Thanks for sharing the above. The majority of TSA employees I've encountered are great people. Unfortunately there is a minority which are on power-trips and treat passengers like crap.

My problem is not so much with the people (unless I get a bad apple), it's with some of the stupid, useless procedures or the way they're being conducted.

As much as I dislike the TSA, I often thank TSA employees in my travels when they treat me with respect. I've had many TSA employees thank me as well. I appreciate it when TSA agents do things like putting cable ties on my luggage after CTX screening if I request it (or on the rare-occassion they will lock it for me).

Other than a few bad apples at the screener level, the problem, IMHO, is with the higher ups and the way the TSA is operated. When appropriate I do complain or verbally disagree with procedures. Sometimes the response is 'thank you for your comments', or the agent will suggest I speak with a supervisor or fill out a comment card --- other times the response is a full secondary screening and anal-probe because I disagreed with something. What's wrong with this picture?

I consider the full secondary screening & anal-probe harassment when it occurs as a result of me making a comment or respectfully disagreeing with a procedure. Whenever I disagree or make such comments, it's done respectfully -- it's not like I'm using obscene language or pushing the screeners around.

Best,

SDF_Traveler

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

How nice. Calling other FlyerTalkers "idiots."

When I see a person go through who was obviously annoyed by the condition of our floor as they went through shoeless, I often used to take them a comment card so they could complain because I frankly found it embarrassing asking people to remove their shoes but not being able to offer them disposable slippers or at least a frequently cleaned surface. But, alas, management didn't like us doing that so they took our comment cards away.

I've also been present when a screener has reacted rudely or extra-officiously to a simple, polite comment or question. Unfortunately one of my point-leaders acts this way quite often so even if we're handling the situation with ease she'll jump in with her god**** rules and screw everything up, even if we were just having a pleasant discussion with the passenger.

[This message has been edited by CATSA Screener (edited 06-10-2003).]

Hi CATSA -

While I don't know you personally, I get the impression you're a great screener. Perhaps you can come down to the states and help fix things here Unfortunately it sounds like you have many of the same problems in Canada as we do here in the states. I do thank you for your contributions here.

I'm sorry to hear they took away your comment cards, as I feel they are a valuable tool for individuals to provide candid feedback, be it positive or negative. Of course the completed comment cards would have to reach someone of authority willing to make change in order to produce real results.

The type of employee you describe are the ones I hate (and I believe have no business working in the field). I feel the ones that will go in your face as if they're god & harass you because you raise a concern or make a complaint give the TSA a bad name.

I once had a TSA employee threaten to "arrest me" because I refused to remove my wallet and put it through the x-ray machine. I then pointed out to him that he did not have the ability to arrest me and I politely told him if he wanted to inspect my wallet, he could do it with me present. I had over $500 cash in my wallet, my identification, plus credit cards & other important items and I was not about to toss it on the belt where it would be seperated from me in the screening process.

The same TSA employee that threatened me with arrest stated to me "The President makes the laws & I enforce them". I almost laughed in his face after he told me that, but I restrained myself.

A few times when I've had serious problems with TSA employees harassing me I've gotten a police officer involved, who has always taken my side and gotten the situation resolved immediately.

I get the impression most law enforcement officers at airports in the US don't care for the TSA and many of the problems some of the [bad] screeners generate.

Best,

SDF_Traveler

P.S. Anyone ever have the misfortune of the TSA opening your checked luggage in the bowels of the airport only to repack your suitcase with someone elses belongings? The airline I flew with paid the claim, but I personally feel the TSA should of deducted $740 from the paycheck of moron screener who did this to me instead. According to the luggage claim specialist I dealt with, this was becoming a problem as many bags are checked by hand because of the high rate of CTX false positives.


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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

Please see:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum...ML/006507.html

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

[This message has been edited by tazi (edited 06-10-2003).]

Thanks for the interesting reading. Perhaps I should have gone to the media when it happened to me. Sadly, I suspect it happens more often than the TSA will admit to. I'm just fortunate the airline paid my claim in full (minus the value of the lock that was cutoff, which was only a couple of bucks anyhow).

Personally I believe the amount of the claim should of been deducted from the moron TSA screener(s) which did this... or at least the TSA taking responsibility and offering to pay the claim (or locate & return the contents of my suitcase to me undamaged).

I hear airlines are now starting to deny such claims and are requesting pax file claims with the TSA. It's a pain to file a claim with an airline as it is -- could you just immagine the claim process with the TSA? I wonder how many years it would take the TSA to pay a claim?

The fact the airline baggage folks indicated this was happening to other people is quite disturbing. When you check your luggage, not only do you have to be concerned about baggage handlers stealing stuff, but the TSA stealing and/or misplacing your stuff. No wonder you see people bring everything but the kitchen sink onto aircraft these days as "carry-ons".

Regards,

SDF_Traveler

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

You can freely wonder around the airport all that you want until you try to board a plane that is federally regulated. Charter your own plane and be as free as you want.Simple answer.

Actually my last job in the Army was at the Army Safety Center, Ft Rucker AL. I am quite familiar with risk analysis/management, probability, cause and effect. The data has to be collected first within set parimeters then analyzed. It probably hasn't even been started yet. I know of no tracking system for what you are suggesting.

