Jan 18, 2014, 10:10 pm
Last edit by: emilio911
What is it?
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) is a "service" some merchants and ATM operators offer that will charge a cardholder in the native currency of the card rather than the local currency. A more complete definition and examples are available via this Wikipedia article on DCC. While sold as a convenience to cardholders traveling outside of their home country, it is a pure profit play by the merchants. You may end up paying a fee of up to 8% over the purchase price for accepting DCC. Always decline DCC and asked to be billed in the local currency!
Where will I see it?
You can be hit with DCC anywhere there is a difference between your debit or credit card's denominated currency and the currency of the location where you're trying to use the card. The most common example will be at a merchant overseas, but now some ATMs are offering the service too. While many US cardholders complain about getting tricked into accepting DCC overseas, some merchants in the US have started to use DCC as well.
What is the issue?
Unless you're the merchant or ATM operator, there isn't much benefit to using DCC. Some customers say they prefer knowing exactly how much they'll be charged in their home currency or may not know the exchange rate of the place where they are visiting. For example, if you are in Prague for two days and you don't know how much the Czech Koruna is worth relative to the US Dollar, you might feel more comfortable knowing that you're buying an item for $205.00 versus 4000 CZK. However, the real exchange rate as of January 18, 2014 would place 4000 CZK at $197.18. You just paid an extra $7.82 for the "convenience" of knowing how much you'd be charged!
DCC often charges about a 4% premium over the true exchange rate. The problems don't stop there since many US banks still charge a 3% foreign transaction fee (FTF) for purchases made outside of the US. Not only would you get hit with the $205.00 charge, you could also find yourself facing a total charge of $211.15 if your card has a 3% FTF.
This is a pure money grab from the merchants, and it's billed as an easy way to squeeze additional revenue out of the transaction. Numerous [1, 2] articles have talked about DCC duping many consumers. Discover even has a warning about being tricked into DCC when using a card abroad.
For example, this FlyerTalk member reported that Avis charged his Saudi credit card in Saudi riyals instead of USD for a car rental in Florida without his consent. This has also been a trend for hotels, particularly large chains as indicated here and here.
DCC is simply not worth it for the consumer. Unless you like paying a convenience fee of up to 5% of the total transaction just to know how much you will be billed, you should always decline DCC and ask to be billed in local currency when handing over your card.
Furthermore, it is in your interest to obtain a card that has a 0% FTF. FlyerTalk member kebosabi maintains a fairly comprehensive spreadsheet of EMV-enabled cards ideal for overseas travel, many of which offer a low or 0% FTF as a feature. There is also a wiki at FlyerGuide of various FTF of debit and credit cards.
What can I do to avoid DCC?
American Express currently does not support DCC on its network, so you are safe from DCC if using an American Express card. However, Visa and MasterCard card networks can support DCC, so be vigilant when purchasing abroad with a Visa or MasterCard branded card. There have been reports of being charged DCC with a Discover card in China [citation needed], but primarily the issue is happening with Visa and MasterCard cards.
Before handing your card to the merchant, always specify clearly that you want to be charged in the local currency and that you do not want DCC. For some transactions, you retain control of your card as you dip it into a chip reader and can view on a screen to select which currency you want to use for the transaction. Always select the local currencyto get the best exchange rate. Do not select the card's native currency!
Similarly, for ATM withdrawals, make sure you decline any kind of conversions. Some good examples of what to look for when using an ATM overseas are here and here. You're probably coming off of a long flight and fatigued, but educating yourself beforehand can save you from getting ripped off. The user interfaces on almost all of these ATMs are set up to encourage you to take the bait, and you have to be extremely vigilant not to fall for it.
If you are doing a PIN-based transaction, you should have the opportunity to review the total amount and denomination of the transaction before entering your PIN. If you are doing a signature transaction and the merchant has processed your transaction with DCC, cross out the amount and write "DCC refused" on the receipt. Do not sign the receipt, and demand that the merchant reverse the transaction and run it in the local currency. If no verification is required due to a small purchase amount, ask the merchant to reverse the charge and repeat the transaction using local currency. If all else fails, file a dispute with your card issuer when you return home. Even if it's immaterial, the banks will get the message like they did with EMV.
Some merchants will claim that their systems have to bill you in your native currency. This is a complete lie. But just like a mag stripe only card, this is battle where you have to be prepared. Don't settle for merchants claiming that "it has to be done this way" or "pay cash if you don't want this". Be prepared to walk away, and, if you must complete the transaction, write "DCC refused & merchant didn't give a choice" on the receipt and cross out the amount. Let the merchant know that you will be filing a dispute with your bank.
