Jan 16, 17, 9:22 am
Last edit by: seawolf
Link back to previous THREAD.
What is it?
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) is a "service" some merchants and ATM operators offer that will charge a cardholder in the native currency of the card rather than the local currency. A more complete definition and examples are available via this Wikipedia article on DCC. While sold as a convenience to cardholders traveling outside of their home country, it is a pure profit play by the merchants. You may end up paying a fee of up to 8% over the purchase price for accepting DCC. Always decline DCC and asked to be billed in the local currency!
Where will I see it?
You can be hit with DCC anywhere there is a difference between your debit or credit card's denominated currency and the currency of the location where you're trying to use the card. The most common example will be at a merchant overseas, but now some ATMs are offering the service too. While many US cardholders complain about getting tricked into accepting DCC overseas, some merchants in the US have started to use DCC as well.
What is the issue?
Unless you're the merchant or ATM operator, there isn't much benefit to using DCC. Some customers say they prefer knowing exactly how much they'll be charged in their home currency or may not know the exchange rate of the place where they are visiting. For example, if you are in Prague for two days and you don't know how much the Czech Koruna is worth relative to the US Dollar, you might feel more comfortable knowing that you're buying an item for $205.00 versus 4000 CZK. However, the real exchange rate as of January 18, 2014 would place 4000 CZK at $197.18. You just paid an extra $7.82 for the "convenience" of knowing how much you'd be charged!
DCC often charges about a 4% premium over the true exchange rate. The problems don't stop there since many US banks still charge a 3% foreign transaction fee (FTF) for purchases made outside of the US. Not only would you get hit with the $205.00 charge, you could also find yourself facing a total charge of $211.15 if your card has a 3% FTF.
This is a pure money grab from the merchants, and it's billed as an easy way to squeeze additional revenue out of the transaction. Numerous [[URL="http://elliott.org/the-navigator/the-dangers-of-dynamic-currency-conversion/"]1, 2] articles have talked about DCC duping many consumers. Discover even has a warning about being tricked into DCC when using a card abroad.
For example, this FlyerTalk member reported that Avis charged his Saudi credit card in Saudi riyals instead of USD for a car rental in Florida without his consent. This has also been a trend for hotels, particularly large chains as indicated here and here.
DCC is simply not worth it for the consumer. Unless you like paying a convenience fee of up to 5% of the total transaction just to know how much you will be billed, you should always decline DCC and ask to be billed in local currency when handing over your card.
Furthermore, it is in your interest to obtain a card that has a 0% FTF. FlyerTalk member kebosabi maintains a fairly comprehensive spreadsheet of EMV-enabled cards ideal for overseas travel, many of which offer a low or 0% FTF as a feature. There is also a wiki at FlyerGuide of various FTF of debit and credit cards.
What can I do to avoid DCC?
American Express currently does not support DCC on its network, so you are safe from DCC if using an American Express card. However, Visa and MasterCard card networks can support DCC, so be vigilant when purchasing abroad with a Visa or MasterCard branded card. There have been reports of being charged DCC with a Discover card in China [citation needed], but primarily the issue is happening with Visa and MasterCard cards.
Before handing your card to the merchant, always specify clearly that you want to be charged in the local currency and that you do not want DCC. For some transactions, you retain control of your card as you dip it into a chip reader and can view on a screen to select which currency you want to use for the transaction. Always select the local currencyto get the best exchange rate. Do not select the card's native currency!
Similarly, for ATM withdrawals, make sure you decline any kind of conversions. Some good examples of what to look for when using an ATM overseas are here and here. You're probably coming off of a long flight and fatigued, but educating yourself beforehand can save you from getting ripped off. The user interfaces on almost all of these ATMs are set up to encourage you to take the bait, and you have to be extremely vigilant not to fall for it.
If you are doing a PIN-based transaction, you should have the opportunity to review the total amount and denomination of the transaction before entering your PIN. If you are doing a signature transaction and the merchant has processed your transaction with DCC, cross out the amount and write "DCC refused" on the receipt. Do not sign the receipt, and demand that the merchant reverse the transaction and run it in the local currency. If no verification is required due to a small purchase amount, ask the merchant to reverse the charge and repeat the transaction using local currency. If all else fails, file a dispute with your card issuer when you return home. Even if it's immaterial, the banks will get the message like they did with EMV.
