Whole Body Scanners Opt Out Stories [merged]
Mar 28, 2012, 12:21 pm
#2431
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Jackson, WY
Posts: 122
LAX Delta opt-out
Opted out, yet again, at the Delta Security gate at LAX. OK experience, and my first time of opting-out at the same time as another passenger. I had to insist that I stand somewhere I could see my bags, but the TSA guy was OK about it. My agent was friendly and professional, and stopped short of the "groin area." Which was good for me, but reminded me (again) of why I think the whole thing is utter hogwash.
All my experiences to date have been OK and friendly. Maybe I'm lucky, or else it is because I have a pretty mellow personality to begin with. Takes a lot to upset me.
I do worry about my bags, and trying to maintain a visual on them is always the biggest stressor.
All my experiences to date have been OK and friendly. Maybe I'm lucky, or else it is because I have a pretty mellow personality to begin with. Takes a lot to upset me.
I do worry about my bags, and trying to maintain a visual on them is always the biggest stressor.
Mar 28, 2012, 7:41 pm
#2432
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 1,007
Mar 28, 2012, 8:40 pm
#2433
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Up in the air far too often.
Programs: Star Gold
Posts: 354
Opted out, yet again, at the Delta Security gate at LAX. OK experience, and my first time of opting-out at the same time as another passenger. I had to insist that I stand somewhere I could see my bags, but the TSA guy was OK about it. My agent was friendly and professional, and stopped short of the "groin area." Which was good for me, but reminded me (again) of why I think the whole thing is utter hogwash.
All my experiences to date have been OK and friendly. Maybe I'm lucky, or else it is because I have a pretty mellow personality to begin with. Takes a lot to upset me.
I do worry about my bags, and trying to maintain a visual on them is always the biggest stressor.
All my experiences to date have been OK and friendly. Maybe I'm lucky, or else it is because I have a pretty mellow personality to begin with. Takes a lot to upset me.
I do worry about my bags, and trying to maintain a visual on them is always the biggest stressor.
As any ultra-frequent flyer will tell you (and there are some that are even more than me, and I travel every week), the majority of checkpoint experiences are almost tolerable, despite me disagreeing with the patdown. At least the agents are quick and generally polite.
Then, perhaps say 1 out of 20 times, I'll get some just simply awful, inhumane experience, and have to summon supervisor, or have some agent that starts yelling, or is otherwise off his rocker. If you fly once a month, this will happen very rarely. If you fly one place a week, this will happen almost every other month.
Most TSA guys are just simple people following orders and don't really care/believe in what they are doing. They are tolerable.
There are a few "Zimmerman" type agents that believe they are God-like and need to protect the airplane from YOU. They have fantasies of being in total control. These are the ones that can make your experience a nightmare.
Keep flying, unfortunately once you'll have a very bad experience. When you do, we'll be right here to hear your tale.
Mar 28, 2012, 8:52 pm
#2434
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: UA
Posts: 48
Mar 29, 2012, 2:30 pm
#2435
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Up in the air far too often.
Programs: Star Gold
Posts: 354
Meh, it is just a little insightful hyperbole. It is not meant to offend, but I think it is useful to see parallels in the overboard "security mindset" even if it requires "going there."
Zimmerman was an over-zealous cop-wannabe, not qualified (some reports say rejected) for the actual police force, wanting to "do good" in his mind, but in fact did very, very, very bad. The similarities are quite clear, including elements of stereotyping and erroneous belief in accuracy of suspicious behavior detection.
Obviously being shot is infinitely worse, more heinous an act, but that was a split second decision that was led up to by his persistent flawed thinking.
If Zimmerman did not have a gun and instead the two had exchanged words or a fistfight, the nation likely would have never even about the case. If he became a TSA screener, I would bet he would be the type to yell at a well dressed cardiac surgeon while roughly brushing his crotch in a semi-retaliatory grope-down, as has recently happened to me (to bring the thread back on track.)
Zimmerman was an over-zealous cop-wannabe, not qualified (some reports say rejected) for the actual police force, wanting to "do good" in his mind, but in fact did very, very, very bad. The similarities are quite clear, including elements of stereotyping and erroneous belief in accuracy of suspicious behavior detection.