Disabling DCC
Disabling DCC on ANZ terminals in Australia
ANZ markets DCC as Customer Preferred Currency (CPC). Terminal operators can contact ANZ Merchant Services at 1800 039 025 to have this feature disabled. Currently, your Visa or MasterCard will be subjected to DCC if denominated in: CAD, CHF, DKK, EUR, GBP, HKD, JPY, MYR, NOK, NZD, SEK, SGD, THB, USD, or ZAR. All DCC transactions on ANZ will cause a 2.5% markup. Steps to avoid DCC:
If you see a signature slip with DCC verbiage and a checkbox indicating a currency selection, kindly ask the merchant to void the transaction. If it's a PIN-based transaction, you have an additional opportunity to cancel the transaction because it will ask for your PIN a second time. For instance, if you see "EUR 17.29 KEY PIN" refuse to enter your PIN and start again.
Disabling DCC in China
There are many reports of forced DCC in China, and there is a great thread [closed to new posts] on DCC in China on the the China Destinations forum.
Disabling DCC on Bankcomm terminals in Beijing http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #19
jair101's DCC instructions of March 2011 http://www.etveg.com/misc/DCC_China.pdf
Disabling DCC in Eurozone and UK
DCC offered in tourist traps (Harrods Knightsbridge/Galleries Lafayette Montparnesse/El Cortes Ingles Grand Via Madrid)
Unlike the rest of the world, Visa Europe does not require merchants to collect a ticked box on the slip (presumably because merchants there don't keep signed slips under Chip-and-PIN)
El Cortes Ingles collects a signature electronically and the DCC selection is made on the signature pad - the choice is respected.
Harrods and GL rely on cashier input in the POS for the currency choice - the cashier may forget to ask. The POS do not offer voiding (only refunds), but since you're given a slip to sign the best thing to do is to deface it before signing and submit chargeback request to issuer bank on return home.
There may be smaller merchants who also collect DCC but I seemed to have pre-empted most of them by saying "charge Euros (Pounds) please"
In Spain all merchants by law are required to provide you with a complaint form called an hoja de reclamaciones if requested. The form has two carbon copies. The customer retains one copy as a record of the complaint. The merchant maintains another copy, and the third is sent to the local consumer protection bureau. Merchants are also required to post a sign conspicuously informing the customer of the right to complain (usually in Spanish and English). Do not accept the lie that they don't have any forms. This is illegal, and you are able to call the police if the merchant refuses to provide you with this official form. It's interesting to see merchants start to squirm when you know the rules, and most merchants will start to be accommodating after you mention it. (Please still fill out the form even if the merchant cooperates after mentioning it because these are likely the merchants who won't otherwise change their behavior.)
Disabling DCC in Hong Kong and Macau
Hong Kong and Macau can get as non-compliant as China, possibly because many acquirers have cross-border operations and know they can get away with non-compliant firmware and procedures.
In practice, if you are given a DCC slip, and the cashier has not taken a choice before giving you your copy, the slip will be processed in your home currency - be prepared to dispute.
Unable to disable Global Payments DCC in Hong Kong instance #1, instance #2
Unable to disable DBS DCC in Fortress Electronics HK
Unable to disable BoC DCC in Free Duty HK
Disabling DCC in Japan and Korea
Japan's just starting out http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/japan...ing-japan.html and http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=3939&p=17 #168 but there are no reports I know of where cardholders are compelled to use DCC against their will.
Korea is also not much affected by DCC but where offered, trying to opt out is harder than Japan due to the language barrier (both verbal and written)
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...hp?id=4303&p=3 #23
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #11
Disabling DCC in the Maldives
Disabling DCC on Global Payment terminals in the Maldives
Disabling DCC in Thailand and Taiwan
DCC present but generally not an issue. Cashier will generate quote slip is usually generated and pass to cardholder. When cardholder refuses, a verbage-free slip denominated in THB/TWD will be produced.
Certain Taiwan hotels may take deposits in cardholder currency. But these are only pre-authorisations and can be voided in full for TWD-only final checkout payments.
Disabling DCC on Websites
Airbnb - (Since the "loophole" seem not to work anymore, please report if you chargeback the DCC.
)
Hotwire - You need to select your preferred currency before making a search.
PayPal - The instructions to stop the DCC on a recurring charge are here.
I got duped by DCC already before I found this thread. Is there anything I can do?
If you've been hit with DCC and the merchant did not follow the Visa/MC rules, you should file a dispute with your card issuer. Even if the transaction is a small amount, it's worth it to dispute the charge on principle. Do not let merchants get away with this scam uncontested!
