Feb 12, 2016, 8:56 am
Last edit by: beltway
This is the general 2016-2019 thread for weighing the relative merits
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.
What's the main reason people product change (PC)?
The benefits offered by a particular card, might suit you better than the card you are holding. Many people, unable to qualify for a new Chase Sapphire Reserve application, upgraded from the Sapphire Preferred to the Sapphire Reserve, because the benefits of the CSR's cash reimbursements made the annual fee a nominal difference the first year. And vice versa- the onerous $450 yearly fee of the CSR makes an appealing case to downgrade to the Sapphire Preferred, and eventually to the no-fee Sapphire or a Freedom card.
Many people product change to avoid the annual fees on the premium versions of the card. Keeping the card open, via a product change, keeps the account open. This allows you to retain the seasoned account, and the banking relationship that the older card has established with Chase.
Why not just cancel the card and be done with it?
This may be the right choice for you, but others want some of the card benefits without having to reapply. Also, Chase has become very restrictive for new card applicants. For Chase cards, you must wait 24- 48 months since the last time you received a bonus before reapplying. Please see the threads on the individual cards for updated overlay rules.
An additional (and more stringent) overlay is the infamous 5/24 rule, which Chase instituted in May 2016 as a counter-measure against churning, or, as they refer to it, "Serial Starters." The 5/24 rule is that you won't be eligible for most Chase card products if you've opened more than 5 credit cards in 24 months. For more on this and other application-related issues, see the current "Applying for Chase Credit Cards " Master thread.
Finally, canceling certain cards--those earning Chase Ultimate Rewards--may deprive you of the ability to exchange UR for miles/points in air & hotel programs. See Ultimate Rewards transfer partners, times & rules.
Is there any way I can keep a card without paying the annual fee?
See Chase Retention Bonuses: June 2015-Present
Are there any restrictions on product changes?
Product changes are only allowed within the same card "family," and are not permitted between business and personal cards. Also, Chase cites the federal CARD Act to deny product changes on any account less that one year old.
Will a product change count as a new card?
No, you will keep your same card number, "opened on" date, credit line, automatic payment arrangements, etc. A product change does not count against Chase's 5/24 limitations on new cards.
Will I get a signup bonus when I change?
No, product changes do not result in point bonuses. Signup bonuses are reserved for new applicants only. For the complete list of public sign up offers, check the Chase sitemap here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap
Is there a place I can look to compare cards?
Go here: https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...D=177087865887
Click: All cards
Place a checkmark in the Compare box for up to three cards.
Click: Compare cards...and you should see a side-by-side display.
I've figured out what I want to switch to. How do I product change my card?
Call the number on the back of your card.
Product changes for the Ultimate Reward Business and Personal Card Family
The UR family of cards includes the Chase Ink business cards, the Freedom Unlimited, the Freedom Card, and the Chase Sapphire Preferred, Reserve and Sapphire.
The Slate (personal) card is also available to downgrade to. It has no annual fee and does not earn any type of reward points. It offers a low fee (currently 0% for the first 60 days) balance transfers and APR.
Personal Cards
- Freedom: 5X points in rotating quarterly categories up to $1500 spend per quarter. If you max out the $1500 every quarter, it totals 7500 UR per quarter, or 30,000 UR per year.
- Freedom Unlimited: 1.5X for all spending, no bonus categories. $20,000 in spend would net 30,000 UR per year.
- Sapphire Reserve: $450 annual fee, $300 annual travel credit, 3X points for travel and dining. Books travel through the UR portal for 1.5 per dollar. Lounge access and other goodies. See the thread here for details.
- Sapphire Preferred: $95 annual fee, 2X points for travel & dining
- For discussion specific to the Sapphire Preferred Card, see Chase Sapphire Preferred - Keep, Downgrade, or Cancel?
- Sapphire: Not available to new applicants. Available as a product downgrade/change only, must tier down from the Sapphire Reserve to Sapphire Preferred to Sapphire or Freedom cards. No annual fee. Some Customer Service Reps are citing that the original product (i.e., the CSR), must be held for one year before downgrading. Please provide data points in the thread if this happens to you.