Some merchants will claim that their systems have to bill you in your native currency. This is a complete lie. But just like a mag stripe only card, this is battle where you have to be prepared. Don't settle for merchants claiming that "it has to be done this way" or "pay cash if you don't want this". Be prepared to walk away, and, if you must complete the transaction, write "DCC refused & merchant didn't give a choice" on the receipt and cross out the amount. Let the merchant know that you will be filing a dispute with your bank.
Disabling DCC
Disabling DCC on ANZ terminals in Australia
ANZ markets DCC as Customer Preferred Currency (CPC). Terminal operators can contact ANZ Merchant Services at 1800 039 025 to have this feature disabled. Currently, your Visa or MasterCard will be subjected to DCC if denominated in: CAD, CHF, DKK, EUR, GBP, HKD, JPY, MYR, NOK, NZD, SEK, SGD, THB, USD, or ZAR. All DCC transactions on ANZ will cause a 2.5% markup. Steps to avoid DCC:
If you see a signature slip with DCC verbiage and a checkbox indicating a currency selection, kindly ask the merchant to void the transaction. If it's a PIN-based transaction, you have an additional opportunity to cancel the transaction because it will ask for your PIN a second time. For instance, if you see "EUR 17.29 KEY PIN" refuse to enter your PIN and start again.
Disabling DCC in China
There are many reports of forced DCC in China, and there is a great thread [closed to new posts] on DCC in China on the the China Destinations forum.
Disabling DCC on Bankcomm terminals in Beijing http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #19
jair101's DCC instructions of March 2011 http://www.etveg.com/misc/DCC_China.pdf
Disabling DCC in Eurozone and UK
DCC offered in tourist traps (Harrods Knightsbridge/Galleries Lafayette Montparnesse/El Cortes Ingles Grand Via Madrid)
Unlike the rest of the world, Visa Europe does not require merchants to collect a ticked box on the slip (presumably because merchants there don't keep signed slips under Chip-and-PIN)
El Cortes Ingles collects a signature electronically and the DCC selection is made on the signature pad - the choice is respected.
Harrods and GL rely on cashier input in the POS for the currency choice - the cashier may forget to ask. The POS do not offer voiding (only refunds), but since you're given a slip to sign the best thing to do is to deface it before signing and submit chargeback request to issuer bank on return home.
There may be smaller merchants who also collect DCC but I seemed to have pre-empted most of them by saying "charge Euros (Pounds) please"
In Spain all merchants by law are required to provide you with a complaint form called an hoja de reclamaciones if requested. The form has two carbon copies. The customer retains one copy as a record of the complaint. The merchant maintains another copy, and the third is sent to the local consumer protection bureau. Merchants are also required to post a sign conspicuously informing the customer of the right to complain (usually in Spanish and English). Do not accept the lie that they don't have any forms. This is illegal, and you are able to call the police if the merchant refuses to provide you with this official form. It's interesting to see merchants start to squirm when you know the rules, and most merchants will start to be accommodating after you mention it. (Please still fill out the form even if the merchant cooperates after mentioning it because these are likely the merchants who won't otherwise change their behavior.)
Disabling DCC in Hong Kong and Macau
Hong Kong and Macau can get as non-compliant as China, possibly because many acquirers have cross-border operations and know they can get away with non-compliant firmware and procedures.
In practice, if you are given a DCC slip, and the cashier has not taken a choice before giving you your copy, the slip will be processed in your home currency - be prepared to dispute.
Unable to disable Global Payments DCC in Hong Kong instance #1, instance #2
Unable to disable DBS DCC in Fortress Electronics HK
Unable to disable BoC DCC in Free Duty HK
Disabling DCC in Japan and Korea
Japan's just starting out More dynamic currency conversion coming to Japan? and http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=3939&p=17 #168 but there are no reports I know of where cardholders are compelled to use DCC against their will.
Korea is also not much affected by DCC but where offered, trying to opt out is harder than Japan due to the language barrier (both verbal and written)
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...hp?id=4303&p=3 #23
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #11
Disabling DCC in the Maldives
Disabling DCC on Global Payment terminals in the Maldives
Disabling DCC in Thailand and Taiwan
DCC present but generally not an issue. Cashier will generate quote slip is usually generated and pass to cardholder. When cardholder refuses, a verbage-free slip denominated in THB/TWD will be produced.
Certain Taiwan hotels may take deposits in cardholder currency. But these are only pre-authorisations and can be voided in full for TWD-only final checkout payments.
Disabling DCC on Websites
Airbnb - (Since the "loophole" seem not to work anymore, please report if you chargeback the DCC.