If you were not clearly given a choice of currencies and did not specifically communicate a preference to be billed in your card's native currency - if you did not accept DCC - then you have recourse when filing a dispute with your card issuer. The Visa Product and Service Rules clearly state (p 339):
You can even use terminology from Visa Product and Service Rules when filing the dispute, giving Reason Code 76: Incorrect Currency or Transaction Code. Reason Code 76 is used when the transaction was processed with an incorrect transaction code, or an incorrect currency code, or one of the following:
MasterCard's rules also clearly state that the POI Currency Conversion must be decided by both the merchant and customer. When filing a dispute with a MasterCard, list chargeback Reason Code 4846 from the MasterCard Chargeback Guide, which covers POI currency conversion disputes in the following circumstances:
You do have a choice of currencies. Exercise that choice!
Do not get taken by surprise when faced with DCC, and know your options. As Visa/MC purport, you do have a choice of currencies, but you need to make that choice heard! Don't be complacent in this sneaky tactic by some merchants to pad revenues.
Before going to a different country, get educated. Understand the exchange rate relative to your native currency. Know how to recognize when the merchant is trying to force DCC on the transaction, and pull out all of the stops to make sure it doesn't happen to you.
If you have a chip-and-PIN credit card, it's easier to control the transaction to try to prevent DCC. With chip-and-signature, if you get an uncooperative merchant, deface the merchant's copy of the receipt. Write LOCAL OPTION NOT OFFERED, cross out the DCC currency amount, and sign the receipt.
This will give additional evidence when filing a dispute to get the DCC charges refunded. When filing the dispute, you can use the Visa Exchange Rate Calculator or MasterCard's Currency Conversion Tool to determine the Visa or MasterCard exchange rate on the date the transaction posted to your credit card. Compare this to the DCC value to figure out the amount by which the merchant overcharged you. Don't forget to add in any Foreign Transaction Fee if your card has one. (If it does, you should really consider finding a card for use overseas without a FTF.)
Example Images (click for a larger image)
Hotel receipts in China, the Netherlands, and Dubai respectively:
Purchase receipts in China and Korea:
Cancelled translation in Hong Kong:
Novotel in Shenzen:
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) is a "service" some merchants and ATM operators offer that will charge a cardholder in the native currency of the card rather than the local currency. A more complete definition and examples are available via this Wikipedia article on DCC. While sold as a convenience to cardholders traveling outside of their home country, it is a pure profit play by the merchants. You may end up paying a fee of up to 8% over the purchase price for accepting DCC. Always decline DCC and asked to be billed in the local currency!
Where will I see it?
You can be hit with DCC anywhere there is a difference between your debit or credit card's denominated currency and the currency of the location where you're trying to use the card. The most common example will be at a merchant overseas, but now some ATMs are offering the service too. While many US cardholders complain about getting tricked into accepting DCC overseas, some merchants in the US have started to use DCC as well.
What is the issue?
Unless you're the merchant or ATM operator, there isn't much benefit to using DCC. Some customers say they prefer knowing exactly how much they'll be charged in their home currency or may not know the exchange rate of the place where they are visiting. For example, if you are in Prague for two days and you don't know how much the Czech Koruna is worth relative to the US Dollar, you might feel more comfortable knowing that you're buying an item for $205.00 versus 4000 CZK. However, the real exchange rate as of January 18, 2014 would place 4000 CZK at $197.18. You just paid an extra $7.82 for the "convenience" of knowing how much you'd be charged!
DCC often charges about a 4% premium over the true exchange rate. The problems don't stop there since many US banks still charge a 3% foreign transaction fee (FTF) for purchases made outside of the US. Not only would you get hit with the $205.00 charge, you could also find yourself facing a total charge of $211.15 if your card has a 3% FTF.
This is a pure money grab from the merchants, and it's billed as an easy way to squeeze additional revenue out of the transaction. Numerous [1, 2] articles have talked about DCC duping many consumers. Discover even has a warning about being tricked into DCC when using a card abroad.
For example, this FlyerTalk member reported that Avis charged his Saudi credit card in Saudi riyals instead of USD for a car rental in Florida without his consent. This has also been a trend for hotels, particularly large chains as indicated here and here.
DCC is simply not worth it for the consumer. Unless you like paying a convenience fee of up to 5% of the total transaction just to know how much you will be billed, you should always decline DCC and ask to be billed in local currency when handing over your card.
Furthermore, it is in your interest to obtain a card that has a 0% FTF. FlyerTalk member kebosabi maintains a fairly comprehensive spreadsheet of EMV-enabled cards ideal for overseas travel, many of which offer a low or 0% FTF as a feature. There is also a wiki at FlyerGuide of various FTF of debit and credit cards.
