2010 Medallion Program
Aug 7, 2009 | 8:41 am
#541
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Highland PArk,IL,USA -- AA Lifetime Platinum, IHG Plat, UA Silver, Hilton Gold, Radisson Gold, Marriott Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 2,367
As always, we appreciate your feedback on our 2010 Medallion program. We’ve read your posts and while we can’t respond every day to each question, we’ll do our best to watch the forums regularly and respond to the major concerns. Also, as Jeff mentioned in his first post, we recognize we can’t please everyone, but we’re building a program that delivers top-to-bottom benefits to general members, Medallion members and the airline as a whole. Therefore, remember to judge the program as a whole compared to other programs as a whole, rather than strictly benefit by benefit.
With the Choice Benefits, SWU usage on day of departure does not require Z class inventory. If there is Z class available, you will be able to confirm your upgrade at booking. If it is not available, you will be placed on the waitlist. On the day of departure, provided there is an available seat in the premium cabin and you are booked in the appropriate fare class, we will clear anyone wishing to redeem their SWU for an upgrade. As far as the # of Choice Benefits, a status change will trigger the Choice Benefit. If your status changes to Platinum, you will be able to select one; if your status changes to Diamond, you will be able to select two. If you start out as Diamond and requalify (meaning no status change), you can select two.
As far as Diamond Medallion status goes, we are bringing back the Award fee waiver for DMs. Although there were instances of abuse in the past, we also understand that it is a valuable benefit for our most valuable customers. Given that there will be fewer DMs than PMs, providing this popular benefit to a smaller group of high-flying Medallions outweighs the possible abuse.
Many of you are wondering about Award inventory for DMs. Yes, DMs will have better inventory for Award seats than other Medallions at the lowest Award redemption level.
Regarding rollover segments, not all airlines offer segment qualification, so we’re proud that it’s still a cornerstone of our elite program. We focused our efforts and resources on rollover MQMs as most members qualify with miles (not segments). Plus, there are multiple ways to earn MQMs, so we wanted to be sure they were included.
Thanks!
With the Choice Benefits, SWU usage on day of departure does not require Z class inventory. If there is Z class available, you will be able to confirm your upgrade at booking. If it is not available, you will be placed on the waitlist. On the day of departure, provided there is an available seat in the premium cabin and you are booked in the appropriate fare class, we will clear anyone wishing to redeem their SWU for an upgrade. As far as the # of Choice Benefits, a status change will trigger the Choice Benefit. If your status changes to Platinum, you will be able to select one; if your status changes to Diamond, you will be able to select two. If you start out as Diamond and requalify (meaning no status change), you can select two.
As far as Diamond Medallion status goes, we are bringing back the Award fee waiver for DMs. Although there were instances of abuse in the past, we also understand that it is a valuable benefit for our most valuable customers. Given that there will be fewer DMs than PMs, providing this popular benefit to a smaller group of high-flying Medallions outweighs the possible abuse.
Many of you are wondering about Award inventory for DMs. Yes, DMs will have better inventory for Award seats than other Medallions at the lowest Award redemption level.
Regarding rollover segments, not all airlines offer segment qualification, so we’re proud that it’s still a cornerstone of our elite program. We focused our efforts and resources on rollover MQMs as most members qualify with miles (not segments). Plus, there are multiple ways to earn MQMs, so we wanted to be sure they were included.
Thanks!
I was EXP from 1998 to 2003 when I joined Worldperks.
No matter how you spin it without SWU that allow almost any fare class with good availability, not the "Z" class DL will NEVER EVER be close to AA for top tier. Also, if DL were smart and adds SWU's they should make the determination of lowest fare classes allowed. If they are only going to give 2 AKA NW than any fare in and booked directly in "C". If you offer 6 or 8 AKA UA or AA, than limit a few in classes and open up than the ridiculous "Z" class you use now.
IMHO with what you call best in class will backfire and you will react in a year or two AKA sLUT fares, to stop the bleeding of several people leaving.
Aug 7, 2009 | 8:46 am
#542
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Under an ORD approach path
Programs: DL PM, MM. Coffee isn't a drug, it's a vitamin.