)
Hotwire - You need to select your preferred currency before making a search.
PayPal - The instructions to stop the DCC on a recurring charge are here.
I got duped by DCC already before I found this thread. Is there anything I can do?
If you've been hit with DCC and the merchant did not follow the Visa/MC rules, you should file a dispute with your card issuer. Even if the transaction is a small amount, it's worth it to dispute the charge on principle. Do not let merchants get away with this scam uncontested!
If you were not clearly given a choice of currencies and did not specifically communicate a preference to be billed in your card's native currency - if you did not accept DCC - then you have recourse when filing a dispute with your card issuer. The Visa Product and Service Rules clearly state (p 339):
You can even use terminology from Visa Product and Service Rules when filing the dispute, giving Reason Code 12.3: Incorrect Currency. Reason Code 12.3 is used when:
MasterCard's rules also clearly state that the POI Currency Conversion must be decided by both the merchant and customer. When filing a dispute with a MasterCard, list chargeback Reason Code 4834 from the MasterCard Chargeback Guide, which covers POI currency conversion disputes in the following circumstances:
You do have a choice of currencies. Exercise that choice!
Do not get taken by surprise when faced with DCC, and know your options. As Visa/MC purport, you do have a choice of currencies, but you need to make that choice heard! Don't be complacent in this sneaky tactic by some merchants to pad revenues.
Before going to a different country, get educated. Understand the exchange rate relative to your native currency. Know how to recognize when the merchant is trying to force DCC on the transaction, and pull out all of the stops to make sure it doesn't happen to you.
If you have a chip-and-PIN credit card, it's easier to control the transaction to try to prevent DCC. With chip-and-signature, if you get an uncooperative merchant, deface the merchant's copy of the receipt. Write LOCAL OPTION NOT OFFERED, cross out the DCC currency amount, and sign the receipt.
This will give additional evidence when filing a dispute to get the DCC charges refunded. When filing the dispute, you can use the Visa Exchange Rate Calculator or MasterCard's Currency Conversion Tool to determine the Visa or MasterCard exchange rate on the date the transaction posted to your credit card. Compare this to the DCC value to figure out the amount by which the merchant overcharged you. Don't forget to add in any Foreign Transaction Fee if your card has one. (If it does, you should really consider finding a card for use overseas without a FTF.)
Example Images (click for a larger image)
Hotel receipts in China, the Netherlands, and Dubai respectively:
Purchase receipts in China and Korea:
Cancelled translation in Hong Kong:
Novotel in Shenzen:
What is it?
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) is a "service" some merchants and ATM operators offer that will charge a cardholder in the native currency of the card rather than the local currency. A more complete definition and examples are available via this Wikipedia article on DCC. While sold as a convenience to cardholders traveling outside of their home country, it is a pure profit play by the merchants. You may end up paying a fee of up to 8% over the purchase price for accepting DCC. Always decline DCC and asked to be billed in the local currency!
Where will I see it?
You can be hit with DCC anywhere there is a difference between your debit or credit card's denominated currency and the currency of the location where you're trying to use the card. The most common example will be at a merchant overseas, but now some ATMs are offering the service too. While many US cardholders complain about getting tricked into accepting DCC overseas, some merchants in the US have started to use DCC as well.
What is the issue?
Unless you're the merchant or ATM operator, there isn't much benefit to using DCC. Some customers say they prefer knowing exactly how much they'll be charged in their home currency or may not know the exchange rate of the place where they are visiting. For example, if you are in Prague for two days and you don't know how much the Czech Koruna is worth relative to the US Dollar, you might feel more comfortable knowing that you're buying an item for $205.00 versus 4000 CZK. However, the real exchange rate as of January 18, 2014 would place 4000 CZK at $197.18. You just paid an extra $7.82 for the "convenience" of knowing how much you'd be charged!
DCC often charges about a 4% premium over the true exchange rate. The problems don't stop there since many US banks still charge a 3% foreign transaction fee (FTF) for purchases made outside of the US. Not only would you get hit with the $205.00 charge, you could also find yourself facing a total charge of $211.15 if your card has a 3% FTF.
This is a pure money grab from the merchants, and it's billed as an easy way to squeeze additional revenue out of the transaction. Numerous [[URL="http://elliott.org/the-navigator/the-dangers-of-dynamic-currency-conversion/"]1, 2] articles have talked about DCC duping many consumers. Discover even has a warning about being tricked into DCC when using a card abroad.