What can I do to avoid DCC?
American Express currently does not support DCC on its network, so you are safe from DCC if using an American Express card. However, Visa and MasterCard card networks can support DCC, so be vigilant when purchasing abroad with a Visa or MasterCard branded card. There have been reports of being charged DCC with a Discover card in China [citation needed], but primarily the issue is happening with Visa and MasterCard cards.
Before handing your card to the merchant, always specify clearly that you want to be charged in the local currency and that you do not want DCC. For some transactions, you retain control of your card as you dip it into a chip reader and can view on a screen to select which currency you want to use for the transaction. Always select the local currencyto get the best exchange rate. Do not select the card's native currency!
Similarly, for ATM withdrawals, make sure you decline any kind of conversions. Some good examples of what to look for when using an ATM overseas are here and here. You're probably coming off of a long flight and fatigued, but educating yourself beforehand can save you from getting ripped off. The user interfaces on almost all of these ATMs are set up to encourage you to take the bait, and you have to be extremely vigilant not to fall for it.
If you are doing a PIN-based transaction, you should have the opportunity to review the total amount and denomination of the transaction before entering your PIN. If you are doing a signature transaction and the merchant has processed your transaction with DCC, cross out the amount and write "DCC refused" on the receipt. Do not sign the receipt, and demand that the merchant reverse the transaction and run it in the local currency. If no verification is required due to a small purchase amount, ask the merchant to reverse the charge and repeat the transaction using local currency. If all else fails, file a dispute with your card issuer when you return home. Even if it's immaterial, the banks will get the message like they did with EMV.
Some merchants will claim that their systems have to bill you in your native currency. This is a complete lie. But just like a mag stripe only card, this is battle where you have to be prepared. Don't settle for merchants claiming that "it has to be done this way" or "pay cash if you don't want this". Be prepared to walk away, and, if you must complete the transaction, write "DCC refused & merchant didn't give a choice" on the receipt and cross out the amount. Let the merchant know that you will be filing a dispute with your bank.
Disabling DCC
Disabling DCC on ANZ terminals in Australia
ANZ markets DCC as Customer Preferred Currency (CPC). Terminal operators can contact ANZ Merchant Services at 1800 039 025 to have this feature disabled. Currently, your Visa or MasterCard will be subjected to DCC if denominated in: CAD, CHF, DKK, EUR, GBP, HKD, JPY, MYR, NOK, NZD, SEK, SGD, THB, USD, or ZAR. All DCC transactions on ANZ will cause a 2.5% markup. Steps to avoid DCC:
- Insert, swipe, or tap your payment card
- Have the cashier select credit (CR)
- The terminal will display CREDIT ACCOUNT
- If applicable, enter your PIN
- The terminal will display PROCESSING \ PLEASE WAIT
- The terminal will display EXCH <exchange rate> \ <currency> <amount> \ ACCEPT RATE? \ ENTER=YES CLR=NO
- Instruct the cashier to press the yellow CLEAR (CLR) button (If entering a PIN, you can retain the terminal to perform this step yourself. If entering a signature, you can ask for the terminal to control this process, not indicating that it's a chip-and-signature card.)
- The transaction should now process without DCC
If you see a signature slip with DCC verbiage and a checkbox indicating a currency selection, kindly ask the merchant to void the transaction. If it's a PIN-based transaction, you have an additional opportunity to cancel the transaction because it will ask for your PIN a second time. For instance, if you see "EUR 17.29 KEY PIN" refuse to enter your PIN and start again.
Disabling DCC in China
There are many reports of forced DCC in China, and there is a great thread [closed to new posts] on DCC in China on the the China Destinations forum.
Disabling DCC on Bankcomm terminals in Beijing http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #19
jair101's DCC instructions of March 2011 http://www.etveg.com/misc/DCC_China.pdf
Disabling DCC in Eurozone and UK
DCC offered in tourist traps (Harrods Knightsbridge/Galleries Lafayette Montparnesse/El Cortes Ingles Grand Via Madrid)
Unlike the rest of the world, Visa Europe does not require merchants to collect a ticked box on the slip (presumably because merchants there don't keep signed slips under Chip-and-PIN)
El Cortes Ingles collects a signature electronically and the DCC selection is made on the signature pad - the choice is respected.
Harrods and GL rely on cashier input in the POS for the currency choice - the cashier may forget to ask. The POS do not offer voiding (only refunds), but since you're given a slip to sign the best thing to do is to deface it before signing and submit chargeback request to issuer bank on return home.