Posts: 12,935
As far as the # of Choice Benefits, a status change will trigger the Choice Benefit. If your status changes to Platinum, you will be able to select one; if your status changes to Diamond, you will be able to select two. If you start out as Diamond and requalify (meaning no status change), you can select two.
I laid out the math upstream, but there is a lot of incentive for high mileage fliers to just ping-pong, PM one year, DM the next, while putting the rest of
their miles on a competing program. As you confirm here, a ping-pong flier can get the same total number of choice benefits as a full time DM (although the full time DM gets marginally bigger gifts in their choices).
You really need to tweak the system, throw more bones to the DM's, or they are just going to take their extra travel and book it elsewhere. It seems like you view Diamond as a subset of the higher mileage fliers of PM, so you separated out that subset and gave them a couple extras; it doesn't feely like you actually created a new real upper level top tier.
As to rollover segments, did you actually decide not to include them, or was that just overlooked and now the decision is entrenched?
Aug 7, 2009 | 8:53 am
#543
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Huntsville, AL
Programs: DL DM 2.017 MM, Hilton Life Diamond, IHG Diamond, Avis CHM, Marriott Titanium (life gold), AA Gold
Posts: 8,052
As far as Diamond Medallion status goes, we are bringing back the Award fee waiver for DMs. Although there were instances of abuse in the past, we also understand that it is a valuable benefit for our most valuable customers. Given that there will be fewer DMs than PMs, providing this popular benefit to a smaller group of high-flying Medallions outweighs the possible abuse.
Many here argued that you could have come up with a better system to prevent the problem, and that was never rebutted.
The least you could have done is thrown more waivers to the PMs.
David
Aug 7, 2009 | 8:54 am
#544
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Under an ORD approach path
Programs: DL PM, MM. Coffee isn't a drug, it's a vitamin.
Posts: 12,935
Here's what the new program accomplishes- there are a lot of 150k to 175k fliers who were putting 75k a year on DL to reach PM, and then booking everything else on a competing airline. Now a good number of those people will book 125k a year on DL (or 100k if they are smart and pingpong the system, as I described above), and book the rest of their revenue travel on competing airlines.
So, the program helps DL, but they're still leaving a huge amount of money on the table. They could have done much better for themselves.
So, the program helps DL, but they're still leaving a huge amount of money on the table. They could have done much better for themselves.
Aug 7, 2009 | 3:40 pm
#545
Join Date: May 2008
Programs: DL AA UA
Posts: 2,359
As always, we appreciate your feedback on our 2010 Medallion program. We’ve read your posts and while we can’t respond every day to each question, we’ll do our best to watch the forums regularly and respond to the major concerns. Also, as Jeff mentioned in his first post, we recognize we can’t please everyone, but we’re building a program that delivers top-to-bottom benefits to general members, Medallion members and the airline as a whole. Therefore, remember to judge the program as a whole compared to other programs as a whole, rather than strictly benefit by benefit.
Yes, you will never please everyone, but you are relying on that truism to counter the growing discontent in regards to the DM program you have announced. The issues have been discussed ad nauseum in this and similar threads in the DL forum, but in a nutshell, it falls short of your goal to be best in class. My unsolicited advice: Don't be so prideful, take a look at what your customers are saying and go back to the drawing board, really, just a little tweaking could do a world of good. I certainly understand that those of you developing this program spent thousands of man hours on the entire program and were happy with the end result, or at least pleased that you finished. However, after seeing feedback from your customers, a second look might be in order. I will agree that perhaps FT isn't a significant sample of SkyMiles general members, however, I do believe it is a representative sample of your higher mileage flyers. Do the right thing for both DL and its customers. Don't be penny wise and pound foolish.
At least for me, the reason I am still hanging around is DL's excellent front line employees. However, decisions like this from management certainly can, if not corrected, send me to other carriers with greater benefits for high mileage flyers. I don't think I am alone in that sentiment, and the former NW flyers probably won't even give you as much benefit of the doubt as I or other similar situated DL flyers will.
Aug 7, 2009 | 4:05 pm
#546
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Gone to Carolina in my mind
Programs: AA ExpMM, DL 2MM, IHG Spire/RA
Posts: 1,986
Thank you for the clarification Jeff.