For example, this FlyerTalk member reported that Avis charged his Saudi credit card in Saudi riyals instead of USD for a car rental in Florida without his consent. This has also been a trend for hotels, particularly large chains as indicated here and here.
DCC is simply not worth it for the consumer. Unless you like paying a convenience fee of up to 5% of the total transaction just to know how much you will be billed, you should always decline DCC and ask to be billed in local currency when handing over your card.
Furthermore, it is in your interest to obtain a card that has a 0% FTF. FlyerTalk member kebosabi maintains a fairly comprehensive spreadsheet of EMV-enabled cards ideal for overseas travel, many of which offer a low or 0% FTF as a feature. There is also a wiki at FlyerGuide of various FTF of debit and credit cards.
What can I do to avoid DCC?
American Express currently does not support DCC on its network, so you are safe from DCC if using an American Express card. However, Visa and MasterCard card networks can support DCC, so be vigilant when purchasing abroad with a Visa or MasterCard branded card. There have been reports of being charged DCC with a Discover card in China [citation needed], but primarily the issue is happening with Visa and MasterCard cards.
Before handing your card to the merchant, always specify clearly that you want to be charged in the local currency and that you do not want DCC. For some transactions, you retain control of your card as you dip it into a chip reader and can view on a screen to select which currency you want to use for the transaction. Always select the local currencyto get the best exchange rate. Do not select the card's native currency!
Similarly, for ATM withdrawals, make sure you decline any kind of conversions. Some good examples of what to look for when using an ATM overseas are here and here. You're probably coming off of a long flight and fatigued, but educating yourself beforehand can save you from getting ripped off. The user interfaces on almost all of these ATMs are set up to encourage you to take the bait, and you have to be extremely vigilant not to fall for it.
If you are doing a PIN-based transaction, you should have the opportunity to review the total amount and denomination of the transaction before entering your PIN. If you are doing a signature transaction and the merchant has processed your transaction with DCC, cross out the amount and write "DCC refused" on the receipt. Do not sign the receipt, and demand that the merchant reverse the transaction and run it in the local currency. If no verification is required due to a small purchase amount, ask the merchant to reverse the charge and repeat the transaction using local currency. If all else fails, file a dispute with your card issuer when you return home. Even if it's immaterial, the banks will get the message like they did with EMV.
Some merchants will claim that their systems have to bill you in your native currency. This is a complete lie. But just like a mag stripe only card, this is battle where you have to be prepared. Don't settle for merchants claiming that "it has to be done this way" or "pay cash if you don't want this". Be prepared to walk away, and, if you must complete the transaction, write "DCC refused & merchant didn't give a choice" on the receipt and cross out the amount. Let the merchant know that you will be filing a dispute with your bank.
Disabling DCC
Disabling DCC on ANZ terminals in Australia
ANZ markets DCC as Customer Preferred Currency (CPC). Terminal operators can contact ANZ Merchant Services at 1800 039 025 to have this feature disabled. Currently, your Visa or MasterCard will be subjected to DCC if denominated in: CAD, CHF, DKK, EUR, GBP, HKD, JPY, MYR, NOK, NZD, SEK, SGD, THB, USD, or ZAR. All DCC transactions on ANZ will cause a 2.5% markup. Steps to avoid DCC:
- Insert, swipe, or tap your payment card
- Have the cashier select credit (CR)
- The terminal will display CREDIT ACCOUNT
- If applicable, enter your PIN
- The terminal will display PROCESSING \ PLEASE WAIT
- The terminal will display EXCH \ \ ACCEPT RATE? \ ENTER=YES CLR=NO
- Instruct the cashier to press the yellow CLEAR (CLR) button (If entering a PIN, you can retain the terminal to perform this step yourself. If entering a signature, you can ask for the terminal to control this process, not indicating that it's a chip-and-signature card.)
- The transaction should now process without DCC
If you see a signature slip with DCC verbiage and a checkbox indicating a currency selection, kindly ask the merchant to void the transaction. If it's a PIN-based transaction, you have an additional opportunity to cancel the transaction because it will ask for your PIN a second time. For instance, if you see "EUR 17.29 KEY PIN" refuse to enter your PIN and start again.
Disabling DCC in China
There are many reports of forced DCC in China, and there is a great thread [closed to new posts] on DCC in China on the the China Destinations forum.