The fact is that AAA did a survey last fall that identified that 25% of all reduction in short and medium distance flying was due to security hassle avoidance. (The rest was economic.)

Certainly my wife and I are flying as much less as we can manage to avoid being molested and harassed by the TSA goons we all too often encounter.

I have never felt violated or insulted at the much-more-attentive European security checkpoints. I have also run into good TSAers (despite the idiotic policies they have to enforce), including a wonderfully competent tension-defusing lady last Monday in Seattle.

That does not excuse the monumental and worthless waste of resources this charade has become, or bely the fact that airlines are hurting and dying as a result of these counterproductive policies.

Or excuse that the multiple billions of dollars wasted could be making either a useful contribution to security or saving many thousands of lives pursuing highway safety or providing provenly effective drugs to needy patients.

All of life is an evaluation of risk and benefit. We are getting no useful benefit from this expenditure and probably multiplying our risk by belittling the truly frightening threats (rogue employees, anti-aircraft missiles) that will eventually bring down another civilian airliner.

As with the many civilized societies over time which have been beset with terrorists, we should find that prudence and alertness are much better shields than paranoia and hysteria. Until we recognize that nothing can guarantee that there will not be successful terrorism, we uselessly waste resources and make it that much more likely that the terrorists will succeed.

Meanwhile, by diminishing what makes our way of life enjoyable and valuable, we give them the preliminary victory of letting our own foolish ignorant (if majoritarian) fears do their work.

You all happy?

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Willful ignorance is worse than stupidity.

[edited fot silly speelling mistake]
e-mail address under profile

[This message has been edited by LexPassenger (edited 06-11-2003).]

No thanks. I have no desire to be senselessly harassed by any agency. I don't give a rip if it's "federally regulated". And this asinine agency is even moving towards harassing charter flights. It's time to get rid of the scumbags in charge of the TSA. If that doesn't stop the stupidity and harassment, then it's time to get rid of the TSA. Admiral Loy can go @#$% himself.




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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

Excuse me for jumping into the middle of this spirited discussion. I have read through all the posts and, as pertains to those from the known TSA folks, I nominate the one above as the most telling.
My honeymoon with TSA lasted about one month. They appeared to be a pleasant alternative to the bozos who preceded them. I now find the TSA to be overbearing, irritating and, as CATSA Screener states, mostly folks either on their way to something better, treading water or supplementing their retirement. Not exactly what one would hope to find in a "crack" security force.

I understand your frustrations, I really do.There is not an instant fix. People were hired in such a rush common sense was set aside,BUT things are looking up. It is my personal opinion that these layoffs were designed to dump the slackers and problem children. My airport released supervisors and leads also.It has become vary apparent who the deadbeat screening managers are also.They are on 2 year contracts. I do not think that half of them will be there when the time comes. There are many in the lower ranks who can fill a managers position and be **** good at it.Changes are coming through the pipeline.

1. Surveys can be swayed one way or the other.
2.I would bet that if you tried an experiment and treated a screener like they were your long lost buddy your experience would be totally different. Besides, I cannot understand how anyone can expect to be treated the same in every airport exactly the same way. Big airports have big attitudes. Look at the culture of the surrounding area.Are you treated the same way in every resturant? I doubt it.
3.I lived in Germany for 3 years and things are not the same. We have far more freedoms than they will ever have, but that was why we left there long ago isnt it? Have you ever witnessed German police in action. Remember Rodney King,they don't play around.Be thankful we don't adopt their frame of mind.
4.The airlines are hurting because of labor unions, old aircraft, rising fuel costs, and a proven/well documented record of piss poor management. Jet Blue just ordered 100 new aircraft. Southwest is still showing a profit.Maybe others should pay attention.
5. Saving lives on the roadway system is the biggest problem in our nation today and it can be easily proven.Other than aviation accidents, there is probably nothing more documented. Is there a solution? More laws?more road blocks? How about holding alcohol manufacturers responsible?You will never stop it. You can only do your best to reduce it. POV accidents are the biggest killer in our military today. I was in several meetings in which this problem was addressed. Just short of banning POVs, the only good solution was spend more time educating troops about vehicle safety,but unfortunately safety is taking a backseat to classes spent on "consideration of others rainbow feelings".
6.Priorities need to be redirected in my opinion also.Getting rid of the TSA is not the solution. Shifting to other areas as you mentioned needs to happen, but Washington does not want to admit that for some reason.

I will never claim that this organization is the answer to our security problems but is a private contractor who's bottom line is profit at minimum effort? Maybe a mixture will be the answer.


[This message has been edited by tsadude (edited 06-12-2003).]

[This message has been edited by tsadude (edited 06-12-2003).]

Things are not looking up they are getting worse. Weeding out the slackers is not going to change this stupid new shoe policy nor will it stop the increasing numbers of gate rapes going on. The TSA seems more unorganized than it ever has. And you can stop with the "people were hired in a hurry" excuse.


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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

I guess that you have more information than I do. How long have you been working for the TSA?