Yes, Chase allows submission via fax, but I don't have the number handy. I did this last year after a department store charged me twice (and then reversed the second charge a week later), but I had already received the paperwork and started the dispute process.

Yes, I just realized the fax was a toll free number. A no brained in this case. Before I realized that, I didn't want to fax long distance from Hong Kong.

Thanks again percysmith and majuki.

Further Adventures at Chung Yo (中友) Department Store in Taichung

Part 1 is in post 1071.

My spouse and I were at Chung Yo Department Store tonight doing some shopping during our last few days in Taiwan. Knowing that we narrowly dodged DCC last time, I was careful when my wife was signing this receipt this time. We specified NTD, and the sales clerk took with our card over to the cashier's desk. She came back with a signature slip which contained the DCC verbiage but was clearly denominated in NTD. All is well, right? My wife signed, and then the sales clerk went back to the cashier and returned with the receipt with DCC verbiage but again clearly denominated in NTD. But wait... this time there was a second receipt taped to the bottom of the NTD receipt:

http://i.imgur.com/ppGxW9om.jpg

The USD box had been ticked even though there was no select the currency box on the signature receipt. My heart sank at this point, and the sales clerk asked what was wrong. My spouse explained the situation, and the three of us, receipts in hand, walked over to the cashier's desk and demanded an explanation.

The cashier explained that the default is DCC, and that is how the sale is initially processed. The currency selection is made after that, and she attached both receipts to show the "selection" process. (Last time I hadn't been provided a copy of the currency selection receipt.) The cashier further specified that while DCC was the default, we had opted out correctly. I don't think they get too many foreign cards at this particular department store, and I imagine the few with foreign denominated cards would specify local currency. However, I am curious how many people get taken to the cleaners by getting hit with DCC and using a card with a FTF. Notice the nice 4.8% markup compared to the Visa rate:

Visa rate for 10/3: 0.032870 USD/NTD
DCC rate for transaction: 0.0344477 USD/NTD

NTD 14,344 (Pending charge: $494.12, Current Visa rate: $471.49, 4.80% difference of $22.63)

I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, and I have confidence that this transaction will post without DCC in the end based on what happened last time. Furthermore, the authorization code for both receipts tonight is the same, the batch number - I assume this is sequential? - is higher for the NTD receipt, and I was watching the receipt that my wife signed like a hawk to make sure it was in NTD and didn't have any check boxes. However, I will still be vigilant until the transaction posts.

I do have a few questions about the receipt itself. I was wondering what the first two numbers are? I can't read the 漢字 except I know that the last character 號 means number. The second number is the same for both receipts as well as the receipt with the DCC verbiage from my earlier trip. The first number is the same for the three receipts denominated in NTD, but it is different for the receipt with the [X]USD.

Merchant code and terminal code respectively.

If you have same auth code and time then I am willing to bet Chung Wo can amend the DCC selection post-transaction and reprint amended slip. I don't think a lot of terminals has this ability, or alternatively staff know how to use it.

That makes sense. My wife was saying "store number", so I assumed it was the merchant code. I still wonder why the DCC receipt has a different merchant code than the other three. The terminal being the same is expected since we purchased from the same shop within the department store on the previous transactions where I was worried about DCC.

Yes, the auth code (redacted) and timestamp (18:14) are exactly the same, and the sequence of events was:

1) Sales assistant brought receipt for wife to sign (with DCC verbiage but denominated in NTD and no sign of check boxes)
2) Wife signed the receipt
3) Sales assistant returned with copy of receipt in NTD taped in front of the other receipt that showed [X] USD checked.

With the exception of the merchant code (different for the DCC receipt) and batch number (lower for the DCC receipt), the other information is identical between the two receipts. Also, this is a Global Payments terminal, for what it's worth.

Your explanation makes sense, but it's the first case of this process I've seen here. Even one of the cashiers downstairs opted out of DCC before the transaction took place. Hence, I was concerned during my previous visit because while both receipts were denominated in NTD, one was pending in the DCC amount and the other was pending in the non-DCC amount. The process I'm used to in Taiwan for DCC is:

1) Specify to the cashier you want NTD
2) Cashier will print out the "quote" slip that doubles as a signature slip
3) You check the box next to NTD and sign the receipt
4) Since you specified NTD from the get go, the cashier has usually already printed the final NTD slip for you by the time you're done signing
5) For the terminals I've seen - I'll check to see what the Novotel uses next week - you get the final receipt with [X]NTD thermally printed, denoting the terminal accepted your currency choice

I have never seen DCC disabled ex post facto before. That is to say, if you got a receipt with [X]USD selected and NO SIGNATURE REQUIRED, you've been hit and there was nothing that could be done except void the transaction. But from the translated explanation I received from my wife what you described is exactly what I think happened.

The only thing that didn't sit right with me was seeing that receipt with [X]USD. If I hadn't seen that, I don't think there would have been a follow-up conversation with the cashier and the mini heart attack I had upon seeing it. My wife thought it was funny. "You're more concerned about $25 in DCC charges than the fact that I just spent $470 in clothes?" It's the principle of the matter, dear. In the former I should have a choice. In the latter I don't. :o

They can reselect currency selection afterwards? Man that is advanced.

