Alex_I

I think we all will miss SPG AMEX and SPG as a program even though it also devaluated over the years. My strategy after the merger announcement was simply to enjoy SPG till it last and, as everything good, it is coming sooner than later.
Surely, I should not complain because I will be PLT Elite or whatever they call it with ca. 800 SPG nights and 11 years of SPG PLT + 80 or so Marriott nights. The only problem is that I do not like to stay at Marriott. I did stay some (about 80 nights) including as reciprocal PLT in US and Asia and I still prefer SPG for booking! The big decision is what to do after Aug.1 and even before that. Perhaps, Hyatt should up their game and get some of us. But for coming July where I have to be traveling ca. 15-20 days HHonors looks very good if you have their AmEx (triple points! vs. 250 SPG points/night).

ckelly14

Well, took the plunge and signed up of Sapphire Reserve to likely take the place of my SPG personal card.

I looked at the website and the transfer partners, and I can't really see how "The Points Guy" values CSR points at 2.1 cents. In another article he suggests that I should use the CSR with 3X travel bonus instead of using my 6X bonus of my SPG card when staying in Marriott properties.

Are others getting this much value out of CSR? I assume if I usually fly American I should continue to purchase my tickets with my AAdvantage card?

Thanks in advance

UA-NYC

Depends how you use them...if you can redeem via UA for int'l premium cabins, or for BA short-haul premium cabins (like intra-Asia), they are worth well above that.

However, it's easy to rack up gobs of URs and I never have enough Starpoints personally, so I may still use the future Starriott card for unbonused spend, and would definitely use in on-property.

bgriff

I agree that TPG overvalues UR points (as well as some other currencies IMO). But, UR points are clearly worth at least 1.5 cents each if you hold the CSR since you can do a direct redemption against cash values at that price. Whether you want to push a bit higher than that depends how much you value the various transfer options.

For spend at Marriott properties, I think the Marriott or SPG card at 6x is still probably a bit better than the CSR, but it can vary. When SPG was independent and the choice was 3 UR points vs 2 SPG points, it was a close call, since SPG points (prior to having the 1:3 transfer to Marriott option) were worth somewhere around 2-2.5 cents each, vs. 1.5+ cents each for the CSR. Assuming new Marriott points remain similar to current Marriott points in being worth around 0.8ish cents each (a value TPG uses which I think is about fair, though I could see an argument that it's too high), then 6 Marriott points would be equal to 3 UR points if you valued UR points at 1.6 cents each. Either one is a fairly good option though, and in part the answer may depend on how rich you are between the two currencies at any given point in time.

The AA card question is similar. In theory 3 UR points should be worth more than 2 AA miles (which I believe is what your AA card gives you on AA spend?). 3 UR points can be converted, for example, to 3 UA miles, and even if you think AA miles are worth more than UA miles, I don't think they're worth 50% more. But it also depends how rich you are in each program, and what specific awards you may have on your radar -- if you really want to fly Cathay Pacific then 2 AA miles may be a better way to get there than 3 UR points (you could transfer UR points to BA and redeem for Cathay via BA, but BA charges many more miles than AA on most longhaul trips, and BA also charges higher fees).

And of course, don't forget that if you buy an AA ticket using the CSR, you'll still earn the miles for flying the AA flight, you just won't earn the extra 2 AA miles per dollar for the charge. So if you fly AA fairly regularly you may find you earn enough miles from the actual flying that you're happy with that and prefer to put the charge on the CSR.

Arguably, though it is counterintuitive, if you really want to continue using the AA card, it might make more sense to do it for non-bonus spend categories -- no matter what valuation you put on both currencies, 1 UR point vs 1 AA mile is going to be a closer call than 3 UR points vs 2 AA miles.

surfmonkey89

My "issue" is that I'm trying to figure out which way to go between Starriott. Membership Rewards, and UR. I have both Starwood and Marriott cards, I'm a new Platinum Amex member (where I've been fortunate to have the AF paid for by Morgan Stanley), and Ultimate Rewards, where I'm a new CFU owner, racking up points at 3% for a year, and trying to figure out whether to go all-in with a CSR.

I don't have a ton of points in any of them, I like to travel maybe once a year (one or two more times per year would be great), and I don't want to water things down by spreading everything across three programs.

Right now my plan is to keep using my SPG Amex to get that sweet 1:3 conversion on August 1st, and then probably move to CSR, but having the Platinum Amex is throwing a wrench in things. I could get the Amex Everyday Preferred and use that to build MR, but I'm not sure if MR is the right program for me. Plus, I always have to have a Visa with me anyway, because not everyone takes Amex, so why not just get a CSR and use that as my only card?

I just don't know what to do.

bgriff

It is probably worth getting a CSR (or at least CSP) sooner rather than later, given the rumors that Chase is considering discontinuing or devaluing the ability to transfer points from CF/CFU to premium cards. Hopefully if that does happen Chase will give some notice, but ideally you'd want to have the CSR account already open so you could transfer right away.