There may be smaller merchants who also collect DCC but I seemed to have pre-empted most of them by saying "charge Euros (Pounds) please"
In Spain all merchants by law are required to provide you with a complaint form called an hoja de reclamaciones if requested. The form has two carbon copies. The customer retains one copy as a record of the complaint. The merchant maintains another copy, and the third is sent to the local consumer protection bureau. Merchants are also required to post a sign conspicuously informing the customer of the right to complain (usually in Spanish and English). Do not accept the lie that they don't have any forms. This is illegal, and you are able to call the police if the merchant refuses to provide you with this official form. It's interesting to see merchants start to squirm when you know the rules, and most merchants will start to be accommodating after you mention it. (Please still fill out the form even if the merchant cooperates after mentioning it because these are likely the merchants who won't otherwise change their behavior.)
Disabling DCC in Hong Kong and Macau
Hong Kong and Macau can get as non-compliant as China, possibly because many acquirers have cross-border operations and know they can get away with non-compliant firmware and procedures.
In practice, if you are given a DCC slip, and the cashier has not taken a choice before giving you your copy, the slip will be processed in your home currency - be prepared to dispute.
Unable to disable Global Payments DCC in Hong Kong instance #1, instance #2
Unable to disable DBS DCC in Fortress Electronics HK
Unable to disable BoC DCC in Free Duty HK
Disabling DCC in Japan and Korea
Japan's just starting out http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/japan...ing-japan.html and http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=3939&p=17 #168 but there are no reports I know of where cardholders are compelled to use DCC against their will.
Korea is also not much affected by DCC but where offered, trying to opt out is harder than Japan due to the language barrier (both verbal and written)
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...hp?id=4303&p=3 #23
http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=2 #11
Disabling DCC in the Maldives
Disabling DCC on Global Payment terminals in the Maldives
Disabling DCC in Thailand and Taiwan
DCC present but generally not an issue. Cashier will generate quote slip is usually generated and pass to cardholder. When cardholder refuses, a verbage-free slip denominated in THB/TWD will be produced.
Certain Taiwan hotels may take deposits in cardholder currency. But these are only pre-authorisations and can be voided in full for TWD-only final checkout payments.
Disabling DCC on Websites
Airbnb - (Since the "loophole" seem not to work anymore, please report if you chargeback the DCC.
)Hotwire - You need to select your preferred currency before making a search.
PayPal - The instructions to stop the DCC on a recurring charge are here.
I got duped by DCC already before I found this thread. Is there anything I can do?
If you've been hit with DCC and the merchant did not follow the Visa/MC rules, you should file a dispute with your card issuer. Even if the transaction is a small amount, it's worth it to dispute the charge on principle. Do not let merchants get away with this scam uncontested!
If you were not clearly given a choice of currencies and did not specifically communicate a preference to be billed in your card's native currency - if you did not accept DCC - then you have recourse when filing a dispute with your card issuer. The Visa Product and Service Rules clearly state (p 339):
- Merchants that offer DCC must be compliant with the regulations
- Inform the cardholder that DCC is optional
- Not impose any additional requirements to use local currency
- Not use any language or procedures that may cause the cardholder to choose DCC by default
- Not convert a transaction in the local currency to the card's billing currency after the transaction has completed
- Ensure that the cardholder expressly agrees to DCC
You can even use terminology from Visa Product and Service Rules when filing the dispute, giving Reason Code 76: Incorrect Currency or Transaction Code. Reason Code 76 is used when the transaction was processed with an incorrect transaction code, or an incorrect currency code, or one of the following:
- Merchant did not deposit a transaction receipt in the country where the transaction occurred
- Cardholder was not advised that Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) would occur
- Cardholder was refused the choice of paying in the merchant’s local currency
- Merchant processed a credit refund and did not process a reversal or adjustment within 30 calendar days for a transaction receipt processed in error
MasterCard's rules also clearly state that the POI Currency Conversion must be decided by both the merchant and customer. When filing a dispute with a MasterCard, list chargeback Reason Code 4846 from the MasterCard Chargeback Guide, which covers POI currency conversion disputes in the following circumstances:
- The cardholder states that he or she was not given the opportunity to choose the desired currency in which the transactions was completed or did not agree to the currency of the transaction, or
- POI currency conversion took place into a currency that is not the cardholder's billing currency, or
- POI currency conversion took place when the goods or services were priced in the cardholder's billing currency, or
- POI currency conversion took place when cash was disbursed in the cardholdeer's billing currency.
You do have a choice of currencies. Exercise that choice!
Do not get taken by surprise when faced with DCC, and know your options. As Visa/MC purport, you do have a choice of currencies, but you need to make that choice heard! Don't be complacent in this sneaky tactic by some merchants to pad revenues.