Business Cards
- Ink Plus: $95 annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and hotels
- Ink Preferred: 3x on travel, shipping, internet/phone/cable, & some online advertising.
- Ink Cash: No annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and restaurants
If you still have a legacy Ink Classic or Ink Bold business card, neither of which is available for new signups, you can product change to one of the other Ink cards.
Considerations for downgrading/upgrading:
Can I combine my UR points?
Yes, UR can be combined freely across the cardholder's own personal and business accounts.
What about transfering my UR to another person's Chase UR account? To their air/hotel partner account?
With restrictions, UR from a personal card can be transferred to a person living at the same address. Business cards allow transfer to owners of the company listed as authorized users.
However, be warned that there are transfer restrictions. Unauthorized transfers have resulted in shut-downs. Review the Chase T&C for details before planning a transfer. For discussion, see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...-accounts.html.
The Freedom cards, no-fee Ink Cash, and no-fee Sapphire cards do not allow UR transfer to airline/hotel partners. If you are downgrading from a premium UR card and will only have no-fee cards left, it may be prudent to transfer your points to the partner of your choice beforehand.
I know I can use UR to pay for travel directly (as opposed to transfering points into a travel partner program). Do the Chase UR cards differ on this?
Only the Sapphire Reserve books travel on the UR portal for 1.5. So you can stack your card bonus opportunities when your UR points are combined into your CSR account and used for booking travel. If, for instance, you earned 5x on your Ink Plus on your phone bill, and combine those 5x Ink earned points into your CSR's UR account, you'll now get an additional .5 in value when you redeem them on the travel portal.
Product Changes for United Airlines Cards
There are options to downgrade or upgrade UA cards.
- United Mileage Plus Card- no annual fee, 1 UA mile per $2 in spend
- United Mileage Plus Explorer Card- $95 annual fee, 1 mile per dollar earning, additional award inventory on UA, free checked bag, 25% bonus on the shopping portal.
- United Plus Club Card- $450 annual fee, 1.5 miles per $1, many additional premium card benefits
- Business Cards for the Mileage Plus and Club Card give you a choice to upgrade or downgrade between those two.
Southwest Airlines Cards
The difference here is a nominal $30/3000 points per year.
Personal cards
- Plus Card- $69 annual fee, 3000 bonus points upon renewal
- Premiere Card- $99 annual fee, 6000 bonus points upon renewal
Chase Product Change/Card Conversion: Downgrade, Upgrade, Keep or Cancel? (2016-2019)
Aug 31, 2016, 4:08 pm
#228
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 13
Random question: If you product change (from CSP to Freedom Unlimited, for example) do you keep the same credit card number? That would make things much easier for items already set up for auto-pay. Thanks in advance.
Aug 31, 2016, 5:11 pm
#229
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: Hilton Plastic, Delta Silver Emeritus
Posts: 1,037
Alas, the expiration date changes even when you can keep the number.
Aug 31, 2016, 9:20 pm
#230
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: PHX, ORD, MDW
Programs: WN A-List, Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold, National Executive Elite
Posts: 292
Sep 1, 2016, 11:13 am
#231
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 622
Just approved for CSR. Some of the CL from the CSP was moved over to it.
Now, trying to determine if I should downgrade my CSP to a Freedom card, or just cancel it all together and move the remaining CL over to the CSR. The CSP was opened in April 2014.
Now, trying to determine if I should downgrade my CSP to a Freedom card, or just cancel it all together and move the remaining CL over to the CSR. The CSP was opened in April 2014.
Sep 2, 2016, 10:06 am
#232
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 11
Currently have these Chase cards:
Southwest Premier
Slate
Freedom
CSP
CSR (just approved today)
Thinking about product changing the CSP to Freedom Unlimited and the Southwest to another Freedom. Thoughts?
Annual fee just hit today for the Southwest and the CSP will be hitting soon as well. If I product change these soon I can probably have the fees refunded. That makes my only annual fee card the CSR. I can't think of a good reason to keep the Southwest card around with either the CSP or CSR in the wallet (I got the Southwest card before the others, else I probably wouldn't have bothered).