Was at DFS honolulu shopping. The payment system is called EuroPay or EuroNet. It looks like the ones used at DFS Singapore, which let you choose local or home currency easily.

That's the working theory until proven otherwise since the cashiers were adamant the transaction occurred in TWD. I'm waiting for the transaction to post, and hopefully this will happen Sunday night ET. Chase doesn't post transactions on Saturday, but every other night new transactions post around 11pm ET.

Was it like the ones in this post? It seems DFS uses similar payment terminals in various locations, and the ones you saw were identical to the ones I saw in Guam last week.

My spouse is getting sick of me keep asking for NTD. :D

I think I'm going to start using AmEx to avoid the headache of a forced PREAUTH in USD when checking in at hotels in locations where DCC is prevalent. I understand it's just a preauthorization amount, but I hate seeing the transaction denominated in USD.

We checked into the Sheraton Grande Taipei this evening, and I requested to be billed in NTD. I saw the receptionist swipe and then insert (after the terminal failed - yay EMV?) my card. I saw the preauth slip print with [X]USD selected and no further input from the cashier. It was a Global Payments terminal. Now, I clearly was observing the screen, and it said something along the lines of "Proceed in home currency USD?" to which the receptionist pressed the green OK/Enter button.

I saw the preauthorization amount was for 22000 TWD, and the pending transaction on my Chase online account is $756.31. Using the 10/6 exchange rate of 0.032803 USD/TWD, I can infer a DCC surcharge of 4.8% over the Visa rate (22000 TWD x 0.032803 USD/TWD x 1.048% = 756.31 USD). Fortunately this amount is a good margin above the estimated total for our two-night stay, but it is still infuriating to see the DCC amounts be held. :mad: Sensitive much? :o The receptionist did say that he noted in my file that I wanted to be charged in NTD. I'll make sure of it upon checkout that I get the OPT_O receipt denominated in NTD.

Now to take my other half out for a late night dinner to atone for the time I've wasted on my DCC crusade. I think I do understand better now why I'm seeing the DCC amount held on my card. Is there any chance to get the staff to decline DCC on the PREAUTH slip by pressing NO/CANCEL instead of YES/ACCEPT when checking in?

I got DCC'd again, this time in Kowloon at a tourist-trap cafe near the Regal Hotel. Cafe De Fontaine swiped my Visa with a printout that gave a choice (x in the box) of $198 HKD ($25.51 USD) or $26.58 USD. I clearly chose the 198 HKD amount and crossed out the USD amount and also wrote clearly 198 HKD on the total line. Lo and behold I got charged anyway the DCC amount of $26.58, a $1.07 overcharge. Capital One quickly refunded me the $1.07 & basically said that the difference would have to be more than $10 to push a Reason Code 76 chargeback. Is there any way to avoid DCC in the Hong Kong & Macau areas? It seems they give you a choice on the CC slip, but totally ignore it and charge you the DCC amount anyway.

It sounds like PRC - you see why we don't want to become Just Another Chinese City?

We didn't have much luck when moondog came around and we tried to opt out of a Global Payments terminal.

Anyway an FTer is coming over next week and we'll have another crack at opting out of DCC at Greyhounds.

Although I can file complaints on your behalf (that is assuming I can get around the Personal Data Privacy Ordinance that is the first line of defence for all the HK complaint handlers to do nothing) I'm not optimistic I can do anything worthwhile - even if I filed a complaint and filed a copy of the slip, there is no easy way I can identify acquirers in HK (we've discussed this in hongkongcard.com http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...ow.php?id=6862 and http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...ow.php?id=8062) and file a complaint to HKMA where it really hurts the acquirer bank. No matter what businesses are howling this week HK is really business friendly.

Once that happens you've already been hit.

What's your bet that we'll be able to opt out successfully? I don't have great expectations, but I'm hoping to file my first Reason Code 76 chargeback.

Yes, they look similar to that

I'd like to post about a pleasant DCC experience. :eek: If only they all work this smoothly...

At Shin Kong Mitsukoshi in Xinyi they have new POS terminals that collect signatures electronically. I was able to stand next to the terminal while the sales assistant operated the credit card terminal. She paused for a moment and pressed a button that I think said "台灣幣" in the lower left on the touchscreen. I then proceeded to offer my electronic signature making sure the terminal was printing NT$5,200. Then I got the receipt which made no mention of the DCC verbiage and just contains the line at the bottom of, "I agree to pay total amount according to card issuer agreement."

For the final test I went online and the charge is pending with Chase in the amount of $170.58. Using the current Visa rate of 0.032803 USD/TWD, the pending transaction matches exactly. I just wish all transactions with potential DCC could be this easy. I didn't think of write down the terminal type, but it has the EMV slot in the bottom and a monochrome touchscreen with a stylus for the electronic signature collection. The acquirer is the National Credit Card Center (NCCC).

If China DCC has a score of F, it looks to me that Taiwan has a C?

How does one avoid getting DCC'd when using Visa/MC in HK & Macau? Do I preemptively tell the waiter/waitress/hotel clerk to only charge my card in HKD? I'm guessing they'll just follow the same routine, giving me the standard CC receipt with the fake currency choice check-boxes as before. It appears unavoidable in the HKG/MFM area.