Who said that? Do you have a link?

When other issuers have acquired the books outright from another issuer, that's been the case. Outside of that case, I've never seen a new tradeline have an older opening date outside of Amex (who stopped doing this 10 or more years ago).

where did you see this? the closest i could find is this, but kerr's response doesnt seem to align with what you said

I think it was one of Matt Clausen’s videos (and he referenced reddit), and he is quite the Bilt skeptic, so I assumed it was sourced. But yes, you’re right, I can’t find anything in writing. It’s possible they (Matt or reddit) was referring to the WF product change I suppose. I’ll go back and strike through the prior post just to be sure.

An employee (reddit username richklhs, Kerr from Bilt) on the Bilt Subreddit has made this very clear in this comment.

Cardless/FEB will not be doing a hard inquiry as a credit pull, but it will be a "new credit line" when asked if it would count for Chase 5/24.

The new line offered under Cardless/FEB will be a brand new account, it will not inherit the history of the existing account. Assumedly because either A) BILT's contract with WF did not offer an explicit buyout right and WF doesn't want to voluntarily extend one or B) The portfolio buyout (whether a contractually obligated right or something WF decides to put a pricetag on) is not something that BILT is willing to pay WF's asking price on.

Thanks for posting that. I will say that if BILT was better about their communications and maybe didn’t rely on finding Reddit threads for answers to questions it would be a lot simpler for everyone (including BILT).

Just like “the check is in the mail” and “I’ll still respect you in the morning” and “I won’t…”, I’ll believe it when I and others actually experience it. Until then it’s just predictions and rumors and hearsay.

If I had to make a prediction, this is going to be the same situation as when Amex offers you the opportunity to apply and get a decision with no hard pull. If you accept the approval, it not only results in a new tradeline but a hard pull. If you don’t, then yes it is only a soft.

I don’t think EX, TU, and EQ look kindly on extending credit with no hard pull because it messes with their data (and other lenders by proxy).

I got many cards without hard pull.

I didn't say it wasn't possible. I guess the implied but not explicit part of my comment was that I don't have confidence in BILT to pull it off as stated currently.

If you are in disbelief over 5/24: I'm not sure what to say, other than WF maintaining existing accounts and the new BILT 2.0 account not appearing as a brand new account is impossible.

If you are in disbelief that Cardless/FEB will not hard pull you for the new BILT 2.0 account: I would say that this is not without grounds given prior promises from BILT In the past, but also not hard to bypass, UNLESS (somehow) the information WF relays to cardless on creditworthiness is insufficient.

I would not be surprised to see many accounts transfer limits (as a new credit line) wholesale, but for some to be told to transfer you need an HP. At least in New York that requires very specific terms to either verbally or written ask for consent.

It's also additional friction that Cardless/FEB/BILT don't need for the transition, but Cardless/FEB's interests will come first on risk management. But you can't HP people without an opt-in consent.

Amex will typically permit a 2nd or greater account on a soft pull without ever issuing a hard pull. Apple Card is the same.

It can from an issuer/credit reporting perspective be viewed as an "abuse of the system". But it has been done by a select few issuers for many years.

You can't ultimately hide the fact that a new line was opened because within a few months the fact that the account was approved shows up as a new tradeline.

He never directly answered the question about adding new account to credit report. My guess the new Cardless card will be a new card, and WF Autograph will continue as an old one.

Yeah, I highly doubt it will be that abusive. I'm predicting that it will be more of a slight change in the language when we get closer to something like "get your approval for the 2.0 card without a hard pull*" where the asterisk is "if you accept the new card, a hard pull will occur". This is similar to how Amex (and others) work for NEW card holders. As you pointed out, it is possible as an existing card holder to get by without a HP, but many of BILTs transitional cardholders will be new to Cardless. Time will tell..

No, you can't hide the tradeline, but different issuers have different approval approaches. Some are more inquiry sensitive (as in they care that you were looking to credit regardless of whether you were approved or not), and some are more tradeline sensitive (they care what you opened). Some are both. "Hiding" the inquiry can have an effect on these systems, so while I know it possible to do so, I'm sure EX/TU/EQ would prefer issuers don't do it.

I know functionally WHY they are doing it this way (WF isn't selling the book), but to me the fairer way would be to keep the account history on the transitioned account (Cardless) and let people choose to accept a new WF tradeline (or not). People actively signed up for a credit card that earns them rewards on rent - they didn't sign up for an Autograph card. But they can't do it this way because Cardless isn't buying the book from WF so it technically is a new account. And all this is coming from someone who is happy to get an Autograph for the 1pt increment point transfers. Don't know whether we'll burn a new tradeline on the new BILT 2.0 account, though.

Exactly.. this is the complaint with BILT.. they don't directly answer questions and when they even try to do so it's written in the 3rd bathroom stall in invisible ink. You have to know where (and how) to look for it..

I recently got a new card from Comenity without hard pull, and it was my first card with them.