tipping cheat
Oct 18, 2008 | 12:37 pm
#211
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ewr,swf,fll
Posts: 835
4444 - If you feel that way about your servers, YOU SHOULD PAY THEM BETTER IN THE FIRST PLACE and not blame customers who don't give better tips because of poor service. But since it WOULD cost you something, I am sure you won't pony up.
But then, tipping is NOT required is it? You crossed the line by implying that you want to take non-tippers into the alley. I spent many years working as a dishwasher, my only means of income, and I feel for the working poor, but I am not obligated to give them money just because you are too cheap to pay adequate wages. I have no intention of systematically giving 18%+ tips because of tip creep, and if you don't like it, yeah, please, take me into the alley so you can beat the s**t out of me. Let's see how your excuses fly in court and you not only go to jail, but will lose everything. If I knew what restaurants you had a stake in, I would never enter the establishments. You are not the one doing me a favor by letting me eat at your restaurant, it is my choice and I do so at my pleasure. There are so many restaurants, do you really think that I HAVE to eat at yours?
Also, who are you to say that if people are poor they should stay home? I guess we should just lock the poor up so people like you won't get worked up that they are not throwing enough money at you. If I ever left a bad tip (cannot think of a time I have), it would mean that I have no intention of coming back because of poor service.
But then, tipping is NOT required is it? You crossed the line by implying that you want to take non-tippers into the alley. I spent many years working as a dishwasher, my only means of income, and I feel for the working poor, but I am not obligated to give them money just because you are too cheap to pay adequate wages. I have no intention of systematically giving 18%+ tips because of tip creep, and if you don't like it, yeah, please, take me into the alley so you can beat the s**t out of me. Let's see how your excuses fly in court and you not only go to jail, but will lose everything. If I knew what restaurants you had a stake in, I would never enter the establishments. You are not the one doing me a favor by letting me eat at your restaurant, it is my choice and I do so at my pleasure. There are so many restaurants, do you really think that I HAVE to eat at yours?
Also, who are you to say that if people are poor they should stay home? I guess we should just lock the poor up so people like you won't get worked up that they are not throwing enough money at you. If I ever left a bad tip (cannot think of a time I have), it would mean that I have no intention of coming back because of poor service.
Oct 18, 2008 | 12:46 pm
#212
Join Date: May 2005
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Oct 18, 2008 | 12:50 pm
#213
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ewr,swf,fll
Posts: 835
lol. if the cop was your brother he wouldnt be able to help you in my town. dont try to be an internet toughguy and dont turn this around to make me the bad guy. the alley was an obvious joke. again read all the posts. im sticking up for the small guy here. i wouldnt have to if you losers were'nt so cheap.
Oct 18, 2008 | 1:01 pm
#214
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Homeless Nomad Wandering the Globe
Programs: Former AA EXP/2M Lifetime now Blackballed UA Premier Executive PWP Bronze
Posts: 5,938
Little OT, but let me chime in here....
South Beach and Miami are notorious for this. They add 18% on ALL bills. I HATE this!
I always tip 22-28%. BUT...when they add 18% for me and a work associate 2 things happen:
1-I feel wierd filling in only 10% or so on the EXTRA tip line!
2-The dragons who audit expense reports get wierd..asking WHY I tip so much. They are LAZY and dont figure out the % if its all in one, but with the extra they sometimes catch me..and question me.
So...for me...the server makes out LESS then when they DONT add 18%
South Beach and Miami are notorious for this. They add 18% on ALL bills. I HATE this!
I always tip 22-28%. BUT...when they add 18% for me and a work associate 2 things happen:
1-I feel wierd filling in only 10% or so on the EXTRA tip line!
2-The dragons who audit expense reports get wierd..asking WHY I tip so much. They are LAZY and dont figure out the % if its all in one, but with the extra they sometimes catch me..and question me.
