May 11, 2019, 9:00 am
Last edit by: SanDiego1K
Description of resolution can be found here: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31088204-post759.html
Outrageous No-Show Fee Incurred At St. Regis Aspen
Apr 2, 2019, 5:24 am
#572
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: DTW
Programs: Alaska, Delta, Southwest
Posts: 1,663
The guest wasn’t asking the hotel to break any no-show rules because he wasn’t a no-show. It’s telling that the two people on this thread defending the hotel are hotel owners - you guys aren’t really arguing this is the right or ethical thing to do, you’re just trying to justify bilking more money out of your customers.
Apr 2, 2019, 7:55 am
#574
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: SLC/HEL/Anywhere with a Beach
Programs: Marriott Ambassador; AA EXP 3MM; AS MVP, Hilton Gold, CH-47/UH-60/C-23/C-130 VET
Posts: 5,234
Yes - the same owners that wouldn't have said a word if the guest showed up on time now save money on housekeeping, water, electricity, disposables, and are still pounding the table about how they deserve to collect outrageous sums of cash for some sort of nonexistent damages. There is no opportunity cost argument to be had here. It's pure greed in the most malicious sense.
If the guest had been checked in as planned, the hotel would have been paid for the room, as Marriott would have compensated it for the night/points. Some threads suggest Marriott pays well when hotels are full. Because the guest was not checked in, the hotel wasn't paid.
I'm not justifying Elevated Returns policy, as I think this is a cost of doing business in a ski town. But objectively, there is a loss to the hotel.
For future reference, on a stay like this, if someone is having travel issues, ask the hotel to check you in when you call and tell them you want the room available when you arrive early in the morning.
Apr 2, 2019, 7:58 am
#575
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: DCA
Posts: 7,769
If the guest had been checked in as planned, the hotel would have been paid for the room, as Marriott would have compensated it for the night/points. Some threads suggest Marriott pays well when hotels are full. Because the guest was not checked in, the hotel wasn't paid.
Apr 2, 2019, 7:58 am
#576
Join Date: Feb 2017
Programs: DL DM, UA Gold, Alaska MVP, Bonvoy (lol) Ambassador
Posts: 2,994
I think the hotel's position is ridiculous but, if we're being objective, there is an opportunity cost.
If the guest had been checked in as planned, the hotel would have been paid for the room, as Marriott would have compensated it for the night/points. Some threads suggest Marriott pays well when hotels are full. Because the guest was not checked in, the hotel wasn't paid.
I'm not justifying Elevated Returns policy, as I think this is a cost of doing business in a ski town. But objectively, there is a loss to the hotel.
For future reference, on a stay like this, if someone is having travel issues, ask the hotel to check you in when you call and tell them you want the room available when you arrive early in the morning.
If the guest had been checked in as planned, the hotel would have been paid for the room, as Marriott would have compensated it for the night/points. Some threads suggest Marriott pays well when hotels are full. Because the guest was not checked in, the hotel wasn't paid.
I'm not justifying Elevated Returns policy, as I think this is a cost of doing business in a ski town. But objectively, there is a loss to the hotel.
For future reference, on a stay like this, if someone is having travel issues, ask the hotel to check you in when you call and tell them you want the room available when you arrive early in the morning.
Both the hotel and Marriott are at fault. The hotel for being obtuse and punishing a guest because they hate people that stay on points, and Marriott for having a policy that will inherently result in anti-guest behaviors like that which the OP experienced in this case.
Apr 2, 2019, 8:12 am
#577
Join Date: Aug 2003
Programs: Bonvoy Amb; AA EXP
Posts: 1,136
It shouldn't be the customer's responsibility to do ongoing diligence on this type of situation. This was supposed to be a merger and not a hostile takeover. The reason I bring that up is that as a reasonable individual, I would assume that the terms of my contract with the hotel would not be changed so dramatically during a merger without explicit notice. That notice would include an explicit mention of what would happen in a late arrival situation. Not a cancellation, which this was not, but a late arrival. In a bankruptcy or a hostile takeover, and nothing has been communicated that it is one, I would think it would be in a consumer's best interest to review the terms of the reservation.
