Originally Posted by bocastephen

Originally Posted by dean1121 View Post
Dude, you have no concept what it's like to fly 350k+ and spend 100k and duke it out with a fake DM. $$$$ based program, bring it on.


"Duke it out" for what? If you have the money to spend on travel and don't mind doing so, then just buy a F/Y or B ticket and sit up front and not worry about "fake DMs"

voila - there is a $$$$ based program, just for you.

Originally Posted by SamuelS

Thanks for elucidating this point so succinctly. ^

Note to self... next time I sneak past into F with my GM tag showing, probably from some IROPS rebooking into fake Y, I will be sure to keep my holster out the ready.

Originally Posted by Thomas Hudson

Maybe Delta can hire Gunnery Sgt Hartman to humiliate LU and T fare Meds before each flight to really let them know that they are not going to sit around and take it from those cheapskates any more....

Originally Posted by dean1121

Perhaps a GS/White envelope real elite level might be a better way to go, state up front what you have to do and let people go for it.

Sounds like they are going scorched earth on the whole program and starting again.

Originally Posted by saleenxp8

I wonder what happens when someone purchases low-fare high-mileage tickets for travel well into next year, when the ticket mileage was an integral component of the purchase process. Just yesterday I chose to book a connection through DTW instead of SLC to make an additional 700 MQMs on my trip. What will DL do to protect the purpose of my travel?? Sounds like a claim in equity for detrimental reliance. Granted, this program is out of control. You should see what I have been dealing with for the past several weeks with the SkyBonus program. Telling me things are in the T&Cs when they don't appear anywhere near the T&Cs. Crazy people working at this airline I tell you....

Originally Posted by jsmith50

So, I'll bite on this...I have been told several times by DL that I am a HVC. I flew 300K+ miles BIS in 2011, spent over $100K (mostly through full J tpacs, and refundable Y bought last minute) in 2011 and I have banked millions, literally millions of SMs (DL dining, AmEx promotions, DL promotions, Hilton double dip bonuses, etc.) that I have virtually never redeemed in the 11 years now that I have been flying DL. Why, then, would I care negatively about a revenue-based program? Simple...further devaluation of the SMs that I have accumulated. I figure that at some point, my days of heavy flying and long hours with entire months some times spent on the road will eventually come to an end. The accumulation of FF miles is a spoil of living such a life in business. When I walk away, I want to be able to use those miles for my wife and I to travel and fly whatever class of service we want to sit in and never have to worry about giving DL a credit card number ever again to purchase a ticket.

If DL goes to a strictly fare-based program, then those miles I have accumulated with plans on using them in retirement have zero value or very limited value. For those reasons, if this is the future direction of the program, it stinks! It screws over every one of us that has been loyal to this airline for so many years when we could have been flying a competitor for less money. It is precisely because of loyalty that I have stuck around with DL now for the last decade through all the bad business decisions and through the current and ongoing devaluation of the SM program. It will also be precisely because of the feeling of being stabbed in the back that I would seriously consider the chance to status match to another airline and see what the grass is like on the other side!

Originally Posted by HongKonger

What a thread this has been so far, I bet another 20 pages minimum.

I have a slightly different perspective based on my personal travel needs. I fly mostly TPACs with a few domestic flights. My main concern is being able to upgrade from M fares into J using SWUs/miles (since the miles I earn on a TPAC M fare as a PM nearly pay for the UG), and to a lesser extent, into domestic F on domestic legs of TPACs. If I am on a domestic flight that didn't have G availability and I don't get UGed, no big deal, though PMs have good UG rates on the domestic routes I usually fly. A smaller concern is lounge access on int'l itineraries.

Obviously I have no idea what it will take to make PM under this new system. But if my flying patterns will no longer get me to PM and hence the SWUs, I will just start looking for the cheapest fares and/or try to go to another airline where it will be easier to UG, if any exists.

The ex-Asia multi-city itineraries I fly on M fares usually cost around $3000, and I fly about 5-6 per year. I doubt spending $15-$18K directly on DL plus having a DL Amex makes me a HVC, but if DL doesn't want $18K for only taking up about 30 total seats per year, I will take my business elsewhere.

Originally Posted by DLdweeb

If LUT flyers were indeed a drag on DL, why do they keep offering the fares? Because they need those flyers to maximize profit per flight. A plane half full with Q and up fare pax probably loses money. Airlines need those LUT pax to fill the planes and maximize profit, because the incremental revenue falls straight to the bottom line. Now if they could fill the plane with Y pax, life would be great for them, but that rarely, if ever, happens.

If DL hates LUT flyers, just stop offering those fare buckets. Simple as that.

Originally Posted by MSPeconomist

FWIW I've been convinced for a while that DL has been rating customers within at least higher tier elite levels. I see a lot of cases where not all DMs are treated equally and I do not think it is random. DL doesn't need EP/White Envelope when they have the NW seven levels of Platinum Elite system. Six unpublished levels are better than one.

Originally Posted by aubreyfromwheaton

6 segments @ $450 - $200 (value choice bennie conservatively) = $250/75000 = equiv of 0.33 cpm

Originally Posted by MSPeconomist

You're lucky that you're based in Asia. Recently I've been seeing M TPAC fares exUSA come in at about $5500 including taxes and fees. I haven't seen a TPAC M close to $3000 since about the time of the merger; shortly before the merger, TPAC upgradeable fares on NW were about $2300 RT IME.