!!

ex-CMB
Feb

Mar
8 - Darmajaya
12 - Thaidai
22 - Deadinabsentia

Apr
21 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
26 - tahsir21

May
28 - Upperdeck744
29 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)

Jun
12 - lelee

Jul
7 - HansGolden +6
8 - arcticbull + 1
11 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: SIN-CMB, DFW-MCI)
25 - Tycosiao
30 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: MCI-DFW, CMB-SIN)

Aug
17 - DC777Fan
26 - Yi Yang
31 - dcas

Sep

Oct

Nov
8 - harryhv
29 - stephem+4

Dec
6 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. roastpuff , JFKEZE (UL Code-share)
7 - DWFI
10 - jlisi984 + dad (CMB-AUH-DFW)
21 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)

ex-AUH
Jan

Feb

Mar

Apr
27 - RICHKLHS

May

Jun
29 - yerffej201

Jul
9 - HansGolden +6
27 - Tycosiao

Aug

Sep

Oct

Nov
30 - stephem+4 (to JFK)

Dec
7 - JFKEZE, DWFI [EY161 nonstop]
9 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. Roastpuff

ex-DFW
Jan

Feb

Mar
14 - Thaidai
15 - zainman +1

Apr
25 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir

May

Jun

Jul

Aug
22 - arcticbull + 1

Sep
22 - bonsaisai (positioning flights ORD-DFW, CMB-SIN)

Oct

Nov
19 - harryhv->Paris

Dec
19 - Yi Yang, jona970318
24 - DWFI (EY160 nonstop)
26 - HansGolden +6 (CDG), LwoodY2K (AUH)

[PREM FARE GONE] RGN First class comes back again!!!!

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Jun 13, 2014, 8:11 am

#10531

thepla

Original Member

Join Date: May 1998

Location: Highland PArk,IL,USA -- AA Lifetime Platinum, IHG Plat, UA Silver, Hilton Gold, Radisson Gold, Marriott Lifetime Titanium

Posts: 2,366

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinInRI

So before you did that:
1) Was your connection in NRT more than 24 hours?
2) Was there C class available on that flight when you searched for it on a standalone basis?

I have the same issue, stopping in NRT for 2 days, but only Y class is available for the NRT-ICN flight so that's what I'm booked into. When I search for that flight in conjunction with a SFO-NRT flight it shows C5. However, when I called the United 1K desk they said there's nothing they can do until C class becomes available to be sold for that standalone flight. And even if and when it does, the ticket would have to be repriced to rebook into C for that segment.

Sort of strange. I booked one of those $1500 BC to Europe that was out there for quite some time.

ORD-BRU (24 hours) BRU-FCO was only available in coach. I called 1K desk after reading here that they should change it for this FC deal you are referring.. BRU-FCO is not even on UA it is on Brussels Air.

They looked and three BC seats opened up on BRU-FCO flight and they changed it without any issues without asking to reprice.

Jun 13, 2014, 1:32 pm

#10532

stephem

Join Date: Nov 2004

Location: Manhattan Beach, California

Programs: BMI Diamond Club Gold forever

Posts: 6,367

Thanks for sharing, very helpful to know and i hadnt thought about doing something so simple. Bottom line is that it seems like about 3 weeks prior to flight they open up that inventory.

Question- I've booked a ton of *A Circle Pacific tickets before and accepted a downgrade to economy at booking where I could get the specific business fare bucket. I've always been waitlisted for the business fare bucket and always cleared. My TA took care of getting me waitlisted so not sure at all how it's done, but where we've paid for the business fare bucket we are entitled to it. Does anyone know if we can and if so how to waitlist with UA under these circumstances?

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinInRI

Well regardless of whether it has to be repriced or not they can't switch that until C fares are available for sale on that standalone flight from NRT-ICN, regardless if they're open for a connecting itinerary (since my stop in NRT is over 24 hours). My NRT-ICN flight is Sunday 1/18/15. Right now it's showing C0 even though if I search for it in conjunction with a SFO-NRT flight on 1/17 the same flight shows C7. I did a sample search for this month and it looks like they open up business class on that standalone flight about 3 weeks out if they haven't sold out since C is available most days up until July 6 currently then there's only Y available on most flights after that.

Jun 20, 2014, 3:50 pm

#10533

stephem

Join Date: Nov 2004

Location: Manhattan Beach, California

Programs: BMI Diamond Club Gold forever

Posts: 6,367

Thanks for your report. I tried this today, have been on now for well over 30 minutes, back on hold again. I clearly have someone who doesnt know what they are doing and has put me on hold to repeatedly check things, often for long periods of time.

He can't understand why the NRT-ICN segment is only coming up in Y, even after I explained married segment issue. All I want to do is move NRT-ICN out a few days to create a 5 day stopover in NRT, I dont care if we are in Y for that segment.

I may need to just HUACA, but with 30+ minutes invested, it seems like I should at least see where this guy can get me...

Quote:

Originally Posted by phx-phlyer

I made the change prior to the first leg. The rules seem ambiguous on this point.
Dealing with overseas call centers is frustrating and a waste of time. I was told that you can request to be transferred to a domestic call center and thus do not need to play call roulette.