Though on the other hand, given that the special bonus on the CFU makes that card at least as good as the CSR for all spend, it is kind of a waste to have to pay the CSR annual fee earlier than necessary. So I guess you could gamble with it. If Chase does give some notice, as long as you'd be able to get approved for a CSR immediately (i.e. as long as you'd be under 5/24) you should have enough time to get the CSR during the notice period, and if you're approved immediately the CSR will show up on your Chase.com account immediately so you should be able to do the points transfer right away, even before receiving the CSR card in the mail.

And even if Chase doesn't give notice, 3% cash back for all spend isn't too shabby either.


If you don't travel a lot then I wouldn't stretch yourself thin by trying to build up MR too. Indeed if you're not going to have much of a presence in MR, I probably wouldn't even bother putting airfare on your Amex Platinum, even though it earns more points than the CSR. (Unless you're hoping to save up UR points to transfer to one of the programs that UR and MR have in common, like SQ, BA, or AF, where you could combine your UR points with the bits of points earned on the Amex Plat.)

surfmonkey89

bgriff

They are airlines -- SQ is Singapore Airlines, BA is British Airways, and AF is Air France. Both Chase UR and Amex MR allow you to transfer points to various airlines' frequent flyer programs, which can be lucrative ways to make use of those points (though it can also require flexibility and a good amount of homework). Those three happen to be partners with both Chase and Amex. So if you had 50K Chase UR points and 50K Amex MR points, you could transfer them both to a single Singapore Airlines account for example and you would have 100K Singapore Airlines points.

Both programs also have various partners that are not shared -- for example you can transfer Amex MR points to Delta, but not Chase points, and you can transfer Chase UR points to United, but not Amex points. So in the 50K/50K split case, you could get 50K Delta points and 50K United points, but there's no way to get 100K points in either of those single programs.

Basically, you have the right impulse to try to keep yourself from being spread too thinly across multiple programs. I was just pointing out that in a few cases, MR and UR points can complement each other. But unless you specifically know that you are interested in making use of one of the transfer partners that is shared between the two programs, it's probably best to focus on earning in one program or the other.

PBA_DC3

gardengirl

I recently booked a last minute trip DTW-VCE in Business. At the time the ticket was pricing out over $9K. Today I see the round trip would be $8100. It would take $400K in spend to get the 2% cash back to purchase that ticket.

SightseeMC

TL;DR - BoA Premium Rewards beats out other cards given our situation.

We will be foreign-based next year, so no FTF is key. And what we really value in rewards is free breakfast (yeah, I said it ) during stays and the opportunity to snag a free room when rates skyrocket. But we've recently been reminded that, in most circumstances, a perfectly nice hotel can be had for $100 in most of the places we travel, including breakfast. Plus, there are some travel options we really want that don't have major brands attached.

I've been reading this thread and decided to go with the BoA Premium Rewards for non-bonus spend, given our relationship with the bank already. 2.625% is too good to pass up, and $500 bonus is better than the extra 1st year return with Alliant. The extra return from the Altitude Reserve isn't worth the $355 more in annual fees, and our CSRs match the benefits. Plus, the CFU has FTF (but I am KICKING myself for missing that 3x sign-up bonus; would have crushed it for the rest of this year), or I'd just stay within the Chase family for everything. I am at 3/24 with Chase but I will use a spot for this; if we end up in the US more than planned I'll add a base Chase.

Well, we were at the Renaissance O'Hare and the Marriott Madrid Auditorium in April, and both checked our status.

jchock1

When you call the CSP line, a person answers the phone, usually in less than 30 seconds, without having to enter card information, press 1, etc., and that person is in a US-based call center. In my experience, Amex typically takes 2-3 minutes to pick up after entering your entire account number and trying to divert you to the automated system, and the person on the other end is likely to be in the Philippines or another off-shore call center, where their training seems to be not as thorough as for US-based agents. The CSP agents are the most capable credit card reps I've encountered and for me a huge advantage over Amex.

Kremmen

Does anyone know why Amex hobbles their cards this way? Similarly, their new Hilton cards have category bonuses that only work in the USA. Chase's category bonuses work internationally. I don't understand why Amex is making the choice to reduce the usefulness of their co-branded travel cards by making them not nearly as valuable to those who travel.

Explore SE Asia

I actually just opened the CSR this year. I only have 90k in my accounts. I will be renting an apartment overseas for part of the year. This will increase my un-bonused international spend. As you suggested, I could use my CSR for all the overseas transactions.

Explore SE Asia

I am in similar circumstances (50% of the time I will be outside the USA). I had not considered the BofA card. A 2.6% return plus the sign up bonus is very attractive. Using the CSR for travel and dining and using the BofA for everything else overseas is hard to beat. (CFU for domestic non- bonus spend.) Currently, I am at 2/24 at Chase. That allows me to pick up 2 additional Chase cards. Still debating.

PS Moving an IRA over to BofA is relatively painless for the return.

PPS As someone suggested to me, my non-bonus spend is not great enough to go crazy optimizing my credit cards. If I was already 5/24, I would get the BofA card. I am still considering adding Chase cards.