Before going to a different country, get educated. Understand the exchange rate relative to your native currency. Know how to recognize when the merchant is trying to force DCC on the transaction, and pull out all of the stops to make sure it doesn't happen to you.
If you have a chip-and-PIN credit card, it's easier to control the transaction to try to prevent DCC. With chip-and-signature, if you get an uncooperative merchant, deface the merchant's copy of the receipt. Write LOCAL OPTION NOT OFFERED, cross out the DCC currency amount, and sign the receipt.
This will give additional evidence when filing a dispute to get the DCC charges refunded. When filing the dispute, you can use the Visa Exchange Rate Calculator or MasterCard's Currency Conversion Tool to determine the Visa or MasterCard exchange rate on the date the transaction posted to your credit card. Compare this to the DCC value to figure out the amount by which the merchant overcharged you. Don't forget to add in any Foreign Transaction Fee if your card has one. (If it does, you should really consider finding a card for use overseas without a FTF.
)Example Images (click for a larger image)
Hotel receipts in China, the Netherlands, and Dubai respectively:
Purchase receipts in China and Korea:
Cancelled translation in Hong Kong:
Novotel in Shenzen:
Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) [2014-2016]
Jul 15, 2015, 4:46 am
#2011
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: MSP
Programs: Delta 1 MM, Platinum. Marriott-Hilton Gold
Posts: 312
IDBI had devised two slips. One signature slip for the amount in Rupee. Then the other slip is the DCC slip which is attached to your "paid" Bill. You can check the box to your delight. There is no space for signature there. They just print their payslip and file it away and can check the DCC box after you leave. I am told that the Indian checkout clerk gets a bonus that includes annual DCC. So now IDBI gives a portion of the kickback to the merchant. Only if one creates a scene, they bring their "old machine" out. I was DCC IN April at the ITC Maurya which is a 5 star hotel. President Obama stayed at that hotel. It is in an alliance with Starwood/Hyatt. Hilton hotels are the only one that do not DCC in India, but their default is DCC. I was at the Hilton Garden Inn at Saket, New Delhi earlier this month. The guy before me was DCC'ed and he did not even realize it. A lot of people have no idea what DCC is. For those of us who fight it, they make an exception. But I hate it that I have do that. Marriott is out for me. I am going to post my experience on trip advisor so everyone's is aware.
I would not have minded DCC if my bank (Synchrony for my Sams Mastercard) did not slug another 3% on top of DCC. Unless our corrupt politicalmasks that air as commissioners in FTC do anything about no change will happen. Lawyers looking for juicy class action suit can slam a billion dollar class action suit against Visa and Mastercard and include American hotels.
I would not have minded DCC if my bank (Synchrony for my Sams Mastercard) did not slug another 3% on top of DCC. Unless our corrupt politicalmasks that air as commissioners in FTC do anything about no change will happen. Lawyers looking for juicy class action suit can slam a billion dollar class action suit against Visa and Mastercard and include American hotels.
Jul 15, 2015, 4:58 am
#2012
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,804
IDBI had devised two slips. One signature slip for the amount in Rupee. Then the other slip is the DCC slip which is attached to your "paid" Bill. You can check the box to your delight. There is no space for signature there. They just print their payslip and file it away and can check the DCC box after you leave.
Jul 15, 2015, 7:13 am
#2013
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 557
But maybe people who regularly travel internationally for business are different.
Jul 15, 2015, 8:58 am
#2014
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,066
If I encountered such a machine, I would take a photo of the merchant copy of the rupee slip alone, and chargeback based on that. I will deny seeing the stand alone DCC selection slip, claim it was printed ex-post and therefore ineffective for evidencing any purported approval of DCC on my part - parol evidence rule used against the merchant for once.
In such a scenario, I agree with percysmith. I would claim I never saw the DCC slip. How did you discover this? You saw the additional slip print from the terminal?
There is something to be said for the way they do things in HK with carbon copy receipts. At least that provides strong proof in order for the issuer to take up your case. Otherwise, the only option you have is to document things as best you can at the scene and hope that's enough where you can convince the issuer to do a chargeback.
Jul 15, 2015, 9:12 am
#2015
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,804
There is something to be said for the way they do things in HK with carbon copy receipts. At least that provides strong proof in order for the issuer to take up your case. Otherwise, the only option you have is to document things as best you can at the scene and hope that's enough where you can convince the issuer to do a chargeback.
Jul 15, 2015, 10:06 am
#2016
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 710
I understand why people would want to use DCC, the more confusing thing to me is that she claimed they don't offer it to people, they only perform it on request. Ergo, I was confused about that many people a) being informed enough about DCC to know it's an option without being asked and b) then deciding that they want to use it anyway.