Disabling DCC on Bankcomm terminals in Beijing http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #19
jair101's DCC instructions of March 2011 http://www.etveg.com/misc/DCC_China.pdf
Disabling DCC in Eurozone and UK
DCC offered in tourist traps (Harrods Knightsbridge/Galleries Lafayette Montparnesse/El Cortes Ingles Grand Via Madrid)
Unlike the rest of the world, Visa Europe does not require merchants to collect a ticked box on the slip (presumably because merchants there don't keep signed slips under Chip-and-PIN)
El Cortes Ingles collects a signature electronically and the DCC selection is made on the signature pad - the choice is respected.
Harrods and GL rely on cashier input in the POS for the currency choice - the cashier may forget to ask. The POS do not offer voiding (only refunds), but since you're given a slip to sign the best thing to do is to deface it before signing and submit chargeback request to issuer bank on return home.
There may be smaller merchants who also collect DCC but I seemed to have pre-empted most of them by saying "charge Euros (Pounds) please"
In Spain all merchants by law are required to provide you with a complaint form called an hoja de reclamaciones if requested. The form has two carbon copies. The customer retains one copy as a record of the complaint. The merchant maintains another copy, and the third is sent to the local consumer protection bureau. Merchants are also required to post a sign conspicuously informing the customer of the right to complain (usually in Spanish and English). Do not accept the lie that they don't have any forms. This is illegal, and you are able to call the police if the merchant refuses to provide you with this official form. It's interesting to see merchants start to squirm when you know the rules, and most merchants will start to be accommodating after you mention it. (Please still fill out the form even if the merchant cooperates after mentioning it because these are likely the merchants who won't otherwise change their behavior.)
Disabling DCC in Hong Kong and Macau
Hong Kong and Macau can get as non-compliant as China, possibly because many acquirers have cross-border operations and know they can get away with non-compliant firmware and procedures.
In practice, if you are given a DCC slip, and the cashier has not taken a choice before giving you your copy, the slip will be processed in your home currency - be prepared to dispute.
Unable to disable Global Payments DCC in Hong Kong instance #1, instance #2
Unable to disable DBS DCC in Fortress Electronics HK
Unable to disable BoC DCC in Free Duty HK
Disabling DCC in Japan and Korea
Japan's just starting out More dynamic currency conversion coming to Japan? and http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=3939&p=17 #168 but there are no reports I know of where cardholders are compelled to use DCC against their will.
Korea is also not much affected by DCC but where offered, trying to opt out is harder than Japan due to the language barrier (both verbal and written)
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...hp?id=4303&p=3 #23
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #11
Disabling DCC in the Maldives
Disabling DCC on Global Payment terminals in the Maldives
Disabling DCC in Thailand and Taiwan
DCC present but generally not an issue. Cashier will generate quote slip is usually generated and pass to cardholder. When cardholder refuses, a verbage-free slip denominated in THB/TWD will be produced.
Certain Taiwan hotels may take deposits in cardholder currency. But these are only pre-authorisations and can be voided in full for TWD-only final checkout payments.
Disabling DCC on Websites
Airbnb - (Since the "loophole" seem not to work anymore, please report if you chargeback the DCC.
)Hotwire - You need to select your preferred currency before making a search.
PayPal - The instructions to stop the DCC on a recurring charge are here.
I got duped by DCC already before I found this thread. Is there anything I can do?
If you've been hit with DCC and the merchant did not follow the Visa/MC rules, you should file a dispute with your card issuer. Even if the transaction is a small amount, it's worth it to dispute the charge on principle. Do not let merchants get away with this scam uncontested!
If you were not clearly given a choice of currencies and did not specifically communicate a preference to be billed in your card's native currency - if you did not accept DCC - then you have recourse when filing a dispute with your card issuer. The Visa Product and Service Rules clearly state (p 339):
- Merchants that offer DCC must be compliant with the regulations
- Inform the cardholder that DCC is optional
- Not impose any additional requirements to use local currency
- Not use any language or procedures that may cause the cardholder to choose DCC by default
- Not convert a transaction in the local currency to the card's billing currency after the transaction has completed
- Ensure that the cardholder expressly agrees to DCC
You can even use terminology from Visa Product and Service Rules when filing the dispute, giving Reason Code 12.3: Incorrect Currency. Reason Code 12.3 is used when:
- Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) occurred and the Cardholder did not expressly agree to DCC or was refused the choice of paying in the Merchant’s local currency or the selected ATM currency.