Jun 22, 2014, 6:49 pm

#10534

convert

Join Date: Feb 2004

Location: Seattle

Programs: United 1P, Alaska MVPG 75K, Hyatt Daimond

Posts: 428

Quick question, if I do get off at SFO on the way back and have LH as my frequent flyer account, can UA still punish me for hidden ticketing. Could they go after my UA account? I have much more miles there.

Jun 22, 2014, 8:40 pm

#10535

lkar

Join Date: Nov 2007

Location: PHX

Posts: 4,787

Quote:

Originally Posted by convert

I'm not a fare rule or hidden ticketing expert. But you bought a fully refundable, fully cancelable ticket. The rules permit you to cancel once you fly the segment that ends in SFO. You even are entitled the fare difference "if any," which of course there won't be. It seems to me it would be highly inappropriate to accuse you of hidden city ticketing for declining to fly the last segment on a fully cancelable ticket.

Jun 22, 2014, 8:50 pm

#10536

Sykes

Join Date: Aug 2008

Location: SF Bay Area

Programs: UA 1K, Hyatt Globalist, Virtuoso Travel Agent, Commercial Pilot

Posts: 2,117

Quote:

Originally Posted by lkar

That's not how fully flexible tickets work. If you were to properly cancel the last segment, the ticket would be repriced to end there. Often this would generate a refund as the new ticket would be cheaper than the original one (as you suggest), but here this would be quite a bit more expensive (about $5k last I checked) because the original fare was not available for the same price ending in SFO, and the reissue would trigger an additional charge.

It is very unlikely that there would be any repercussions, but (as you already know) you should be aware that hidden city ticketing is a violation of the contract of carriage, and United could presumably seek to recover the price difference between the ticket purchased or the ticket flown, or take action against your MileagePlus account.

Jun 23, 2014, 1:00 am

#10537

danger

Join Date: Apr 2007

Programs: QF, VA, AC, Hyatt, Marriott

Posts: 3,784

Is anyone still awaiting a CTA ruling on their case?

Jun 23, 2014, 2:21 am

#10538

IAN-UK

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Aug 2000

Location: London

Programs: Hilton, IHG - BA, GA, LH, QR, SV, TK

Posts: 17,008

Quote:

Originally Posted by janetdoe

The second time it came up, I knew that previous fares at this rate had been honored. I also had become (due to research on the country) aware the RGN had recently been opened up from international sanctions and was trying to build a tourism economy. I thought perhaps RGN was simply one of those cities, that for some reason, seem to crop up with really great premium fares on a regular basis (like CMB, or BCN, or the Caribbean).

<shrug>

This reasoning looked hollow and self-serving when you treated us to it earlier the thread: though if you find it cathartic, shrug-on

Jun 25, 2014, 4:50 am

#10539

MatthewLAX

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Feb 2007

Location: Los Angeles / Basel

Programs: UA 1K MM, AA EXP, Hyatt Globalist

Posts: 26,930

Spent an hour on the phone with Orbitz today working on a refund. They claim it will hit in 21 days.

Was not going to fly inferior JET F.

Jun 25, 2014, 7:10 am

#10540

whimike

Join Date: Nov 2011

Location: West Coast, USA

Programs: Skywards Platinum

Posts: 3,747

Quote:

Originally Posted by MatthewLAX

Spent an hour on the phone with Orbitz today working on a refund. They claim it will hit in 21 days.

Was not going to fly inferior JET F.

To each their own. For $1,400 round-trip, 9W F works fine for me.

Jun 25, 2014, 7:17 am

#10541

stargold

Join Date: Jul 2000

Location: AUH

Posts: 8,267

Quote:

Originally Posted by whimike

To each their own. For $1,400 round-trip, 9W F works fine for me.

Indeed. Jet F seat remains far superior to many airlines' F seats.

But horses for courses...

Jun 25, 2014, 11:58 am

#10542

stephem

Join Date: Nov 2004

Location: Manhattan Beach, California

Programs: BMI Diamond Club Gold forever

Posts: 6,367

Right, I would take 9W F for the price, luckily got swapped to EY metal.
For me the real question is whether UA GF is worth $1700 ;-) especially after sampling LH F (new) and EY F in the run up to the UA flights.

Quote:

Originally Posted by whimike

To each their own. For $1,400 round-trip, 9W F works fine for me.

Jul 2, 2014, 8:11 pm

#10543

IAHMCI

Join Date: Nov 2008

Location: Houston

Programs: UA LT GS 4.2 MM, AA Gold 1MM, HH Lifetime Diamond, Marriott Lifetime Gold

Posts: 394

I was able to book my positioning flights FromIAH in February for $237 round trip.

Jul 4, 2014, 8:54 am

#10544

omsflyer

Join Date: Apr 2000

Location: Denver

Programs: UA Lifetime Plat 2MM. Starwood Lifetime Gold

Posts: 178

We are flying this on 29 July - picked up 4 tickets, wish I had done other dates. It looks like the flights have been running with minimal interruption. Has anyone run into any problems checking in because of the mistake fare? Any idea what your status is if there is a cancellation? Thanks

Jul 4, 2014, 9:22 am

#10545

SFO777

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Nov 2007

Location: Denver • DEN-APA

Programs: AF Platinum, EK Gold, AA EXP, UA 1K, Hyatt Globalist

Posts: 21,602

Quote:

Originally Posted by omsflyer

I wouldn't worry about any "mistake fare" related problems. I doubt you would be penalized in the event of IRROPS, which would be handled as UA would normally... for better or worse.