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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   Requirement for speaking your name? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1398391-requirement-speaking-your-name.html)

cynicAAl Nov 1, 2012 9:45 pm

Here was my experience at SFO T3 today:

TDC: tell me your first and last name
Me: it’s right there in your hand on my BP and ID
TDC: I need you to tell me your name
Me: why ? are you unable to read ?
TDC: why can’t you just tell me your name ?
Me: as you can see from my BP and ID in your hand, my name is unique, and since I don’t know these people around me, it would be unsafe for me to state my name in public as they would know I’m traveling and away from my home.
TDC: if you won’t tell me your name, you’ll have to be screened in a private room
Me: sounds good, let’s go
TDC: actually, we don’t have any private rooms
Me: so you were just lying to me just then ?
TDC: (no response)
Me: maybe you should call a supervisor
Supv: what’s the problem here ?
Me: no problem, but this young lady is having trouble with my ID and BP
TDC: he won’t say his name
Me: (explains to Supv again why I won’t state my name)
TDC: if you want to fly, you need to tell me your name
Me: my name is clearly spelled out on my ID and BP
TDC: but they don’t match, you need to tell me your name
Me: you need to read it again; they match exactly
TDC: if you don’t tell me your name, you’re not flying today
Me to supv: is that correct ? Is there some law or policy that requires me to speak my name here ?
Supv walks away without answering
TDC: what is your first name ?
Me: Brad (note that this is not remotely similar to my actual name)
TDC: and your last name ?
Me: Wilson (also not remotely similar to my actual last name)
TDC handing me back my BP and ID: I don’t know why you need to be so difficult, it’s not that hard to say your name
Me: if you were paying attention, you would have noticed that the names I told you were not mine, and didn’t match the name on my ID and BP, so this name game you like to play clearly has no effect on security, and is a waste of everyone’s time.

Upon collecting my bags from the xray machine, I noticed a 3 striper across from me, so I asked her why her staff was allowed to be incredibly rude, and detailed my experience at the document check podium. She told me that they are required to ask names to be spoken. I informed her why I did not want to state my name in public, and asked if it was true that I would be denied access to the airport unless I spoke my name. She repeated that they are required to ask…I again informed her that I’m fine with them asking, but can I be denied access if I fail to speak my name out loud. She then turned and just walked away without answering.

zitsky Nov 2, 2012 7:49 am


Originally Posted by cynicAAl (Post 19608963)
Here was my experience at SFO T3 today:


Supv walks away without answering
TDC: what is your first name ?
Me: Brad (note that this is not remotely similar to my actual name)
TDC: and your last name ?
Me: Wilson (also not remotely similar to my actual last name)

It's pretty obvious from your FT username that your first name is "Al". And now I have your real last name, Mr. Wilson, nice try attempting to throw us off the trail. Your story was pretty entertaining. I'm amazed that they let you go away without any major hassle.

:)

bdschobel Nov 2, 2012 7:52 am

I told the drones at SFO that my name is "Bob Smith." They said that my boarding pass says otherwise. I said that's how it's pronounced in my language. They let me go.

Bruce

Pingtung Nov 2, 2012 8:48 am


Originally Posted by bdschobel (Post 19610597)
I told the drones at SFO that my name is "Bob Smith." They said that my boarding pass says otherwise. I said that's how it's pronounced in my language. They let me go.

Bruce

At SFO I tried something similar and didn't get through like you did. After a 10 minute delay and some escalations, we finally agreed to terms to satisfy my privacy concerns (I wrote it down). There was almost no one at the checkpoint that early so the guy manning the lines asked me what happened and I told him I didn't want to say my name, to which he responded "All those people just for a name? How stupid. DHS is all up in our business since we're private, it's annoying". So at least some of them realize the ridiculousness.

Late last year they were asking folks at the T8 checkpoint and I just feigned a lack of English speaking skills (traveling to Amman) and pointed to my boarding pass so he read it for me and nicely sent me on my way.

cynicAAl Nov 2, 2012 9:07 am


Originally Posted by Pingtung (Post 19610883)
At SFO I tried something similar and didn't get through like you did. After a 10 minute delay and some escalations, we finally agreed to terms to satisfy my privacy concerns (I wrote it down).

next time, I will pull out a card from my pocket that simply states " I Am Deaf"

InkUnderNails Nov 2, 2012 10:05 am


Originally Posted by cynicAAl (Post 19611015)
next time, I will pull out a card from my pocket that simply states " I Am Deaf"

Better yet, if you are going to fake a disability, learn the sign.

Go to "D" in the dictionary. I like Deaf-2 better.

I used to use "I" "Option" "Out" as well.

puddinhead Nov 2, 2012 10:37 am

Mumble incoherently - like the drunk guy who is now 2 levels past the “I love you man” stage of drinking.

When the screener asks you to repeat, just say it louder while bobbing and shaking your head.

pirossalma Nov 2, 2012 10:43 am

I don't speak English
 
TDC: State your first and last name
(Elderly, fragile) Pax: (with terrible accent) I don't speak English / I don't understand
TDC: (louder) STATE YOUR FIRST AND LAST NAME
Pax: (scared, intimidated) I don't speak English
TDC (shouting) STATE !!! YOUR !!! FIRST !!! AND LAST !!! NAME!!!
Pax: almost crying

At this point often the TDC weaves him/her through with some loud insult/humiliating joke - clearly audible for other pax.