MasterCard's rules also clearly state that the POI Currency Conversion must be decided by both the merchant and customer. When filing a dispute with a MasterCard, list chargeback Reason Code 4834 from the MasterCard Chargeback Guide, which covers POI currency conversion disputes in the following circumstances:
- The cardholder states that the cardholder was not given the opportunity to choose the desired currency in which the transaction was completed or did not agree to the currency of the transaction
You do have a choice of currencies. Exercise that choice!
Do not get taken by surprise when faced with DCC, and know your options. As Visa/MC purport, you do have a choice of currencies, but you need to make that choice heard! Don't be complacent in this sneaky tactic by some merchants to pad revenues.
Before going to a different country, get educated. Understand the exchange rate relative to your native currency. Know how to recognize when the merchant is trying to force DCC on the transaction, and pull out all of the stops to make sure it doesn't happen to you.
If you have a chip-and-PIN credit card, it's easier to control the transaction to try to prevent DCC. With chip-and-signature, if you get an uncooperative merchant, deface the merchant's copy of the receipt. Write LOCAL OPTION NOT OFFERED, cross out the DCC currency amount, and sign the receipt.
This will give additional evidence when filing a dispute to get the DCC charges refunded. When filing the dispute, you can use the Visa Exchange Rate Calculator or MasterCard's Currency Conversion Tool to determine the Visa or MasterCard exchange rate on the date the transaction posted to your credit card. Compare this to the DCC value to figure out the amount by which the merchant overcharged you. Don't forget to add in any Foreign Transaction Fee if your card has one. (If it does, you should really consider finding a card for use overseas without a FTF.
)Example Images (click for a larger image)
Hotel receipts in China, the Netherlands, and Dubai respectively:
Purchase receipts in China and Korea:
Cancelled translation in Hong Kong:
Novotel in Shenzen:
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC)
Jan 1, 17, 9:36 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 5,464
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC)
I returned from Italy and didn't see DCC a single time in Rome, Florence, and Pisa. I did do a lot of contactless payments, which might have helped prevent it. However, a few of the usual suspects for DCC (duty free, airport hotel, and restaurants in tourist areas) didn't result in any DCC. It was likely an option at both of my hotels in Rome and Florence, but I didn't see it since I had used an AmEx to pay.
Both the Harrods and F&M shops at LHR T5 are still doing DCC, and I saw multiple people opting in. At least at Harrods the cashiers were asking for currency preference. When I said pound sterling the cashier actually reached over the counter and in a nanosecond had pressed cancel to opt out of DCC.
Both the Harrods and F&M shops at LHR T5 are still doing DCC, and I saw multiple people opting in. At least at Harrods the cashiers were asking for currency preference. When I said pound sterling the cashier actually reached over the counter and in a nanosecond had pressed cancel to opt out of DCC.
Jan 2, 17, 1:14 am
#2
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN**
Posts: 45,847
Last week in Sweden I saw DCC on most terminals. The SEK option was greyed out and on the left, the EUR in bright green on the right. It took a while for me to find the right spot to press to stay in local currency 
My wife also asked me what this SEK/EUR thing was after she came back from shopping alone. She knew not to accept the EUR option and struggled to push the right buttons. It seems she did ask the cashiers who all insisted the end result was the same and that she should just accept EUR.
She didn't though. ^
My wife also asked me what this SEK/EUR thing was after she came back from shopping alone. She knew not to accept the EUR option and struggled to push the right buttons. It seems she did ask the cashiers who all insisted the end result was the same and that she should just accept EUR.
She didn't though. ^
Jan 2, 17, 5:23 am
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 5,464
Last week in Sweden I saw DCC on most terminals. The SEK option was greyed out and on the left, the EUR in bright green on the right. It took a while for me to find the right spot to press to stay in local currency
My wife also asked me what this SEK/EUR thing was after she came back from shopping alone. She knew not to accept the EUR option and struggled to push the right buttons. It seems she did ask the cashiers who all insisted the end result was the same and that she should just accept EUR. She didn't though. ^
My wife also asked me what this SEK/EUR thing was after she came back from shopping alone. She knew not to accept the EUR option and struggled to push the right buttons. It seems she did ask the cashiers who all insisted the end result was the same and that she should just accept EUR.