But maybe people who regularly travel internationally for business are different.
But maybe people who regularly travel internationally for business are different.
This idea that people "want" DCC to help them manage their trip costs is totally bogus and designed to give the merchant cover for ripping off their customers. Any modern expense reporting system for business will have currency conversion built in, so there's no need to convert receipts to home currency.
Jul 15, 2015, 1:48 pm
#2017
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 415
I've traveled internationally extensively my entire career. I have never run into anyone who wanted DCC and I can count on one hand the number of people who even knew what it was.
This idea that people "want" DCC to help them manage their trip costs is totally bogus and designed to give the merchant cover for ripping off their customers. Any modern expense reporting system for business will have currency conversion built in, so there's no need to convert receipts to home currency.
This idea that people "want" DCC to help them manage their trip costs is totally bogus and designed to give the merchant cover for ripping off their customers. Any modern expense reporting system for business will have currency conversion built in, so there's no need to convert receipts to home currency.
The vast majority of people do not know about the evils of DCC and are more than happy to accept it when offered, especially when the merchant/waiter is making it seem like they are doing you favour.
Jul 15, 2015, 1:59 pm
#2018
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cambridge, UK
Posts: 261
I've traveled internationally extensively my entire career. I have never run into anyone who wanted DCC and I can count on one hand the number of people who even knew what it was.
This idea that people "want" DCC to help them manage their trip costs is totally bogus and designed to give the merchant cover for ripping off their customers. Any modern expense reporting system for business will have currency conversion built in, so there's no need to convert receipts to home currency.
This idea that people "want" DCC to help them manage their trip costs is totally bogus and designed to give the merchant cover for ripping off their customers. Any modern expense reporting system for business will have currency conversion built in, so there's no need to convert receipts to home currency.
An example would be where €500 today costs £350, whereas one week again it would cost £360.
My credit card does not charge fees for overseas transactions, but if I wanted to be reimbursed for these, again I would have to submit a statement. DCC eliminates this as there would be no bank charges.
Regardless of what I said above, I normally pay in local currency (objecting to any DCC) and just take my employer's exchange rate. Unless there has been some major movement in the markets, the difference is minimal. You lose out on some trips but gain on others, so it doesn't really matter.
My employer even "falls" for DCC. We have bank accounts in EUR and GBP, but my secretary only has a credit card in GBP. She always seems to go ahead with the DCC when booking stuff online for me. My last flight booking cost about 5% more
Jul 15, 2015, 3:55 pm
#2019
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 710
I suspect that's the difference between asking "Would you like us to charge your card in US Dollars?" vs. "Would you like us to charge your card in US Dollars at an exchange rate that causes you to pay 15% more than it would cost if we charged in the local currency?"
Jul 16, 2015, 5:56 am
#2020
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,187
My experiences in India were that the DCC default to card issuers currency is hard coded into the terminal and can only be lifted by a sequence of certain key strokes (see my earlier post about experiences in Kolkata in this thread). If the cashier at the hotel calls his technical contact, they can guide him/her on how to disable DCC on the terminal.
In other news I'm happy to report that inspite of extreme hectic travel in the US, Europe and Asia I've not been hit by DCC at all in the last six months. China has been really good to me, and I've been in little provincial towns as well as major cities. Some terminals have a problem reading my MC EMV chip for some reason, so there I've used my Amex. The only place I encountered DCC recently was in PRG looking to take out 3000 CZK from an ATM. Thanks to this thread I knew what button to press to avoid it.
Re DCC and if people want it: my colleague even strangely prefers it. After I explained it to him (our MC takes 1.25% forex) back in 2013 he still shrugged. But then he stayed at a swanky place in Dubai and the DCC cost him 50€ extra, which he didn't get reimbursed from our company (we have a fixed daily exchange rate) and he spend 15 minutes complaining about DCC to me. Another 'I told you so' moment...
Jul 16, 2015, 7:38 am
#2021
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Irvine CA & PEK
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, IHG Spire Ambassador, Qantas Platinum, United S
Posts: 664
My experiences in India were that the DCC default to card issuers currency is hard coded into the terminal and can only be lifted by a sequence of certain key strokes (see my earlier post about experiences in Kolkata in this thread). If the cashier at the hotel calls his technical contact, they can guide him/her on how to disable DCC on the terminal.
The next morning I went to the front desk and asked the nice New Zealand lady who checked me in, and she gave me 2pm without me even asking for that time.
No offence to anyone on this forum, just that the post above describing there are hidden key stroke sequences to avoid DCC in India brought up this memory of mine...