Obviously being shot is infinitely worse, more heinous an act, but that was a split second decision that was led up to by his persistent flawed thinking.
If Zimmerman did not have a gun and instead the two had exchanged words or a fistfight, the nation likely would have never even about the case. If he became a TSA screener, I would bet he would be the type to yell at a well dressed cardiac surgeon while roughly brushing his crotch in a semi-retaliatory grope-down, as has recently happened to me (to bring the thread back on track.)
Mar 29, 2012, 3:47 pm
#2436
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: UA
Posts: 48
Agreed. I recently had an opt out pat down at PDX that involved a pretty hard "resistance" check. So hard that it would qualify as more of a hit - I jumped a little when hand met resistance.
Mar 29, 2012, 4:44 pm
#2437
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Denver CO
Programs: HHonors Gold, National Emerald Club, no airline affinity status
Posts: 3,352
Did they happen to call it doing "the business"? That's what I got when I went through PDX earlier this month. Luckily "the business" didn't make me jump.
Mar 30, 2012, 9:28 am
#2438
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: UA
Posts: 48
This is not an opt out story but a more of a request that will lead to an opt out story.
If an individual was wearing a kilt how could the TSA do the resistance check without exposing the persons "business" area?
Would the TSA request to pat you down in private?
Either way I think this situation would provide a good opt out story. Thoughts?
If an individual was wearing a kilt how could the TSA do the resistance check without exposing the persons "business" area?
Would the TSA request to pat you down in private?
Either way I think this situation would provide a good opt out story. Thoughts?
Mar 30, 2012, 9:56 am
#2439
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 172
Here's a link to the story of one kilt-wearer's rendezvous with destiny...
http://subliminalpanda.blogspot.com/...ince-2010.html
http://subliminalpanda.blogspot.com/...ince-2010.html
Mar 30, 2012, 10:11 am
#2440
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: UA
Posts: 48
Here's a link to the story of one kilt-wearer's rendezvous with destiny...
http://subliminalpanda.blogspot.com/...ince-2010.html
http://subliminalpanda.blogspot.com/...ince-2010.html
If that happened to me I would call the police! Why is it ok for the TSA to do this?? Anyone else would get arrested!
Mar 31, 2012, 3:55 pm
#2441
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Programs: Airline nobody. Sad!
Posts: 26,062
My luck finally ran out at BOS Terminal B AA checkpoint this morning. NOS CLEARLY being used as a primary. Gatekeeper waved me to walk into the BKSX and I quickly replied "I opt out sir". No flames please 
. I always wait until the last possible second, in case i get waved to the WTMD. No reason to say anything any sooner IMO. Really made a mess out of the entry to the NOS. First time I have had to opt out. Immediate call for male assist on radio, no yelling or anything. No male assist showed up, so the male gatekeeper switched places with another TSO and did it himself. Started within about two minutes of my opt out. Very professional, informed me every step what he would do. Resistance check was not overly hard in my judgment. Noticeable but not painful in any way. Did not take long, didn't sense I was being retaliated against at all or anything.
. I always wait until the last possible second, in case i get waved to the WTMD. No reason to say anything any sooner IMO. Really made a mess out of the entry to the NOS. First time I have had to opt out. Immediate call for male assist on radio, no yelling or anything. No male assist showed up, so the male gatekeeper switched places with another TSO and did it himself. Started within about two minutes of my opt out. Very professional, informed me every step what he would do. Resistance check was not overly hard in my judgment. Noticeable but not painful in any way. Did not take long, didn't sense I was being retaliated against at all or anything.
Last edited by TheBOSman; Apr 1, 2012 at 8:44 am
Apr 1, 2012, 12:59 pm
#2442
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: BWI
Programs: AA Gold, HH Diamond, National Emerald Executive, TSA Disparager Gold
Posts: 15,180
BWI on Thurs 3/29 was a typical SDOO. They usually have at least one NoS free line open.
SLC T1 today, 4/1. NoS being used for primary as far as I can see, though some people are being directed to the WTMD. It's not looking good, so I throw my stuff down and try my luck. NoS. I opt out ... no crap given ... yet.