She didn't though. ^As a side story, I found someone respond quickly, "Euro!" when offered at Harrods yesterday at LHR T5. In the customer's defense, if most of the customer's shopping is within the euro area then the person might be ignorant of DCC just like if you're coming from a larger country such as the US, Canada, the UK, Australia, or Japan. I tend to think people from places like Hong Kong are more likely to have encountered DCC in the past and respond appropriately. Pretty much everyone I talk to who's a seasoned international traveler knows about the DCC scam, but the occasional traveler does not. As I've said before, I've even have had a few people mention, "Yeah. It was great. I could pay in dollars!"
I am also completely shocked at the number of people still bringing cash and going to bureaux de change or even at the hotels. In fact, at one of my hotels the reception clearly stated, "I would recommend using a cash machine if it's an option as the exchange rate is better." They weren't small sums of money either! I simply don't understand why people don't withdraw currency on arrival, especially since there are options - at least stateside - of doing so without fees and a 0% foreign transaction fee.
Jan 2, 17, 5:40 am
#4
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN**
Posts: 45,847
You had a field on the left with SEK with a dark grey box backgound (black text on dark grey) and the same sized box with a green background (black on green). Touching the dark grey box with the fingernail did the trick. The color scheme suggested EUR/DCC to be better. All customer facing.
Jan 2, 17, 5:52 am
#5
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 5,464
You had a field on the left with SEK with a dark grey box backgound (black text on dark grey) and the same sized box with a green background (black on green). Touching the dark grey box with the fingernail did the trick. The color scheme suggested EUR/DCC to be better. All customer facing.
(Forever 21 and Kate Spade)
It's all configured to get people to select DCC without thinking but still being compliant enough for allowing those in the know to opt out.
Jan 2, 17, 3:19 pm
#6
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 5
It was the Sklep Freshmarket...on one of the roads surrounding the main square. However, you forced me to get the receipt out and look at it. Guess what, even after the cashier offered Zlotys because it was less expensive for me, the actual transaction occurred in dollars. Another to dispute with Chase!
Jan 2, 17, 5:05 pm
#7
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
With my chip&pin VISA I observed that card terminals with additional customer PIN pad offer the DCC option to the cashier after entering the PIN even though the PIN pad displays the amount in PLN only. In Poland be suspicious with English text on the PIN pad display, e.g. AMOUNT PLN 150 ENTER PIN and check carefully what the cashier is doing on his terminal after the PIN has been entered.
Jan 2, 17, 6:08 pm
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 5,464
With my chip&pin VISA I observed that card terminals with additional customer PIN pad offer the DCC option to the cashier after entering the PIN even though the PIN pad displays the amount in PLN only. In Poland be suspicious with English text on the PIN pad display, e.g. AMOUNT PLN 150 ENTER PIN and check carefully what the cashier is doing on his terminal after the PIN has been entered.
Jan 3, 17, 4:36 am
#9
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: CGN
Programs: KL FlyingBlue Gold, AY+, MM FTL, TK*G
Posts: 343
Last week in Sweden I saw DCC on most terminals. The SEK option was greyed out and on the left, the EUR in bright green on the right. It took a while for me to find the right spot to press to stay in local currency
My wife also asked me what this SEK/EUR thing was after she came back from shopping alone. She knew not to accept the EUR option and struggled to push the right buttons. It seems she did ask the cashiers who all insisted the end result was the same and that she should just accept EUR. She didn't though. ^
My wife also asked me what this SEK/EUR thing was after she came back from shopping alone. She knew not to accept the EUR option and struggled to push the right buttons. It seems she did ask the cashiers who all insisted the end result was the same and that she should just accept EUR.
She didn't though. ^
Jan 6, 17, 8:02 pm
#10
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 351
PayPal and Ebay have now stopped to worry about DCC (see https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/.../920926/page/8 ) . They are now charging people in their home currency without asking.
Jan 7, 17, 10:21 am
#11
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,252
Do you mean that they don't offer DCC? That would make sense for an establishment that had few non-local customers. I'm sure that the banks run reports on current merchant accounts to identify which have the biggest opportunity to try to sell DCC to. Why bother with those where there's little potential for extra profit.
More than one eateries actually told me, "we dont take Union Pay. It must be HKD." That is what I got from a local chain of mid-range banquet restaurants that is famous for their bargain period for breakfast that often has some really good dim sum combo at like 50% off. (稻香 - the Wanchai location above the Lee Garden is very good, not so much at other locations).
Even the very touristy Crystal Jade (翡翠拉麵小籠包) at IFC did not attempt DCC. They do have an attitude to mainlanders though as they mistook us being from mainland when assigning table. Had to talk to a manager to get things sorted. However, definitely not offered DCC option, nor automatically DCC our US-issued card.
