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-   -   2020 Shutdown Thread (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/manufactured-spending/2002127-2020-shutdown-thread.html)

goramblers21 Aug 4, 2020 6:46 am


Originally Posted by msp3 (Post 32579789)
Read your cardholder agreement. Surprised there isn’t a Bowtie and Emily article with arrows and circles on this...

That was the opposite of helpful, but thanks! 👍

radonc1 Aug 4, 2020 9:45 am


Originally Posted by goramblers21 (Post 32580433)
That was the opposite of helpful, but thanks! 👍

In actuality, the advice was spot on.

You can get the cardholder's agreement on-line. Within it is very specific instructions on how to file an arbitration complaint. One needs to follow the instructions explicitly because any deviation from them can lead to delays or worse, denials. And once denials are issued, there is no second chance since most arbitration does not allow appeals.

Please let us know if you do file and how things went.

goramblers21 Aug 4, 2020 9:50 am


Originally Posted by radonc1 (Post 32580791)
In actuality, the advice was spot on.

You can get the cardholder's agreement on-line. Within it is very specific instructions on how to file an arbitration complaint. One needs to follow the instructions explicitly because any deviation from them can lead to delays or worse, denials. And once denials are issued, there is no second chance since most arbitration does not allow appeals.

Please let us know if you do file and how things went.

Except there are many variables that he didn't discuss at all (i.e. the agreement says that Citi will cover the AAA fee but on the AAA site, it says they won't process without the fee. Or how damages were quantified). Instead he chose a snarky response. But I guess i shouldn't expect much on the internet.

radonc1 Aug 4, 2020 9:55 am


Originally Posted by goramblers21 (Post 32580810)
Except there are many variables that he didn't discuss at all (i.e. the agreement says that Citi will cover the AAA fee but on the AAA site, it says they won't process without the fee. Or how damages were quantified). Instead he chose a snarky response. But I guess i shouldn't expect much on the internet.

I believe that there was some discussion of this in the Citibank forum when AA shut down accounts due to "bad behavior". You may want to search that thread. You could also simply call AAA and ask.
If I remember correctly, you did not have to pay a fee to file (but I could be wrong).I have never done it so I will not be any help.

goramblers21 Aug 4, 2020 9:58 am


Originally Posted by radonc1 (Post 32580827)
I believe that there was some discussion of this in the Citibank forum when AA shut down accounts due to "bad behavior". You may want to search that thread. You could also simply call AAA and ask.
If I remember correctly, you did not have to pay a fee to file (but I could be wrong).I have never done it so I will not be any help.

I appreciate your response. Thanks!

deker0 Aug 5, 2020 10:47 am


Originally Posted by goramblers21 (Post 32580836)
I appreciate your response. Thanks!

Please keep us updated on how it goes.

GundamWing01 Aug 6, 2020 3:17 am


Originally Posted by ketelone (Post 32575321)
So my wife sent a letter to Citi pleading her case and requesting reinstatement. Got the reply finally (same reply for all 3 cards that were closed).
1) spending not typical consumer purchases
2) payment from anonymous sources
part 2) stopped a while ago in beginning March 2020 but when you get eyeball on your account then they can go back and see it. So feels like somehow 1) triggered a manual review and 2) sealed the deal.

Anyways, thanks for previous advice and suggestions. I am swearing off WM billpay completely. Its going to be slow and steady MO deposit and paying bill from bank account from now on. Very expensive lesson to learn.

when was the last time you did WMBP? something doesnt make sense. you essentially stopped MS activity since march, yet you got shutdown in july. something must have triggered it recently for manual review. but once eyes were on your account, thats game over. they didnt like the low volume MS of 5k/mo and WMBP. but WMBP is the kiss of death. i still do not understand the risk/reward ratio people accept for WMBP.

also, you had mentioned you let your statements close with balances. how high are these balances? that would have triggered a review.

MaxVO Aug 6, 2020 5:12 am


Originally Posted by GundamWing01 (Post 32585187)
... something doesnt make sense. you essentially stopped MS activity since march, yet you got shutdown in july. ...

