[QUOTE=kctigers;10601086]a lot of people are missing the boat on this one... marriott hands out free nights like candy, EEO certificates, bonus bucks, premium pounds, etc... i am also hilton honors diamond, and i do not ever see hilton doing any of these things, marriott also has lots and lots of promotions, megabonus and the like, hilton does not, not that familiar with spg, and hyatt, although a member of both, so cannot comment there... so, i think that a lot of people need to factor these in as well, and also, i think that a lot of people that are complaining are on the companies dime. this makes a huge difference, as i am on my own dime. and i think that marriott is in its right to change the program, may not like it, but a class action suit, is just beyond realm of thinking. people, please look at these other factors and all, that marriott does for us.[/QU

No,sorry-Marriott does not "hand out free rooms like candy"BB and PP's are earned while giving revenue to a hotel-sometimes with heavy restrictions.Redeeming them also comes while spending at hotels,again with restrictions.EEO certs are a 2for1 propsition-again revenue to the hotel and againg with(increasingly more)restrictions.Marriott has very few promotions that it pays for out of its own pocket.Most (such as the current "mega"((HAH!)) are sponsored by a partner.Marriott promotions have a pitifull yield compared to other chains promos.Marriott does very little for us actually.Please return the favor

"but atleast we got about 3 months notice about the changes in the rules. Make some plans--tkave a well deserved vacation on Marriott. I assume that Marriott has done this sort of thing before, e.g. changed the redmption values or bumped category 6 hotels up to category 7 hotels, etc. You may, understandably, not be happy about the change , but the change is likely not without precedent. "
That is correct StephanAndrew.One year Marriott thanked the Freddie voters by instituting IMMEDIATE catagory changes to its program right after the Freddies.That is how Marriott thanks its most loyal customers.
But you are correct.Marriott at least gave those who wish to clear out their accounts some notice this time.

Agreed. As I stated in my earlier post, I do not understand why they are raising point redemption amounts. This would make sense if the economy was humming and the avg nightly rates were going up and thus causing point inflation by the more MR points being out there. This is definitely Marriott corporate trying to sneakily tidy up their balance sheet b/f the economy gets worse.

Wow, that post gets a huge

1) Gives out free nights like candy? That's garbage. The BBs and PPs are just discounts at the top rates. Most of the time we can't even use them as a promotional rate or our corporate rates are much cheaper. As for the free nights, that is also figured in the rate and is a part of doing business. Everyone does it as a way of marketing, so you argument has no basis.

2) Who cares that most people here are on their company dime. Don't you understand that most people staying in hotels are business travelers? And most of us choose where we stay on business. We want a reputable brand that rewards us for our loyalty. Otherwise there would be no point to be loyal and everyone would choose based on cost. We understand point changes are inevitable, but we don't appreciate it when a company lies to its best customers about doing so and claims it as a benefit to the majority.

MR WANTS us to spend the points next year. For MR side, the points will represent lowest value in $$$ since room prices will go down (much less demand for rooms because of economy situation). Good to get rid of some of the points balance, and at cheaper market prices, while providing some income to hotels from MR HQ during this tough times (so Marriott will be viewed as good managment program for those property owners that have Marriott as their managment hotelier - remember most properties/hotels are not owned by Marriott). I will still cash my balance - do not trust MR and will move to another program (looking between HH and *wood).

TL

Wow this thread has exploded since I last checked in.

I think the changes do suck for a lot of high end customers. I rarley get the opportunity to take 7 night vacations so its not as big of an effect on me. Heck I rarely get out for 4 night vacations.

I've been plat for many years and I still use my points for 1-2 night stays so the increase hits me but not as hard as the 7 day users.

shouldn't be much of a problem

300K will get you one nice stay at these inflated prices if you can find one available

or with the new cat 8.. you can burn these down quite quick at the redemption rates they brought these in at

the good news is you are not too deeply invested in MR so you can move one without any remorse, guilt or feeling that you are leaving a lot of meaningful points behind

You must have missed the part of my original post that answers your question�

"Had he just came out and said �here are the changes that we feel are necessary to remain profitable in these tough economic times"..."

Now I�m not saying he needed to use those exact words or that he even needed to be contrite, only that he needed to be somewhere in the ballpark of honest and forthright. There will always be some spin, but the load of garbage he�s spewing now is beyond the pale.

Really? Interesting! I just went to see if I could book some cheap rates at Marriott resorts during Thanksgiving and Christmas and lo and behold I can. I guess you could argue that it�s because Marriott has decided to forego some extra revenue just to be kind to us, but I tend to believe it has to do with them having a boatload of empty hotels during what is traditionally a very high season for them and they�re attempting to fill those rooms. Is the hotel industry in the same situation as the airline industry? Not yet, but let�s not pretend that they�re Exxon-Mobil either. Times are tough for the hotel industry and they�re only going to get tougher.

Your logic is so flawed here I don�t know where to begin. Thankfully, others have already spoken up and giving you more to think about.

I believe numbers can be spun to support any opinion one wants them to, but there is no spin being used when I say that there is a huge points devaluation taking place. Marriot is not losing money on these changes nor are they merely realigning things and breaking even. These changes directly and dramatically improve Marriott�s bottom line, and if you don�t believe that you really need to lay off the kool-aid.

