Qwkynuf

As in the title, I'm not sure about how rollover nights work this year. As of today I am sitting at "108 nights, including 54 rollover nights", according to my profile page. I have a 5 night stay this week, which gets me to 113. I know that normally if I were to finish a year with 120 nights, 60 would roll over to give me Diamond for the next year.

Coming into 2021, I carried over 54. 30 was used to give me Diamond through 2022, and 24 basically don't count for anything. Do I understand correctly that one more night will give me 60 rollover to assure Diamond through calendar year 2023? (Based on 114 nights minus 54 rollover = 60 to roll over into next year?)

Does that sound right?

jerry a. laska

Ignoring the nights that rolled over from 2020, the nights you stay in 2021 in excess of 30 will rollover to assist you in achieving status in 2022.
From hiltonhonors:
In your example,
54 nights rollover from 2020
114 nights in 2021 subtract 54 rollover from 2020 and subtract 30 nights nights to renew for 2021 = 30 rollover
See this thread from last month:
Retaining Diamond in 2022

See post 10 below.

Fanjet

I don't think that is right. OP had 54 rollover nights from last year (2020). That automatically qualified him for Diamond status next year in 2022, as the requirement is only 30 nights in 2021. If that were not the case, he would have only needed 6 "new" nights this year to do so. But basically, out of those 54 rollover nights, 24 were simply discarded as only 30 were needed. Thus, any "new" nights the OP has stayed since the start of this year will rollover into his 2022 calculations (up to 60 nights). If he will be at 113 nights this year after his upcoming stay, he will have 59 nights so far which will rollover into 2022 (113-54=59).

jerry a. laska

Yeah thanks. You are correct, I confused myself when I added the part applying the formula to OPs example and subtracted the nights needed to achieve status again. So returning to the OPs example:
114 nights as of his next stay
- 54 rollover nights
- 0 nights needed to achieve status in 2021
= 60 nights to rollover to 2022, thereby reaching diamond status in 2022 and starting the whole process over again.
See post 10 below.

DiverDave

After much perusal and some headaches, I have come to the conclusion that your original post here is actually correct.

Rollover only applies to qualifying nights stayed in the current year. In the OP's case, that would be 60.

Then the nights to qualify for Diamond are subtracted, even though OP has more than qualified because of the rollover nights. Remember that in the world of Hilton, nights only rollover once: "Elite rollover nights are only valid for the next calendar year and expire thereafter. Elite rollover nights cannot be reserved and applied to a second, third year or subsequent year."

Basically since OP has 60 nights this year, rollover nights were of no benefit to OP other than to qualify (or requalify) for Diamond earlier than would have been the case otherwise.

Long story short, I think your original calculation of 60 earned in 2021 minus 30 required to qualify for Diamond in 2021 yields 30 rollover nights is correct.

Or just see: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/33322513-post2.html

David

Fanjet

Every night the OP stays this year will be a rollover night on January 1st (and only 60 of them actually being needed). All of the rollover nights the OP carried over from 2020 will be gone on that date as well. Because the OP had 54 rollover nights from 2020, and only 30 nights are needed this year for 2022 qualification, none of the "new" nights the OP has stayed this year are needed for that, as he automatically renewed his 2022 status at the beginning of this year. Thus, all of the OP's "new" nights this year are being rolled over into next year's calculations. And they in turn will all expire on January 1, 2023.

Qwkynuf

I think that this was what I was thinking, but I wasn't able to state it so succinctly.

Basically, the 54 nights that I rolled over from last year bought me Diamond on Jan 1 and then cease to exist (for future status purposes). The 59 nights I will have by the end of this week will roll over into 2022, along with whatever else I accumulate in the next 5.5 months, earning me status for 2023, and then those "go away" too.

DiverDave

Hilton's example is lousy, but seems to indicate otherwise. The 20 rollover nights bought Gold status, but Hilton did not roll over all of the 2021 nights in the example. The example indicates they will deduct the nights for whatever status would have been earned solely by 2021 stays. In the example that is 5 nights, and in the OP's case that would be 30 nights. I would agree that Hilton has done an amazing job to make this as clear as mud.