So...for me...the server makes out LESS then when they DONT add 18%
there are a lot of euros and south americans that might have different tipping customs, so i kind of understand why.
that being said - no one ever said anything to me like "sir, you might not have noticed that the tip was included..." i can't imagine a scenario where i would tip 20% on top of 18%, and they surely knew it was an error.
buyer beware i guess.
i too have always tipped on the total , but i agree that tipping on tax seems excessive.
fwiw - i am usually a 20% tipper, but 15% if the service is bad. the problem i have with tipping (and this may be covered between page 2 and the last page) is that the server doesn't know what the tip represents. the server may assume i'm cheap when i think he sucks. i may think i am being generous and want to recognize good service, but the server may think it was just a rounded amount. it is very ambiguous and doesn't necessarily send the message that the patron thinks is being sent.
saying something negative to the server could be taken very hostile - especially if i plan on returning to the restaurant again.
say something to the manager, and they may think you are trying to get a freebie out of them.
Oct 18, 2008 | 1:19 pm
#216
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: San Jose, CA
Programs: UA Premier
Posts: 240
You have not addressed what got me all worked up - wanting to take a poor tipper into the alley. If your attitude became common knowledge, do you really believe that your business would not suffer. Yeah, let us know what restaurants you are involved in and since you don't need our business, we won't go. Of course, I expect you to be to cowardly to tell us (as in the previous post).
I think the same about athletes, prima donas like yourself who provide no redeeming value to society. It is just entertainment, nothing more and I and wouldn't kiss any athletes a**. I don't go to sports games nor do I watch them and now have even less incentive.
Oct 18, 2008 | 1:35 pm
#217
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ewr,swf,fll
Posts: 835
I, for the life of me, cannot figure out why you would get so upset then about tipping (if you pay above average wages) that you would want to harm anyone who doesn't give a good tip. Maybe this is just your personality - you don't get your way so you want to get physical.
You have not addressed what got me all worked up - wanting to take a poor tipper into the alley. If your attitude became common knowledge, do you really believe that your business would not suffer. Yeah, let us know what restaurants you are involved in and since you don't need our business, we won't go. Of course, I expect you to be to cowardly to tell us (as in the previous post).
I think the same about athletes, prima donas like yourself who provide no redeeming value to society. It is just entertainment, nothing more and I and wouldn't kiss any athletes a**. I don't go to sports games nor do I watch them and now have even less incentive.
You have not addressed what got me all worked up - wanting to take a poor tipper into the alley. If your attitude became common knowledge, do you really believe that your business would not suffer. Yeah, let us know what restaurants you are involved in and since you don't need our business, we won't go. Of course, I expect you to be to cowardly to tell us (as in the previous post).
I think the same about athletes, prima donas like yourself who provide no redeeming value to society. It is just entertainment, nothing more and I and wouldn't kiss any athletes a**. I don't go to sports games nor do I watch them and now have even less incentive.
Oct 18, 2008 | 2:02 pm
#218
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Homeless Nomad Wandering the Globe
Programs: Former AA EXP/2M Lifetime now Blackballed UA Premier Executive PWP Bronze
Posts: 5,938
i've read 217 posts now, and i want to add a few more points - although this seems to be getting off topic:
1. when i first was introduced to tipping by my parents, i was told to double the tax. that works to include pre-tax and gets you around 15% - 19%. i think i will go back to that instead of 20% on the total. i am surprised no one mentioned this since it seems to be fairly common.
2. if you give the server your credit card immediately when the check is presented, a lot of times you get the credit card slips but not the paper bill and itemization. if you want to review the bill, do it before giving your card
3. at the end of the day - 200+ posts on what amounts to a $2 - $5 difference for most dining situations... i think it's kind of funny.
still, i think that the inability to communicate your satisfaction or dissatisfaction clearly is the single greatest problem with the current system.
if i owned a restaurant it would have a line for the tip amount and five boxes underneath to rate your server so that there a clear communication (and so that the management was able to see how guests felt about their servers).
1. when i first was introduced to tipping by my parents, i was told to double the tax. that works to include pre-tax and gets you around 15% - 19%. i think i will go back to that instead of 20% on the total. i am surprised no one mentioned this since it seems to be fairly common.
2. if you give the server your credit card immediately when the check is presented, a lot of times you get the credit card slips but not the paper bill and itemization. if you want to review the bill, do it before giving your card
3. at the end of the day - 200+ posts on what amounts to a $2 - $5 difference for most dining situations... i think it's kind of funny.
still, i think that the inability to communicate your satisfaction or dissatisfaction clearly is the single greatest problem with the current system.
if i owned a restaurant it would have a line for the tip amount and five boxes underneath to rate your server so that there a clear communication (and so that the management was able to see how guests felt about their servers).
