The luck of the Irish!

"Smooth" Rye? If true to its heritage, born from the haze induced by half a jug of Monongahela Popskull, a whiskey raw enough to strip the lining from a turkey's Gizzard, Rye ought not to be too smooth, my quarrel with Texas distillery's "Yellow Rose", smoother than a slatternly tavern wench's tongue. Drinking rye ought to be like kissing the thigh of a "Dirty leg" girl who hasn't shaved her legs in a while, a bit abrasive.....

That's the reason that you put Vermouth in a Manhattan, to cut the hard edge off the Rye Whiskey. If it's smooth you're after, there's always that Canajun stuff, little more (if more at all) than water, grain neutral spirits and caramel.

Sorry I don't agree that good strong Rye has to take paint off a wall. Bulleit makes a good Rye whiskey. I was hoping the Van Winkle Family Reserve would have been better. Because the Van Winkle Bourbon I had was certainly better than Bulleit Bourbon.

Your both right. A rough nasty Rye makes a better Manhattan. Bulleit Rye is hard to beat for the price and far superior to their Bourbon. My favorite Rye remains Whistle Pig from Vermont of all places.

Just FYI your favorite Rye is actually from Canada, but bottled in Vermont...

But they seem to be moving onto sourcing some of their Rye from American sources...

I think it's good, but they jack the prices up...

Source

There are a couple routes young distilleries can go while waiting for their stocks to mature- bottling other products, which is the route that High West and Smooth Ambler went. Or, releasing stuff that is young and really not that great (Hudson Baby Bourbon). Or, messing with all sorts of gimmicks to try to accelerate the aging process (staves, pressure, small barrels).... In my mind whiskey is a product that needs the requisite time to mature...

FDW

Have you tried Breckenridge Distillery? Had it while in Denver and it's one of my farovirtes. I was surprised to read that it's only aged 2-3 years.

Finally had a Woodford Reserve this week, pretty damn good in fact ^

Oh dear... I've tried it.. they are really into marketing.. "the bourbon that beat pappy.." I'll tell you, it's not bad actually.. but at the price point I find it to be not that great ($55 a bottle where I am). They too are engaged in a bit of deception... their product is sourced as well...They are apparently producing but I'm not sure if any of their own product has ended up in the bottle yet... I guess I'm a bit of a purist... I like knowing where the product is made.. a lot of places are obtaining product from somewhere else. I find that that's ok, but I would rather places be upfront about it.. Breckenridges goal is to eventually get to 100% of their own product but for example Whistlepig isn't even distilling yet.... At least they put their unique spin by cutting it with Colarodo snow melt...

For me, Four Roses Single Barrel at $35 is a much superior product... At that price point, I'm buying Elijah Craig Barrel Proof....
FDW

There was some contempt for those who drink Woodford and Coke on a DL thread. Woodford sells for about $30 for 750 ml so this didn't seem too sacrilegious, however, am I committing a faux pas by ordering this? They go together quite well I think.

I've got 30 years experience working and owning bars. IME, it's a waste of $$ to mix anything high end with coke, but it's you're $$ & Woodford isn't too expensive. I've even served Louis XIII w/coke at $150/drink. Generally, I'll pour a shot w/the coke on the side and ask them to taste it before they dump it in. Personally, there's no way I could tell what Bourbon was in the coke.

A local restaurant features a Woodford manhattan and I like it. However, I've never ordered a manhattan anywhere else, made with anything else (except for my poor attempts at home). For $8, I think I'm getting a pretty good deal.

That said, I don't think the vermouth kills the flavor of the bourbon quite the same as a glass full of coca cola would.

I did their distillery tour a earlier this year, and they said their product is now all produced in Breckenridge. Taking a bottle over to Sweden for my father-in-law.

Their vodka (which is also quite tasty) is still sourced.

"A local restaurant features a Woodford manhattan and I like it. However, I've never ordered a manhattan anywhere else, made with anything else (except for my poor attempts at home). For $8, I think I'm getting a pretty good deal."
Yup, that's a good deal. The 'designer liquor' phenomenon jacks sales, but it doesn't make it taste any better. Woodford is a little lighter than most and I find it kinda mapley. I would cut back on the sweet vermouth a little in this case. IMO usually most bartenders don't use enough vermouth. It gives the drink it's balls. It's not a Martini.

I stand corrected; I realized that they started distilling in 2009 and so they do have appropriately aged stock to make their own product. I do understand, though, for the purposes of blending and consistency that they do from time to time use outside product

FDW

Faux pas? We all have our eccentricities, yours no worse than the guy in the UK who enjoyed rolling in slurry of aging cow manure......

The question is why? I suspect that we could line up a dozen "blind" Bourbons/Blends/"Sour Mashes" & Coke, all the way from the working man's friend, Old Crow, to some exotic bottling from a chic new distillery, and your reaction to tasting would be amazingly unpredictable. You had just as well buy "Ancient Age" as one of the premiums, if B&C is your tipple.

Even more unlikely to be meaningful beyond simply looking pretentious are those who order "name brand" Cognac and Coke. The once popular "Brandy & Ginger" was the sundowner of choice for those who traveled far and were exposed to the somewhat doubtful brandies bottled in strange places. Italian "Stock" is fine in "caffe' correto", and mixed with Coke or Ginger Ale provides a flavor not much different than using fine Cognac. For most who commit the travesty of Cognac & Coke, they wouldn't know the difference if the barman cozened them (which as once a long ago a barman, I'll promise you they will...).

Remember.... The reason folks in Georgia often mix locally (and illegally) distilled "corn squeezins" with ice tea is 'cuz the damnable popskull tastes so bad otherwise.

But man can repent and recover from sin. After all, it seems only yesterday that a popular drink in NYC was a "Manhattan" made with the mildest flavored of Canadian blends and "White" Vermouth.