DL2SXM

where are you seeing $5K? I can find just about any DL M fare for a shade under/over $4K. Its only as lopsided as you say if you compare delta's highest M fare against UA's lowest. In my opnion, DL's revamped hard product is worth the extra $$$ anyway. i am done with this argument.

DL2SXM

Are all you really that thick-headed? The disparity in price is not that great. Again, if you find DL's highest YBM fare and compare against UA's lowest upgradeable, then your weak argument holds water. And then again, factor in all the benies you DONT get on that cheap UA fare. Now I am really done with this argument!

mtkeller

Excerpting from another thread:

Those routes (perhaps with the exception of CDG-PHL/PIT) aren't heavy premium routes, and so the 757s seem to serve a purpose there. I seem to recall KEF being a route on which you could have as many low BE award seats as you wanted last summer. Let's compare that with where UA sends 757s, and I'll start the list with LHR (including from IAD for part of the summer). Yes, they're PMCO aircraft with better J seats than DL's 757s, but the standard objection to 757s TATL is that no one really wants to make that trip on a narrowbody.

ClipperDelta

Most certainly is...this past winter, the 757s were only used on JFK-DUB and JFK-DKR.
And now (spring), they are only on JFK-DKR, PHL-CDG, and PIT-CDG.

This summer, they will be on JFK-DKR/AGP/VLC/SNN/KEF, and CDG-PIT/PHL.

mother-

Try again.
or
I'm not going to sit here all day doing this, I think you get my point.

ClipperDelta

Uh, No. I can GUARANTEE you that JFK-BRU and JFK-FRA are operating with 767-300ERs. In fact, both have been 767s the entire winter...and if you still don't believe me, check www.benedelman.org/travel/dlseats and put in the appropriate flight numbers (DL140 JFK-BRU), (DL106 JFK-FRA) for any future date, and you will see a seatmap for the 767.

mother-

The flights were showing reconfigured 763s up until about a week ago when they all switched to 752.

ClipperDelta

In my link from above, DL106 and DL140 are all still 767 seatmaps. Delta.com Flight Schedules also show these as 767s, with flatbed icons. If you book on delta.com, you also get to select seats from a 767 seatmap. On Expertflyer, aircraft type is listed as "76W'...Expedia.com shows aircraft being "76W" when you book, etc. Where are you seeing 752s and 752 seatmaps?

5khours

Random RT TPAC, two weeks out.
DL DTW<>NRT M FARE $5200
UA ORD<>NRT W FARE $1700

Just to pound the final nail in the coffin of your credibility, tell us again you would be willing to spend $3500 out of your own pocket for the difference between the DL and UA seat.

Oh and by the way the $5200 only buys you a slider, since like the vast majority of DL's fleet, the premium cabin has not yet been upgraded.

j_mee

I like the current policy the way it is. Though, I would be singing a different tune if I was paying the fare for myself.

Company policy dictates we travel on the lowest refundable ticket, so a 95% my travel are on M+ fares. The restrictive SWU is beneficial for me as there is more of a opportunity for me to clear into BE The higher fare requirement effectively keeps the cabin open compared with UA.

I have yet to not clear at the gate using a SWU if I haven't been cleared prior to departure. My competition for the remaining seats is fewer and I'm usually at the top as a Diamond on a high fare class ticket. Unlike UA, where there are numerous tales of 1Ks and GS not clearing as Business is full. So now you paid a W+ fare and still sit in the back. I'll take my chances with DL.

When my travel days are over, I'll move to another airlines with an easier international upgrade policy, but until then, DL suits me fine.

k2

I wasn't even considering the comparison in upgradeable economy pricing, I'm simply talking about the J product and whether it's worth paying more for a 1-2-1 flatbed vs. a 2-3-2 flatbed (for example). In fact, I often choose KE 2-3-2 777 flat beds over DL's 777 when routing & price are comparable. Direct aisle access is, for me, not an important differentiator.

BamaGirl

Is the name calling really necessary ? As k2 said, it is an issue of whether direct aisle access is worth 'that' much. I personally do not think it is.

avidflyer

I think the real answer as to why people so passionate in defending this can be found in this thread. For a small minority of Biz travelers, who do NOT pay the tab, they are working for companies who don't care what they spend or are not sophisticated enough to realize they are being ripped off by employees "flying coach" yet paying J prices. The FACT is: you CAN (and I do) fly J for 1/3-1/4 the price of a DL M fare every time. The key is the repeated "but you dont get bonus miles if you fly UA W for $1700 and use a FREE SWU to upgrade". As an employer I frankly do not care if you get your 150% MQMs.. If I am good enough to let you book an upgradeable W fare on UA (typically $200-300 more than lowest)you darn well better not bit&h about not getting your bonus as well.

I feel sorry for the companies who have people with so little regard for the shareholders $$. That seems to me to be the driver here. Direct aisle access? Really? If I am paying the bill I am NOT paying $3500 so my employee can not be bothered to shift to the right and let the person on the window out.

motytrah

It also seems like at the prices some of these folks are paying for Y/B/M they would have picket up a discounted J fare on another carrier and upgraded to F. And from what I'm seeing no one is saying DL J is better than others Intl F.

j_mee

Discounted J does not offer the flexibility of a Refundable Ticket. Also discounted J has advanced purchased rules. I often travel on tickets purchased a week prior to travel, at that point only full J fares are available which is easily double what my refundable Y fare is.