I have empathy for business owners who are running on thin margins and have to make customer service decisions that cost them money. It's difficult to side with a customer when you are trying to make payroll and pay down your loans, especially if the terms and conditions are on your side. I would guess that isn't the case here. This feels like a hotel owner who begrudgingly is a part of a program that allows the use of points. Maybe the contract was signed before the economy turned. Who knows. My assessment is that eating the $2K would have been an inexpensive marketing expense versus the press they are getting now.
On a separate note as it relates to the bed bug incident, I don't think it is ok to fabricate in order to win a customer service argument in a way that hurts the hourly workers at a hotel. Whether it's illegal or not, I don't know, but it sure is a drain on karma and decency. Though as I think about it, when people search for St Regis Aspen and bed bugs, they will now be in the same thread even though no one ever said anything about this hotel. This Interweb thing is a nuisance.
I have empathy for business owners who are running on thin margins and have to make customer service decisions that cost them money. It's difficult to side with a customer when you are trying to make payroll and pay down your loans, especially if the terms and conditions are on your side. I would guess that isn't the case here. This feels like a hotel owner who begrudgingly is a part of a program that allows the use of points. Maybe the contract was signed before the economy turned. Who knows. My assessment is that eating the $2K would have been an inexpensive marketing expense versus the press they are getting now.
On a separate note as it relates to the bed bug incident, I don't think it is ok to fabricate in order to win a customer service argument in a way that hurts the hourly workers at a hotel. Whether it's illegal or not, I don't know, but it sure is a drain on karma and decency. Though as I think about it, when people search for St Regis Aspen and bed bugs, they will now be in the same thread even though no one ever said anything about this hotel. This Interweb thing is a nuisance.
Apr 2, 2019, 8:50 am
#578
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: DTW
Programs: Alaska, Delta, Southwest
Posts: 1,663
It shouldn't be the customer's responsibility to do ongoing diligence on this type of situation. This was supposed to be a merger and not a hostile takeover. The reason I bring that up is that as a reasonable individual, I would assume that the terms of my contract with the hotel would not be changed so dramatically during a merger without explicit notice. That notice would include an explicit mention of what would happen in a late arrival situation. Not a cancellation, which this was not, but a late arrival. In a bankruptcy or a hostile takeover, and nothing has been communicated that it is one, I would think it would be in a consumer's best interest to review the terms of the reservation.
I have empathy for business owners who are running on thin margins and have to make customer service decisions that cost them money. It's difficult to side with a customer when you are trying to make payroll and pay down your loans, especially if the terms and conditions are on your side. I would guess that isn't the case here. This feels like a hotel owner who begrudgingly is a part of a program that allows the use of points. Maybe the contract was signed before the economy turned. Who knows. My assessment is that eating the $2K would have been an inexpensive marketing expense versus the press they are getting now. ...
I have empathy for business owners who are running on thin margins and have to make customer service decisions that cost them money. It's difficult to side with a customer when you are trying to make payroll and pay down your loans, especially if the terms and conditions are on your side. I would guess that isn't the case here. This feels like a hotel owner who begrudgingly is a part of a program that allows the use of points. Maybe the contract was signed before the economy turned. Who knows. My assessment is that eating the $2K would have been an inexpensive marketing expense versus the press they are getting now. ...
Apr 2, 2019, 12:06 pm
#579
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: JAX
Programs: UA Plat MM, AA Gold MM, Marriott LTT, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 3,770
I would never pay $1000 for St. Regis Aspen. And based on this thread, I won't touch it with a 10-ft pole either, especially for award bookings.
Last edited by CIT85; Apr 2, 2019 at 12:14 pm
Apr 2, 2019, 12:23 pm
#580
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Midwest
Programs: Marriott Titanium, IHG Plat, Hyatt Globalist, HHonors Diamond, AA Plat Pro, UA Silver
Posts: 571
Long time lurker, new poster. I have worked in hotels and the travel industry for basically my whole life. I ran across this thread and will note I have skimmed maybe a third of the posts and certainly not read the whole thing.