I'm sure there will be some more minor points to hash out as things move along.
One question from me:
Will the day of departure SWUs clear before or after NRSAs into the premium cabin? (such as buddy passes). Not critical, just curious about the pecking order.
Thanx.
I'm sure there will be some more minor points to hash out as things move along.
One question from me:
Will the day of departure SWUs clear before or after NRSAs into the premium cabin? (such as buddy passes). Not critical, just curious about the pecking order.
Thanx.
Aug 7, 2009 | 4:59 pm
#548
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: check swarm
Programs: DL DM & 2MM, AS Gold, SPG LT Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, Cava Sun member
Posts: 14,439
Also, it seems as though SkyMilesInsider is going to skirt the issue of just how much backlash they are getting about the NW WP members having a similar program in the past.
Aug 7, 2009 | 5:17 pm
#549
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Gone to Carolina in my mind
Programs: AA ExpMM, DL 2MM, IHG Spire/RA
Posts: 1,986
Aug 7, 2009 | 5:19 pm
#550
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: HH Diamond, Marriott, IHG, Hyatt something
Posts: 34,519
When you can only get subpar awards many months in advance, you often have to take what's there, before it disappears. When a better leg comes up later, they then want $100 or $50 to change it. All the Plats I know refunded tickets when they knew they wouldn't use them, or changed them when a new itin just came up. Without the fight that the NW folk put up in February and March, there would be no $50 changes for Plats, or 2 free ones, either.
Even today, I canceled an award flight the day before Thanksgiving, since I wasn't going to need it.
Aug 7, 2009 | 5:42 pm
#551
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Beverly Hills, CA
Programs: DL DM & 2MM, UA-PE, AA
Posts: 1,077
Here's what the new program accomplishes- there are a lot of 150k to 175k fliers who were putting 75k a year on DL to reach PM, and then booking everything else on a competing airline. Now a good number of those people will book 125k a year on DL (or 100k if they are smart and pingpong the system, as I described above), and book the rest of their revenue travel on competing airlines.
So, the program helps DL, but they're still leaving a huge amount of money on the table. They could have done much better for themselves.
So, the program helps DL, but they're still leaving a huge amount of money on the table. They could have done much better for themselves.
If I was a 150-175k flier I would probably reach PM on DL and PM/Exp on AA (or similarly on UA).
With the weak DM benefits and the disappointed PMs (perceived reduced benefits), I don't think that the changes help DL! IMHO I think they help AA and UA!
Last edited by DP-340; Aug 8, 2009 at 12:41 pm
Aug 8, 2009 | 9:37 am
#552
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: ATL
Programs: DL SkyMiles PM/2MM, AA Plat, IC Diam. Amb., Peninsula regular, amanjunkie
Posts: 5,849
With the Choice Benefits, SWU usage on day of departure does not require Z class inventory. If there is Z class available, you will be able to confirm your upgrade at booking. If it is not available, you will be placed on the waitlist. On the day of departure, provided there is an available seat in the premium cabin and you are booked in the appropriate fare class, we will clear anyone wishing to redeem their SWU for an upgrade. As far as the # of Choice Benefits, a status change will trigger the Choice Benefit. If your status changes to Platinum, you will be able to select one; if your status changes to Diamond, you will be able to select two. If you start out as Diamond and requalify (meaning no status change), you can select two.
Aug 9, 2009 | 6:09 pm
#553
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: WAS
Programs: AA EXP2M, DL 1MM DM ext, UA PP <=> HH G/Marr PE/Hyatt G/IHG P FT RA ( Recovering Addict)
Posts: 4,903
With the Choice BenefitsAs far as the # of Choice Benefits, a status change will trigger the Choice Benefit. If your status changes to Platinum, you will be able to select one; if your status changes to Diamond, you will be able to select two. If you start out as Diamond and requalify (meaning no status change), you can select two.
Thanks!
I read somewhere in FT that the 2010 rules state (I think ) that Plats can gift silver and diamonds can gift gold. If I make 125 in 2009, I am diamond for 2010, but can I gift status or will I get Skyclub access for 2010?