And again, since you seem to be missing the point of my original post, I�m all for a company making money and adjusting their prices when they feel it is necessary, but what isn�t acceptable is for a vendor that I give a great deal of business to, to come out and show such utter disrespect for my intelligence that they tell me they�re doing me a favor by reducing by 60% the value they place on both my past and future loyalty.

Really? Thanks! In this case, you have a firm grasp of the obvious, congratulations.

Like I previously stated, I�ve already adjusted my travel habits to accommodate my new found realization that Marriott either believes I�m a drooling idiot or has such utter contempt for me that they don�t care how offensive I find their spin.

I will probably re-qualify for Platinum again next year with the nights I travel alone, but anytime there�s an event being planned or I�m traveling with others, I�ll make sure that revenue goes to a company that, at least outwardly, has some modicum of respect for me.

FREE nights like candy? I don't think so... Please tell me when was the last time a Canadian hotel participated in the EEO program? NEVER!

As for promos Marriott has other companies such as VISA foot the bill, case in point the current promo.

Sorry but Marriott can't touch Starwood when it comes to the variety of promos available to its members. With Starwood you can stack promo on top of promo.

Plus Starwood has given its PLT members a yearly 50% off redemption award for the last several years.. Marriott? NADA

Not quite as you say. What if members (and there are such) have accumulated few million points (3-5) and, for example, are about to retire from their job, and then start traveling around. Maybe they do not or cannot just cash in all their points next year as you say and they were building on this program, and were loyal to MR, to allow them to enjoy latter. If its just a few points (such as 40K-100K) maybe yor point could (with difficulty but still could) pass. But not when one has few million points and simple cannot cash them all to waste.

A program is a program. Now, if that would have been done from now on, not on older points, that is fine. You can say from now on, any additional points you accumulate have different rules, or there are no point awarded at all (fine... that is perfectly within the right of MR to do). Not on retroactive points that were already basically paid as there is nothing free, all of this is built into the room price.

I recall a situation with United Air, and their MP program. I think it had to do with the expiration of miles, or something like that. At some point, united changed the rules, but for the old miles, has separated them from the "new" miles. They were accounted for for MP members separately, as I believe those miles could not expire or had some other benefits (cannot recall now the details).

MR should have done something similar here. Again, if someone who has a few million points want to be the lead of a lawsuit against MR, I am sure there will be a lawfirm to take this case as a class acction...

TL

do you guys even listen to yourselves?

Not every corporate move is a conspiracy or a personal affront

Of course not! MR tries to take a good care of us on their expense...

I am sure you are the type that the marketing people love to have as a target in all big corporations...

Every move any company does has to do with getting more money within their busines. Period.

All, many of you have visited my site and sent in great recommendations on how to get Marriott's attention. I've completely updated the site and listed your suggestions. Please take a moment to visit, review, and send in more suggestions.

http://sites.google.com/site/makemarriottlisten

I still believe that as such a huge group of top customers, we have the power to be heard - but honestly, at a meeting this week I found that many of my fellow travelers have no idea about Marriott's changes. Please continue to spread the word beyond FlyerTalk so that more and more people become aware of the changes. For me, it's not about whether or not Marriott is allowed to make changes - it's whether or not they are bound to being honest with their customers. If they cannot be honest, I see no issue with spreading the honesty on their behalf - and then letting individuals decide if they want to move business elsewhere. If enough people do make that choice, then I can assure you that the Marriott business model will change. So far we've only heard from Ed French, Sr. VP of Rewards - we have not heard from Bill Marriott. If Bill, the board, shareholders, franchisees, etc find that that customers are choosing to leave (and their money is leaving too) - they will remodel their program - it's that simple. I cannot predict who will leave - I can only try to expose the lack of honesty.

Thanks again for all of your suggestions!

And I forgot that I wanted to reply to the car analogy.

Marriott's communication wasn't that the price went up - they basically sent out an announcement that next year's model has been enhanced and available at the same price. When we went to see the car, we figured out that the enhancement was heated seats (and we live in Arizona) - and by the way if you look close enough, you'll notice that tires are no longer included. That was Marriott's enhancement! Oh yeah - and then when you asked them why no tires, they tell you that customers no longer want tires - they want seat heaters in Arizona - their research proves it - it IS an enhancement!

This thread is an echo chamber. Comprehension and perspective are not valued.

As my previous posts testify I am really annoyed at these changes as I have a 3 million point balance which will be instantly devalued by 25% to 30%, but you cannot accuse Marriott of disinformation through a medium of a website which has disinformation itself. Your devaluation spreadsheet on the site is very inaccurate.

All the 7 night (and 14) night award comparisons are wrong in that the devaluation figures are far too high.

The category 4 night devaluation for 5 nights is wrong

All your 8 to 13 night devaluation figures are wrong as you have just doubled the 1 to 6 night figures which underestimates the devaluation. This is only an accurate formula for 7 nights v 14 nights

For example The correct comparison with the current scheme for a 8 night stay is a 7 night plus a 1 night.

You should do a common sense check - the devaluations increase as the nights increase, they don't decrease from 7nights to 8 nights.


Tom