However, I go back to the conveyor to get my stuff as they told me to do that last time. Screener doesn't like it and he calls for a supervisor. 3 striper lady comes over and I told her why I did it - they wouldn't let me watch my stuff in the past and they told me not to send thru until they're ready with an opt out. I had names of employees who told me that ready if challenged further. She said I was correct - the screener thought I just didn't want to send my stuff thru the x-ray. Assist comes over, they tell me they're ready and I send my stuff thru.
Got the same patdown guy I got last time. As I go thru the WTMD, another screener told me I was right and that they would have a talk with him. He picked up my belongings and brought them to the patdown area. I asked him to change his gloves - no problem. He asked me if I knew the drill and said I must travel a lot. I said that I did, and he went on with it. Done in about 2 minutes. Very thorough. He always give a great massage.
Glad it didn't get ugly.
SLC T1 today, 4/1. NoS being used for primary as far as I can see, though some people are being directed to the WTMD. It's not looking good, so I throw my stuff down and try my luck. NoS. I opt out ... no crap given ... yet.
However, I go back to the conveyor to get my stuff as they told me to do that last time. Screener doesn't like it and he calls for a supervisor. 3 striper lady comes over and I told her why I did it - they wouldn't let me watch my stuff in the past and they told me not to send thru until they're ready with an opt out. I had names of employees who told me that ready if challenged further. She said I was correct - the screener thought I just didn't want to send my stuff thru the x-ray. Assist comes over, they tell me they're ready and I send my stuff thru.
Got the same patdown guy I got last time. As I go thru the WTMD, another screener told me I was right and that they would have a talk with him. He picked up my belongings and brought them to the patdown area. I asked him to change his gloves - no problem. He asked me if I knew the drill and said I must travel a lot. I said that I did, and he went on with it. Done in about 2 minutes. Very thorough. He always give a great massage.
Glad it didn't get ugly.
Apr 1, 2012, 8:12 pm
#2443
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Raleigh
Programs: DL Diamond, UA Premier
Posts: 58
My luck finally ran out at BOS Terminal B AA checkpoint this morning. NOS CLEARLY being used as a primary. Gatekeeper waved me to walk into the BKSX and I quickly replied "I opt out sir". No flames please . I always wait until the last possible second, in case i get waved to the WTMD. No reason to say anything any sooner IMO. Really made a mess out of the entry to the NOS. First time I have had to opt out. Immediate call for male assist on radio, no yelling or anything. No male assist showed up, so the male gatekeeper switched places with another TSO and did it himself. Started within about two minutes of my opt out. Very professional, informed me every step what he would do. Resistance check was not overly hard in my judgment. Noticeable but not painful in any way. Did not take long, didn't sense I was being retaliated against at all or anything.
. I always wait until the last possible second, in case i get waved to the WTMD. No reason to say anything any sooner IMO. Really made a mess out of the entry to the NOS. First time I have had to opt out. Immediate call for male assist on radio, no yelling or anything. No male assist showed up, so the male gatekeeper switched places with another TSO and did it himself. Started within about two minutes of my opt out. Very professional, informed me every step what he would do. Resistance check was not overly hard in my judgment. Noticeable but not painful in any way. Did not take long, didn't sense I was being retaliated against at all or anything.You know, that's a great idea for a protest!
For us opt-outers--if you're ever stuck at the airport for a few hours:
Keep going 'round and 'round! Leave the secure area, and go back in, each time saying "I OPT OUT" and getting the TSA happy ending! If I'm traveling with someone who could watch my belongings on the inside (because each time through you run the risk of the TSA stealing your iPad in his secret pocket), and I'm bored, this would be a great activity.
For us opt-outers--if you're ever stuck at the airport for a few hours:
Keep going 'round and 'round! Leave the secure area, and go back in, each time saying "I OPT OUT" and getting the TSA happy ending! If I'm traveling with someone who could watch my belongings on the inside (because each time through you run the risk of the TSA stealing your iPad in his secret pocket), and I'm bored, this would be a great activity.