Not a single one attempted to DCC.
When I reiterated to the waitress / waiter when handing them my US-issued card I always asked them to bill in HKD. My brother told me not to worry more than one time that the restaurants will bill in HKD. We quite like the Cantonese banquet restaurant atop the Tin Hau MTR station. This restaurant is what I would term "Restaurant for the community" - it fills up around 7:30 every night with guests you know are from nearby. During the Mother's Day / Father's Day, Chinese Festivals, etc, the restaurant is full of extended families having a feast even though the prices generally go up 40% from normal days and all the "specials" were not offered. I was even scolded once by the older waitress when I asked to make sure it was billed in HKD - the 阿嬸 gave me a look, said LOUDLY, " If it is not HKD, what do you think?!" "WE DONT TAKE UNION PAY!"
I am just trying to tell you people, the eateries we go to, are VERY MUCH DIFFERENT from the restaurants you go to. Different preferences on the foods, and of course we dont much care for "atmosphere" - we only care for good foods at reasonable prices.
So there. It all depends on WHERE you go. Then in some places how you look and what language you speak, probably make a difference as well.
You can believe it or not I could not care less. We visited HKG 4 times in 2016, ate at enough restaurants whether only ourselves or with families, my US-issued CCs NEVER experience DCC. The only places are hotels where you do need to assert your choice and make sure they comply. They do comply even though the procedures often are not transparent and quite confusing.
Will report back on the upcoming trip during CNY period if I remember to drop by this thread after trip.
Now I would need to pay attention in Abu Dhabi and Dubai! Hardly any data on this thread or I have missed it.
Last edited by Happy; Jan 7, 17 at 10:43 am
Jan 8, 17, 7:07 pm
#13
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 5,464
I definitely expect it at duty free shops, hotels, rental cars, department stores, and restaurants catering to a foreign clientele, but DCC is not exclusive to these usual suspects.
Jan 9, 17, 3:35 am
#14
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN**
Posts: 45,847
We got this circular at work asking to avoid DCC
Liebe Reisende, in letzter Zeit wurde Mitarbeitern bei der Bezahlung ihrer Hotelrechnung vermehrt angeboten, diese nicht in Landeswährung (Local Currency) sondern in Euro zu fakturieren.
Daraufhin legte das Hotel oft einen willkürlichen, meist für das Unternehmen sehr ungünstigen Wechselkurs zugrunde...
Daraufhin legte das Hotel oft einen willkürlichen, meist für das Unternehmen sehr ungünstigen Wechselkurs zugrunde...
Jan 10, 17, 8:42 pm
#15
Join Date: Oct 2007
Programs: AA, WN, UA, Bonvoy, Hertz
Posts: 2,411
Just an update that during a trip to Australia, only twice during the entire trip was DCC even prompted. Both retailers that asked had the same type of strange standalone terminal where you put the chip card in vertically whereas everyone else had a horizontal insert machine of varying types. I am sure it is a specific processor doing such evil deeds. The worse part is one of them was the SYD duty free. I was asked about DCC in these two cases, so I could pick AUD, but also to note those were the only two merchants who had normal casing on my Capital One statement as well (upper and lower) while every other charge uses the all caps (which is common for 90% of my US charges too).
Now AUS has other quirks like the allowance of merchants to charge a service fee (which I saw come up a number of times), and they are tap for *everything* including their stored value transit cards, amusement park tickets, hotels, passport e-gates, but I didn't have a good non-FTF tap card to use sadly. I only saw *one* unattended kiosk the entire trip that only took tap (it was a vending machine in the airport bathroom). All other kiosks took at least chip as well.
Because I was a good person and used a MC card, I was asked if they could Paypass (tap) my card. Obviously, nothing happened so they had to insert. I had a PIN card if needed, but signature card worked everywhere.
Rasheed
Now AUS has other quirks like the allowance of merchants to charge a service fee (which I saw come up a number of times), and they are tap for *everything* including their stored value transit cards, amusement park tickets, hotels, passport e-gates, but I didn't have a good non-FTF tap card to use sadly. I only saw *one* unattended kiosk the entire trip that only took tap (it was a vending machine in the airport bathroom). All other kiosks took at least chip as well.
Because I was a good person and used a MC card, I was asked if they could Paypass (tap) my card. Obviously, nothing happened so they had to insert. I had a PIN card if needed, but signature card worked everywhere.
Rasheed