Shutting down accounts with little activity was not a priority during the lockdown.

radonc1 Aug 6, 2020 6:22 am


Originally Posted by MaxVO (Post 32585318)
Shutting down accounts with little activity was not a priority during the lockdown.

I agree but...
Once the Rats have their beady little eyes on your account, all the warts show up through the mascara and for some banks like Chase or Citi, it takes little to can a relationship, especially a non-profitable one. ;)

GundamWing01 Aug 6, 2020 3:40 pm


Originally Posted by MaxVO (Post 32585318)
Shutting down accounts with little activity was not a priority during the lockdown.


Originally Posted by radonc1 (Post 32585432)
I agree but...
Once the Rats have their beady little eyes on your account, all the warts show up through the mascara and for some banks like Chase or Citi, it takes little to can a relationship, especially a non-profitable one. ;)

true. maybe the account was already slated for shutdown and the pandemic delayed the final response. maybe secondary review and approval was required, but couldnt finalize. that would make sense because citi HATES WMBP. i rarely hear about 5k/mo MS being shutdown by any bank except synch, USB, comenity etc. unless there were other triggers. im also wondering if OP let his high balances close. that would have caused credit review during the pandemic.

coolguy100 Aug 20, 2020 10:24 am

all my citi, c1, Barclays cards have been closed in the past several months...Barclays closed all my cards yesterday. I have been doing Simon and WM BP.

Citi double cash around 40k per month (within CL) C1 40k per month (2x cl). barclays 70k per month(2x cl). citi shut down first, then C1, then barclays.

folks only Simon no WM BP might last longer?

nall Aug 20, 2020 11:27 am


Originally Posted by coolguy100 (Post 32617511)
all my citi, c1, Barclays cards have been closed in the past several months...Barclays closed all my cards yesterday. I have been doing Simon and WM BP.

What volumes, roughly?

littlewinglet Aug 20, 2020 12:34 pm


Originally Posted by coolguy100 (Post 32617511)
all my citi, c1, Barclays cards have been closed in the past several months...Barclays closed all my cards yesterday. I have been doing Simon and WM BP.

Sounds like xxxxxx(citi) and C1 are waging a war on MS, no coincidence that many of us suddenly got shut down. Barclays shut me down almost 3 years ago but I was doing 10k/day in Simon MS and cashing out right away.

radonc1 Aug 21, 2020 5:30 am


Originally Posted by coolguy100 (Post 32617511)
all my citi, c1, Barclays cards have been closed in the past several months...Barclays closed all my cards yesterday. I have been doing Simon and WM BP.

Citi double cash around 40k per month (within CL) C1 40k per month (2x cl). barclays 70k per month(2x cl). citi shut down first, then C1, then barclays.

folks only Simon no WM BP might last longer?

With interest rates so low, what financial activity that use to be insect bites to a large bank have now become more like a fish gutting to their bottom line.

As AI becomes more prevalent in business software, it isn't surprising that someone who is charging $50K-150K a month and cycling their credit line will get their account pulled for the friendly Rats to munch over. And once they start to chew, it probably doesn't take them too long to see why those accounts are showing up in the first place.

I don't think that Simon is doing anyone any favors. IMO, it won't be long before every bank has "Simon" in their AI algorithms as something that needs to be "checked".

I have an uneasy feeling that there are going to be many more shut downs in the coming months. While I hope I am incorrect, I am certainly using Simon in a very cautious and minimal fashion.

edb55 Aug 22, 2020 7:20 pm

Citi AA Business Platinum Shutdown.
I have been using the credit card for about 12 months now and did a little MS back in Novemebr19/ January 20. Normally spend upwards of 18-20K/mo on the card. This month was the first time I purchased Simon online and did so for 12K while having 5K organic spend on the card. I was shut down and am expecting a letter in the mail as per phone conversation. All of this within 7 days of ordering Simon online. Don't have much confidence in this new environment we seem to be in.
No WMBP on the account and always paid from same checking account


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