As you can see from my screen name, I am not a frequent poster - so I apologize up front if I don't know all of the acronyms or abbreviations....
My family flies frequently from KC (MCI) to Ft Myers (RSW). We've been doing this every other month for the last two years, so I have the dreaded security song-and-dance down to a science. Or so I thought.
MCI has one AIT machine, and several WTMD's. I have instructed my family to always keep to the right while going through the lines, which always has us going through the WTMD's, as the solo AIT is to the left. Very easy to avoid.
RSW has ONLY had WTMD's - which has made it very nice flying back to KC. We were just there in December, so imagine my shock yesterday while standing in the line to get our squiggle on our BP when I saw that they have installed TWO AIT machines. Yikes. They have both these machines situated right next to their WTMD, so a traveler is left strictly up to the mercy of the TSO lady who directs you through either of the lines.
My 12-year old daughter went first, and she was pointed through the WTMD. I followed her, and was also directed to the left, the WTMD. Whew. Two down, two to go.
My 19-year old son got sent to the AIT. He immediately said, "I opt out." The TSO lady said, "WHAT??!!" very loudly. My son repeated, "I opt out." She immediately screams, at 120 decibels, "Male assist!" and then shakes her head at my son. Like she's chastising him!!!!
My son said, "What?? Why are you shaking your head at me like that?" And she said, "It's just like making a call on your cell phone."
Anyway, the male assist came and took my son to the footprints on the floor, where he did an EXTREMELY thorough pat-down. In fact, my Hubby, who was following my son, was also directed through the AIT, opted out, and received a pat down by a different TSO, and was finished BEFORE my son's pat down.
Both of these TSO's ALSO said, "It's no different than making a call on your cell phone." Argh. You can tell they've been coached to say that - as it was now the THIRD time in five minutes we'd been told that.
We've never had to opt out before - but we all learned some things. We forgot to have the TSO's put on new gloves before the pat down. We'll remember that next time. I also noticed that the TSO who was patting down my son had my son positioned so that his back was to the conveyor belt, thereby leaving all of my son's belongings out of his sight. Luckily, I was standing there, guarding his stuff, but I educated my son later and told him to ALWAYS keep his stuff within sight.
My hubby's TSO positioned him so that he was facing his stuff - in fact, he asked my Hubby prior to the pat-down, "Where's your stuff?" and when Hubby pointed, the TSO said, "You need to face it."
Just wanted to share - and to say how much I appreciate everyone's information here...long time lurker, just not a frequent poster.
My family flies frequently from KC (MCI) to Ft Myers (RSW). We've been doing this every other month for the last two years, so I have the dreaded security song-and-dance down to a science. Or so I thought.
MCI has one AIT machine, and several WTMD's. I have instructed my family to always keep to the right while going through the lines, which always has us going through the WTMD's, as the solo AIT is to the left. Very easy to avoid.
RSW has ONLY had WTMD's - which has made it very nice flying back to KC. We were just there in December, so imagine my shock yesterday while standing in the line to get our squiggle on our BP when I saw that they have installed TWO AIT machines. Yikes. They have both these machines situated right next to their WTMD, so a traveler is left strictly up to the mercy of the TSO lady who directs you through either of the lines.
My 12-year old daughter went first, and she was pointed through the WTMD. I followed her, and was also directed to the left, the WTMD. Whew. Two down, two to go.
My 19-year old son got sent to the AIT. He immediately said, "I opt out." The TSO lady said, "WHAT??!!" very loudly. My son repeated, "I opt out." She immediately screams, at 120 decibels, "Male assist!" and then shakes her head at my son. Like she's chastising him!!!!
My son said, "What?? Why are you shaking your head at me like that?" And she said, "It's just like making a call on your cell phone."
Anyway, the male assist came and took my son to the footprints on the floor, where he did an EXTREMELY thorough pat-down. In fact, my Hubby, who was following my son, was also directed through the AIT, opted out, and received a pat down by a different TSO, and was finished BEFORE my son's pat down.
Both of these TSO's ALSO said, "It's no different than making a call on your cell phone." Argh. You can tell they've been coached to say that - as it was now the THIRD time in five minutes we'd been told that.