As a hotel industry veteran, I feel inclined to point out that the vast majority of hotels do not engage in these types of shady business practices. Fortunately, I think that is obvious to many posters here as I am sure many posters here have arrived a day late for or had to cancel their hotel reservations because of airline IRROPS, weather, or other circumstances that are clearly beyond their control. Most properties are pretty forgiving in these circumstances.
In all my years working in hotels, I only ever worked for one property that had a strict no-excuses policy after the cancellation deadline and that was for a smaller boutique property and even then the policy was that if we could resell the room we would refund the money. At pretty much every other hotel the policy was forgiving even on nonrefundable reservations.
As a hotel industry veteran, I feel inclined to point out that the vast majority of hotels do not engage in these types of shady business practices. Fortunately, I think that is obvious to many posters here as I am sure many posters here have arrived a day late for or had to cancel their hotel reservations because of airline IRROPS, weather, or other circumstances that are clearly beyond their control. Most properties are pretty forgiving in these circumstances.
In all my years working in hotels, I only ever worked for one property that had a strict no-excuses policy after the cancellation deadline and that was for a smaller boutique property and even then the policy was that if we could resell the room we would refund the money. At pretty much every other hotel the policy was forgiving even on nonrefundable reservations.
The rationale for being forgiving is somewhat a matter of good business in that in many circumstances we will be able to resell the room anyway (and in many of those cases for more money) and if guests feel we are being unduly harsh then they will never return. That is a big risk especially in business hotels especially if dis-servicing the wrong person. Some properties might target corporate travelers on the rationale that those on expense accounts will not care, but there is a lot of risk playing that game. However, the much bigger impetus is that it is a simple matter of good customer service. It is never nice to try to hold guests accountable for circumstances that are genuinely out of the guest's control.
Apr 2, 2019, 1:53 pm
#581
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: New York
Programs: MB-LTT , HH-Diam., HGP-Expl.
Posts: 778
Losing one's points for a no-show or a late arrival and the hotel being compensated as if the guest stayed for the duration of the points reservation seems like an equitable solution.
If someone misses an award flight, the points are normally lost and customers aren't charged the cash cost of a last minute ticket. Although hotels are sometimes independently owned, there is no reason that Marriott couldn't treat a missed reservation made with points the same as with a cash booking. Once the cancellation becomes non-refundable the hotel gets paid the same amount whether or not the guest arrives. What is unreasonable is for the hotel to make more money when a customer doesn't show than when they do. If all flights were grounded and guests arrive late, that shouldn't become a windfall for the hotel. At the same time, hotels shouldn't bear the loss of revenue caused by someone else's error.
If someone misses an award flight, the points are normally lost and customers aren't charged the cash cost of a last minute ticket. Although hotels are sometimes independently owned, there is no reason that Marriott couldn't treat a missed reservation made with points the same as with a cash booking. Once the cancellation becomes non-refundable the hotel gets paid the same amount whether or not the guest arrives. What is unreasonable is for the hotel to make more money when a customer doesn't show than when they do. If all flights were grounded and guests arrive late, that shouldn't become a windfall for the hotel. At the same time, hotels shouldn't bear the loss of revenue caused by someone else's error.
Apr 2, 2019, 4:40 pm
#583
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Chicago
Programs: Hyatt Glob; UA 1K; BonVoyage LTT (RIP SPG); HH Dia; JX Insighter
Posts: 1,644
Apr 2, 2019, 7:10 pm
#585
Join Date: Sep 2005
Programs: CX Diamond, AA Gold, Bonvoy Platinum
Posts: 497
I am almost finished redeeming a substantial balance of SPG points converted to Bonvoy. Though I am lifetime gold, and been platinum for the past few years, I decided that for travel I will just book the most convenient property, pay for my desired upgrade and breakfast and forget any loyalty to Marriott.
It is attitudes like on in the St Regis Aspen that makes it so easy to leave.
It is attitudes like on in the St Regis Aspen that makes it so easy to leave.