jrkmsp

And the 777X isn't under consideration. In fact, the 77W isn't either. Richard Anderson spoke to Aviation Week and told them Delta will consider the A359 and A3510, the A333, a hypothetical A333neo and all three of the 788, 789 and 7810.

http://www.aviationweek.com/Article....4PwsUZ.twitter

If that winds up being their menu, it will definitely represent a downgauge in capacity from the 744. Granted, the A3510 can come pretty close but, as United said, it's not a true 744 replacement. What do you all think?

bubbashow

I think the Airbus family offers a better comfort level than the Boeing in the standard airline configurations.

readywhenyouare

Anderson doesn't want the 777X because it is an "experimental airplane?

How is the 777X any more experimental than an A330NEO? At least we know a 777X will be built. There has been no commitment to an A330NEO.

And how are they considering the 788 when they already have 20 on order?

Of course he also thinks the 787 and A350 are now "well down the road". What a joke. The A350 is not even in revenue service yet.

jimrpa

Ewwww, not more Airbii
Any chance they can just resurrect some nice L1011s or MD-11s instead?

Chalky White

Second on the L1011!

cdubose98

I suspect what he means is that a lot more reworking is going into the 777X than would be involved in an A330NEO. RE: the A350, it may not be in revenue service, but it does now have actual in-flight data that can be compared against other airframes.

One would think that the 788 would be the best 767 replacement in terms of efficiency and capacity, but I suspect A330s would be available sooner and cheaper. And I am not especially surprised that the 777X is not being evaluated (at least publicly), since it may not be available soon enough for DL's needs. That would seemingly open the door for the 77W and the A35J. The former in particular would be available at a significant discount and would fit well with DL's recent modus operandi for aircraft purchases recently.

Also, regarding the question of what is and isn't a true 747 replacement, I'm not convinced DL will need a true 747 replacement in the near future. If NRT continues to diminish in importance, that would significantly reduce the need for an aircraft of that size, since only 3 current 744 routes do not begin or end at NRT. For routes like HNL-NRT, DTW-NGO/ICN, and JFK-TLV, DL could probably make do with a 77W or A35J if they needed to.

jrkmsp

I suspect range will end up being a major factor in whatever they choose — and it's probably what makes the current A333 untenable. Delta needs some economical planes with long range to serve Asia from ATL (which you know they want to do) and to overfly NRT.

jimrpa

Just curious:
1. Why do they want to serve Asia from ATL specifically? They have JFK, DTW, and MSP?
2. Why overfly NRT? Is it to provide more point-to-point service, avoiding the NRT connection?
3. Isn't what you're describing the exact mission profile the 787-9 was designed for (i.e., the "long, thin routes")?
4. Wasn't Anderson whining about the 777's being uneconomical for East Coast-Europe service because their range was too long (and implying that the A330, particularly if it was re-engined, although he didn't explain why he didn't like the current engines, was a *wonderful* aircraft for that mission)?

misterbean

I don't know...
I'm pretty sure DL flies the 744 on NRT-JFK so it would be there for JFK-TLV.

TrojanTraveler

I think what he meant is that you don't necessarily need a 747 on these routes. For example, when DL still had JFK-AMM, it flew one of the 76 versions on this route. There may be other reasons for a 747 for a route, but distance isn't one of them.

misterbean

I meant that DL wants the capacity of the 747 on JFK-TLV, not the range.
I could see DL substituting the 747 for 2x daily on this route, but not downgauging the 1x daily.

Throw Down Your Leavy Screens

Wouldn't going to 2X 772 require more flight crew, and certainly more fuel, than the 1X 744?

jrkmsp

1. Maybe they don't. But Delta is built around Atlanta. Yes, it has and uses other hubs, but I'd be shocked if Delta didn't want to connect key business markets like PVG and perhaps PEK with its megahub in ATL.

2. This is already playing out. NRT-ICN, NRT-PEK and others cut, in favor of the TPAC hub at SEA. And they've talked about trying to put less emphasis on NRT, in part because of the sluggish economy and sinking Yen.

3. Sure. I was suggesting that range might be a big factor in what DL chooses, like choosing a package of 787s.

4. Yes. So they're not going to pick 50 of one airplane. They're going to pick either a mix of 787 types, or the A359 and A3510, or perhaps the A333 and the A3510.

squatch

it'll be sad to see the 744 go

mmichael453

RA's stated widebody requirements:

275 seats
5000-5500 NM range

One assumes that he also wants better TCO and fuel economy than the A330s he's got now. Oddly the two requirements above are almost exactly an A330 in present Delta configuration (ie the 3L3s). His requirements are slightly larger and with slightly less range than the 76L.

His reasoning for rejecting the 77X seems specious to me. He could simply have said "bigger and longer legs than I want to pay for for this" and been done with it.

Certainly, given how closely this requirement matches todays A330-300s, new A330-300s make a lot of sense. The A350 variants and the B787 variants all seem to be specced to carry more fuel than RA wants.

The 757 replacement is a whole 'nother problem. I guess Delta is dissatisfied with their 739s? Or maybe he just wants to remind Boeing he doesn't have to buy more of those? Or maybe he doesn't think he can get 739s and doesn't want to pick up 737 Max's before they've had more time to prove themselves? Here the A321-200 seems to match the spec pretty closely too.