On another topic, AMEX SPG cards are soon waiving FTF. I can finally use my SPG cards for oversee SPG stays. Even using it for regular purchases might be more beneficial than using the another one of the best, the Barclay Arrival+. At least for now AMEX cannot be DCCed.
The Barclay Arrival+ has fell back to my back up card for oversee regular purchases, and the one for Chip-and-Pin.
Jul 16, 2015, 8:39 am
#2022
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,066
In other news I'm happy to report that inspite of extreme hectic travel in the US, Europe and Asia I've not been hit by DCC at all in the last six months. China has been really good to me, and I've been in little provincial towns as well as major cities. Some terminals have a problem reading my MC EMV chip for some reason, so there I've used my Amex. The only place I encountered DCC recently was in PRG looking to take out 3000 CZK from an ATM. Thanks to this thread I knew what button to press to avoid it.
Re DCC and if people want it: my colleague even strangely prefers it. After I explained it to him (our MC takes 1.25% forex) back in 2013 he still shrugged. But then he stayed at a swanky place in Dubai and the DCC cost him 50€ extra, which he didn't get reimbursed from our company (we have a fixed daily exchange rate) and he spend 15 minutes complaining about DCC to me. Another 'I told you so' moment...
Re DCC and if people want it: my colleague even strangely prefers it. After I explained it to him (our MC takes 1.25% forex) back in 2013 he still shrugged. But then he stayed at a swanky place in Dubai and the DCC cost him 50€ extra, which he didn't get reimbursed from our company (we have a fixed daily exchange rate) and he spend 15 minutes complaining about DCC to me. Another 'I told you so' moment...
I have heard that China is better than it used to be, but I thought there were still problems. Would you say DCC is less common in the provincial towns compared to major cities? If you're primarily using AmEx you won't see DCC, but what % of your transactions are MasterCard? You're still not seeing DCC, or it's easy to avoid?
As for your colleague, the word schadenfreude comes to mind when someone with a cavalier or apathetic attitude toward DCC finally gets burned. This contradicts the DCC literature, which extols the virtues of DCC and being able to reconcile expense reports in one's own currency. Hopefully the outcome of this is a traveler who will always be vigilant and avoid DCC in the future. Why did he prefer DCC before this? Was the company picking up the expense?
Jul 18, 2015, 5:23 pm
#2023
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 557
Avoided DCC inflight buying something from duty-free shopping on Lufthansa. The F/A swiped (not dipped), entered the amount, then hit enter. An offer appeared that I couldn't read the terms of because the F/A so quickly hit "EUR" and went on with the transaction. The only way I know it was DCC is that the two softkeys at the bottom of the terminal were "USD" and "EUR".
Jul 19, 2015, 5:55 am
#2024
Join Date: Aug 2008
Programs: HHonors Gold, Marriott Lifetime Gold, IHG Gold, OZ*G, AA Gold, AS MVP
Posts: 1,874
First DCC in Austria: a cafe I'd been going to with no trouble up until a week ago now prompts with "DCC Offer: 1:EUR 2:USD" when I insert my AA Barclaycard. Strangely enough, it also prompts for USD conversion with my multi-currency ICBC card, so I guess it does have a currency code after all. That or it was inserted in the issuer script I just got that also changed the CVM list to prefer PIN over signature.
Jul 20, 2015, 2:11 am
#2025
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,187
I have heard that China is better than it used to be, but I thought there were still problems. Would you say DCC is less common in the provincial towns compared to major cities? If you're primarily using AmEx you won't see DCC, but what % of your transactions are MasterCard? You're still not seeing DCC, or it's easy to avoid?
As for your colleague, the word schadenfreude comes to mind when someone with a cavalier or apathetic attitude toward DCC finally gets burned. This contradicts the DCC literature, which extols the virtues of DCC and being able to reconcile expense reports in one's own currency. Hopefully the outcome of this is a traveler who will always be vigilant and avoid DCC in the future. Why did he prefer DCC before this? Was the company picking up the expense?
Our company requires you to report the expenses in the local currency shown on the receipt (not the CC charge slip), which is then converted at the daily exchange rate valid at the date of the receipt and a standard 1or 2% is added automatically to cover any fx variances for you. The background here is that our company provides us with fee free credit cards (Amex and Visa) which AFAIK have a fx transaction fee. This ~2% roughly covered the DCC 'spread' encountered by my colleague, until he was hit at the DXB luxury hotel
.Avoided DCC inflight buying something from duty-free shopping on Lufthansa. The F/A swiped (not dipped), entered the amount, then hit enter. An offer appeared that I couldn't read the terms of because the F/A so quickly hit "EUR" and went on with the transaction. The only way I know it was DCC is that the two softkeys at the bottom of the terminal were "USD" and "EUR".