"Example: You start 2021 with 20 rollover nights, earning yourself Gold Status. In 2021, you stayed 8 nights. For 2022, you will have 3 rollover nights (8 nights - 5 nights needed for Silver). None of the 20 nights of rollover from 2020 count into 2022."

https://hiltonhonors3.hiltond3.com/rs/even-more/faq/

MP001

Yes, from the example provided it seems that the rolled over nights from last year are used just in case you don't earn enought nights to reach your current status this year; a sort of "spare nights" you have in case you need to top up and reach the status

jerry a. laska

Alright, after reviewing old posts related to rollover nights, I now agree with DiverDave that my first post was actually correct. You can only earn rollover nights in a year when the nights actually stayed in that year exceed those needed to qualify at the status level that year; only those nights that exceed that status level requirement actually rollover. In a normal year a diamond with 61 nights in a year will rollover 1 night. In 2021, a diamond member must have at least 30 nights and nights in excess of 30 will rollover to 2022. While rollover nights applied to the next year will allow a person to prequalify for a status level, those rollover nights will not apply when calculating rollover nights for that year; to rollover nights the nights stayed in a year must always exceed the status qualification requirement for that year.

So after all this the formula I applied to the OPs scenario in my first post is correct. 54 nights rollover from 2020 to 2021. Based upon the lower status threshold for 2021, the OP has requalified for diamond. But rollover nights for the next year (2022) do not start to accumulate until the OPs nights stayed in 2021 exceed the diamond qualification amount, in this case 30. The OPs nights stayed in 2021 that exceed 30 will rollover to 2022.

54 nights rollover. 114 nights including the 54 rollover as of the OPs next night in 2021.
Applying the rollover from hilton.com:
114 nights
-54 rollover nights
-30 diamond qualification requirement for 2021
=30 nights rollover to 2022.

Sorry for all the confusion everyone.

See also these threads:
How does rollover work?
Roll over nights question
Roll Over Nights Question
Nights Rollover Multiple Years
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hilton-hilton-honors/1996187-hilton-rollover-night-credits.html

DiverDave

I think we can thank Hilton for the confusion.

But I will say that I think rollover is a good benefit, though as far as I can remember it has not been of any benefit to me. I have qualified for Diamond based on actual nights stayed during the year as far as I know all the way back to the end of the rolling tier era. (Now that was confusing, but fun to manipulate. )

This could be the first year that rollover helps me as I rolled over 60 nights (thus already Diamond qualified) and only have 15 nights to date. At this time I do expect to clear the 30 night threshold unless the pandemic returns in force. But I don't expect much of a rollover for me this year, certainly nothing close to 60 nights.

Cheers!
David

Fanjet

But what Hilton is using in that example doesn't even make sense. If the member carries over 20 nights from 2020 into 2021, that means he will automatically be Gold for 2022. If he stays an additional 8 nights in 2021, that leaves his year-end totals at 28 nights (20+8). And doesn't do anything further for him regarding 2022 status. So, I don't see how using Silver status requirements factors into their example, given that he will be Gold in 2022, not Silver. It seems that either 1) all of those 8 nights don't rollover into 2022 because he did not stay at least 20 nights in 2021-- and which is the requirement this year to achieve Gold status for 2022, or 2) all of those 8 nights rollover into 2022 because none of them were needed for his 2021 totals.

craigthemif

Amusing thread... that shows how confusing Hilton has made things...

My understanding is that 2020 rollover nights are worthless for determining how many nights will into 2022. Rollover nights ONLY help you reach targets when you wouldn't otherwise get there. They don't help you retain Diamond indefinitely. Otherwise a "credit card Diamond" could say "well, I'm already Diamond so I needed zero nights --> everything rolls forward a year"

In other words, only the actual 2021 nights in bed above 30 will rollover to 2022 for Diamonds.

Fanjet

Actually, how I think it goes based on Hilton's FAQ example posted upthread. It doesn't matter what one's actual status will be in the upcoming year in determining one's rollver night into that year. It's based upon how many nights one stayed in the current year, and what status that would have given otherwise. So, if someone walked into 2021 with 30 rollover nights from 2020, they are automatically Diamond for 2022. If they, in turn, stayed 12 nights this year, they will carry over 7 nights into 2022 (12-5=7). If they stayed 24 nghts this year, they will have 4 rollover nights for next year (24-20=4). If they stayed 36 nights this year, they will have 6 rollover nights for 2022 (36-30=6). Even though not matter what, they will be Diamond for next year.

It's the most convoluted elite rollover scheme I can think of for any program (IHG, Delta). Even more so given that Hilton put the brakes on someone being able to turn 300 stayed nights in one calendar year into 5 consecutive years of Diamond status, by making a rollover night expire after one year.

craigthemif

The example provided by Hilton cannot possibly be correct.

For example, I could renew Gold with 10 stays and 19 nights. For the purposes of "rollover nights" that would mean that 14 roll over because I would have only qualified for Silver under the nights rule. Would be nice, but I've never had a single rollover night after qualifying via stays...