Oct 18, 2008 | 4:17 pm
#219
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2000
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1. when i first was introduced to tipping by my parents, i was told to double the tax. that works to include pre-tax and gets you around 15% - 19%. i think i will go back to that instead of 20% on the total. i am surprised no one mentioned this since it seems to be fairly common.
2. if you give the server your credit card immediately when the check is presented, a lot of times you get the credit card slips but not the paper bill and itemization. if you want to review the bill, do it before giving your card
Oct 18, 2008 | 4:29 pm
#220
Join Date: Feb 2005
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i did address it. again you didnt read the whole thread. it is not poor tippers. it is cheapskates. big difference. it is people who think they are above or better than a person simply because they are a waiter. i see it every day all day. loser business types, in expensive suits, garbage rolex watches and their bmw that they cant afford, think they are better than someone who waits tables or sweeps floors. i dont tolerate it. is it my job or place to open my mouth? maybe not but i do. as far as providing no redeeming value to society? call me when you donate a couple hundred grand to childrens hospital or pay for a park to be built. dozens of charities benefit from me being an athlete. "prima donna" is someone who puts themselves first. again if you read the whole thread you will see that term does not apply....i'm glad that i am recovering from surgery and have time to play on this forum all day. shouldnt you guys be workin?
I'm sure you are a wonderful humanitarian and phillanthropist in the city which you seem to own.
If you make threats of in posts and that I'm afraid is what you unquestionably did do, It isn't a joke if you have to tell people several posts later that was what it was.
Your quote "if the cop was your brother he wouldnt be able to help you in my town" is somewhat sinister and if it is intended as a joke, again I'm afraid i think it is misguided.
Given the testorone heavy nature of your posts, can we assume your athletism is Power Lifting or The Tour de France.
I think you've made your point -
1. You pay your staff loads
2. Despite that, or maybe because of that, you think we should still tip heavilly no matter how indifferent the service is
3. Anyone who doesn't is a cheap deadbeat
4. You're the big man in your town
5. You donate oodles of your cash to worthy goods
6. People who drive BMWs and wear Rolexes are the route of all evil
Oct 18, 2008 | 7:21 pm
#222
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New York City/NY22
Programs: AA Platinum 2.3MM (Lifetime PLT)
Posts: 5,291
Then, guess what? I don't believe you really are a restaurant owner, just some trying to pad his post count. 
The New York Times once said of the old Ratner's restaurant in New York that the motto of the waiters seemed to be "the customer is rarely right."
This was, of course, satire.
I never believed that there existed someone in the restaurant business who believed "the customer is never right" unless the customer happened to agree with him.
The New York Times once said of the old Ratner's restaurant in New York that the motto of the waiters seemed to be "the customer is rarely right."
This was, of course, satire.
I never believed that there existed someone in the restaurant business who believed "the customer is never right" unless the customer happened to agree with him.
Oct 18, 2008 | 7:33 pm
#223
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ewr,swf,fll
Posts: 835
Then, guess what? I don't believe you really are a restaurant owner, just some trying to pad his post count.
The New York Times once said of the old Ratner's restaurant in New York that the motto of the waiters seemed to be "the customer is rarely right."
This was, of course, satire.
I never believed that there existed someone in the restaurant business who believed "the customer is never right" unless the customer happened to agree with him.
The New York Times once said of the old Ratner's restaurant in New York that the motto of the waiters seemed to be "the customer is rarely right."
This was, of course, satire.
I never believed that there existed someone in the restaurant business who believed "the customer is never right" unless the customer happened to agree with him.
and to kettering sloan northlands coliseum up there...power lifting and bike riding? you couldnt come up with better sports than those? are those even sports? as far as 1-6? you are correct. man i should have answered separately so i could get one more post. darn.
Oct 18, 2008 | 8:53 pm
#225
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Aurora, CO
Programs: Statusless and proud
Posts: 7,930
Keep in mind the opinions of the people who are "sticking up" for people in my profession do not necessarily share the same views of those in said profession, and in this case probably have nearly opposite views on most matters. Quite frankly, if an owner of a restaurant ever confronted a guest about how much they tipped, I'd find a new restaurant to work at, since we wouldn't exactly be looking out for the guest's benefit. (I only complain about tips behind closed doors, not to the guest's face )
Chris
)Chris