Some of the TDCs just don't get it, so they continue:

TDC: What language do you speak? WHAT LANGUAGE DO YOU SPEAK?

or Habla Espanol? (to definitely NOT Spanish speaking pax)

The real sad part of this, that they do this even when the pax shows a passport from NOT English speaking country.

.....

Somehow I have never witnessed similar scenes with the CBP.

FliesWay2Much Nov 2, 2012 12:24 pm


Originally Posted by pirossalma (Post 19611494)
TDC: State your first and last name
(Elderly, fragile) Pax: (with terrible accent) I don't speak English / I don't understand
TDC: (louder) STATE YOUR FIRST AND LAST NAME
Pax: (scared, intimidated) I don't speak English
TDC (shouting) STATE !!! YOUR !!! FIRST !!! AND LAST !!! NAME!!!
Pax: almost crying

At this point often the TDC weaves him/her through with some loud insult/humiliating joke - clearly audible for other pax.

Some of the TDCs just don't get it, so they continue:

TDC: What language do you speak? WHAT LANGUAGE DO YOU SPEAK?

or Habla Espanol? (to definitely NOT Spanish speaking pax)

The real sad part of this, that they do this even when the pax shows a passport from NOT English speaking country.

.....

Somehow I have never witnessed similar scenes with the CBP.

Geez -- Maybe it's true: They really CAN'T read!!!???

AKC6 Nov 7, 2012 7:13 pm

but they CAN read
 

Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much (Post 19612046)
Geez -- Maybe it's true: They really CAN'T read!!!???

Pizza boxes, at least.

RockyMtnScotsman Nov 7, 2012 7:43 pm

the few times I've been asked I point at my throat and wave my hand back and forth; they've always nodded knowingly and signed my BP and passed me on.

One of these days, as I walk past I'm going to say "thanks" just to see the look on their face.

janetdoe Nov 7, 2012 10:34 pm


Originally Posted by cynicAAl (Post 19608963)
She repeated that they are required to ask…I again informed her that I’m fine with them asking, but can I be denied access if I fail to speak my name out loud. She then turned and just walked away without answering.

That's because the answer is "no." No one has ever denied me access because I refused to state my name.

The question is designed to collect evidence that you are using false documents to enter the checkpoint, which is a criminal offense. Plead the 5th Amendment.

WillCAD Nov 8, 2012 10:12 am


Originally Posted by janetdoe (Post 19645430)
That's because the answer is "no." No one has ever denied me access because I refused to state my name.

The question is designed to collect evidence that you are using false documents to enter the checkpoint, which is a criminal offense. Plead the 5th Amendment.

The question is a laughably pathetic attempt to trip up those traveling on false documents. The assumption is that, if you're traveling on a false ID and BP to circumvent the no-fly or watch lists, and someone asks you your name, you'll automatically answer with your real name, which won't match the false one on your travel documents - thus preventing another 9/11.

It came about because of the Nigerian guy who was able to "slip" through the c/p using his actual ID and a bunch of fake and/or out of date BPs, most of which weren't even in his name. Obviously, the TDCs who were supposed to check his ID against his BP to make sure he was the ticketed passenger didn't actually read the names on the two documents and compare them.

So, because of a bunch of TDCs who couldn't or wouldn't do the unbelievably simple task assigned them - i.e. read two names and if they're not the same, don't let the person through - we now have yet another ridiculous procedure that adds no value whatsoever to security, but adds another layer of delay, potential conflict, and pretentious authorotah! to the screening process.

Whoops, sorry, I just repeated what almost everyone on FT has said about this nonsense a million times before. Sorry for the delay, folks, please move on to the next topic...

cynicAAl Nov 8, 2012 10:26 am


Originally Posted by WillCAD (Post 19647956)
The question is a laughably pathetic attempt to trip up those traveling on false documents. The assumption is that, if you're traveling on a false ID and BP to circumvent the no-fly or watch lists, and someone asks you your name, you'll automatically answer with your real name, which won't match the false one on your travel documents - thus preventing another 9/11.

and the fact that I spoke a completely different name than what was printed on my ID and BP, yet still allowed to clear security proves that there truly is no point to this name game. Of course, try to explain that to a GED-program graduate...

FliesWay2Much Nov 8, 2012 1:00 pm


Originally Posted by cynicAAl (Post 19648054)
and the fact that I spoke a completely different name than what was printed on my ID and BP, yet still allowed to clear security proves that there truly is no point to this name game. Of course, try to explain that to a GED-program graduate...

Additionally, there is no law requiring anyone to pronounce their name as it would be pronounced phonetically by a first-language U.S. English speaker. Also, there is no requirement to pronounce your name the same way all the time.

If you throw in BBC English, it's a different ballgame altogether. If my name is spelled "Plough," is it "Plow" or "Pluff?"

Now, throw in a New Zealand accent. and a counterterrorism travel document checker would really be in a tizzy. For example, a Kiwi acquaintance has a cat whose name is spelled "Teddy." In Kiwi, it comes out "Teedy." Oh, the humanity!


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