We've never had to opt out before - but we all learned some things. We forgot to have the TSO's put on new gloves before the pat down. We'll remember that next time. I also noticed that the TSO who was patting down my son had my son positioned so that his back was to the conveyor belt, thereby leaving all of my son's belongings out of his sight. Luckily, I was standing there, guarding his stuff, but I educated my son later and told him to ALWAYS keep his stuff within sight.
My hubby's TSO positioned him so that he was facing his stuff - in fact, he asked my Hubby prior to the pat-down, "Where's your stuff?" and when Hubby pointed, the TSO said, "You need to face it."
Just wanted to share - and to say how much I appreciate everyone's information here...long time lurker, just not a frequent poster.
A mild hassle at SJC today (3/21) opting out of the Cancer-Scope.
I said, very politely, that I want to be hand searched, and I want to be able to see my belongings at all time. The TSO at the scanner said "I can't do that."
I asked that he call over his supervisor and a LEO. He got the supervisor, but no LEO.
The TSA's OWN WEBSITE says "Always Watch your Belongings" and "Insist Your Belongings be Brought With You" for secondary screening. I was merely trying to be a Good Citizen and follow the instructions on their own website.
The Supervisor complied with my request. I filled out a complaint card against the original TSO who said he couldn't permit me to follow the instructions on the TSA website.
I was not asked if why, thankfully.
And, yes, the TSO touched my penis.
I said, very politely, that I want to be hand searched, and I want to be able to see my belongings at all time. The TSO at the scanner said "I can't do that."
I asked that he call over his supervisor and a LEO. He got the supervisor, but no LEO.
The TSA's OWN WEBSITE says "Always Watch your Belongings" and "Insist Your Belongings be Brought With You" for secondary screening. I was merely trying to be a Good Citizen and follow the instructions on their own website.
The Supervisor complied with my request. I filled out a complaint card against the original TSO who said he couldn't permit me to follow the instructions on the TSA website.
I was not asked if why, thankfully.
And, yes, the TSO touched my penis.
Last edited by scoow; Apr 2, 2012 at 5:46 am Reason: multiple consecutive posts
Apr 1, 2012, 10:04 pm
#2444
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: ONT
Programs: AA Gold, WN A-, UA S, HH ♦, IHG Spire, Hertz Prez O, TSA Disparager
Posts: 2,159
I said, very politely, that I want to be hand searched, and I want to be able to see my belongings at all time. The TSO at the scanner said "I can't do that."
I asked that he call over his supervisor and a LEO. He got the supervisor, but no LEO.
The TSA's OWN WEBSITE says "Always Watch your Belongings" and "Insist Your Belongings be Brought With You" for secondary screening. I was merely trying to be a Good Citizen and follow the instructions on their own website.
The Supervisor complied with my request. I filled out a complaint card against the original TSO who said he couldn't permit me to follow the instructions on the TSA website.
I asked that he call over his supervisor and a LEO. He got the supervisor, but no LEO.
The TSA's OWN WEBSITE says "Always Watch your Belongings" and "Insist Your Belongings be Brought With You" for secondary screening. I was merely trying to be a Good Citizen and follow the instructions on their own website.
The Supervisor complied with my request. I filled out a complaint card against the original TSO who said he couldn't permit me to follow the instructions on the TSA website.
Apr 2, 2012, 12:10 am
#2445
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 240
You know, that's a great idea for a protest!
For us opt-outers--if you're ever stuck at the airport for a few hours:
Keep going 'round and 'round! Leave the secure area, and go back in, each time saying "I OPT OUT" and getting the TSA happy ending! If I'm traveling with someone who could watch my belongings on the inside (because each time through you run the risk of the TSA stealing your iPad in his secret pocket), and I'm bored, this would be a great activity.
For us opt-outers--if you're ever stuck at the airport for a few hours:
Keep going 'round and 'round! Leave the secure area, and go back in, each time saying "I OPT OUT" and getting the TSA happy ending! If I'm traveling with someone who could watch my belongings on the inside (because each time through you run the risk of the TSA stealing your iPad in his secret pocket), and I'm bored, this would be a great activity.