I can definitely make use of the Freedom Unlimited to fill in the gaps. For the regular Freedom, the only quarter where I'll be able to exceed the $1,500 limit is the Amazon quarter, but that's still better than nothing and it has no annual fee.
Any reason to keep the Southwest card? I normally fly with them in the country, but I normally buy tickets with points so the extra bonus points of buying tickets with the Southwest card doesn't really apply to me.
Southwest Premier
Slate
Freedom
CSP
CSR (just approved today)
Thinking about product changing the CSP to Freedom Unlimited and the Southwest to another Freedom. Thoughts?
Annual fee just hit today for the Southwest and the CSP will be hitting soon as well. If I product change these soon I can probably have the fees refunded. That makes my only annual fee card the CSR. I can't think of a good reason to keep the Southwest card around with either the CSP or CSR in the wallet (I got the Southwest card before the others, else I probably wouldn't have bothered).
I can definitely make use of the Freedom Unlimited to fill in the gaps. For the regular Freedom, the only quarter where I'll be able to exceed the $1,500 limit is the Amazon quarter, but that's still better than nothing and it has no annual fee.
Any reason to keep the Southwest card? I normally fly with them in the country, but I normally buy tickets with points so the extra bonus points of buying tickets with the Southwest card doesn't really apply to me.
Sep 2, 2016, 10:53 am
#233
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: Hilton Plastic, Delta Silver Emeritus
Posts: 1,037
Currently have these Chase cards:
Southwest Premier
Slate
Freedom
CSP
CSR (just approved today)
Thinking about product changing the CSP to Freedom Unlimited and the Southwest to another Freedom. Thoughts?
Annual fee just hit today for the Southwest and the CSP will be hitting soon as well. If I product change these soon I can probably have the fees refunded. That makes my only annual fee card the CSR. I can't think of a good reason to keep the Southwest card around with either the CSP or CSR in the wallet (I got the Southwest card before the others, else I probably wouldn't have bothered).
I can definitely make use of the Freedom Unlimited to fill in the gaps. For the regular Freedom, the only quarter where I'll be able to exceed the $1,500 limit is the Amazon quarter, but that's still better than nothing and it has no annual fee.
Any reason to keep the Southwest card? I normally fly with them in the country, but I normally buy tickets with points so the extra bonus points of buying tickets with the Southwest card doesn't really apply to me.
Southwest Premier
Slate
Freedom
CSP
CSR (just approved today)
Thinking about product changing the CSP to Freedom Unlimited and the Southwest to another Freedom. Thoughts?
Annual fee just hit today for the Southwest and the CSP will be hitting soon as well. If I product change these soon I can probably have the fees refunded. That makes my only annual fee card the CSR. I can't think of a good reason to keep the Southwest card around with either the CSP or CSR in the wallet (I got the Southwest card before the others, else I probably wouldn't have bothered).
I can definitely make use of the Freedom Unlimited to fill in the gaps. For the regular Freedom, the only quarter where I'll be able to exceed the $1,500 limit is the Amazon quarter, but that's still better than nothing and it has no annual fee.
Any reason to keep the Southwest card? I normally fly with them in the country, but I normally buy tickets with points so the extra bonus points of buying tickets with the Southwest card doesn't really apply to me.
Affinity cards ---> similar affinity cards
The SW cannot become a Freedom. It could become a lower fee SW card.
Sep 2, 2016, 12:28 pm
#235
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 398
Can you "churn" product changes? A little further explanation, and more specific in regards to the CSR:
I'm passed 5/24, so can't get the sign up bonus, but see the value in the card and my CSP fee is upcoming. Could I product change up to the CSR, hold it for a year to clear the 5/24, downgrade back to CSP or Freedom, and then apply for the CSR and still get a sign up bonus ( whatever it is then )?
Is there any limit to how much you can product change up or down the "same" card?
Just looking for options here. This would give me the opportunity to cancel my Prestige and Premiere, as well, and still pick up a sign up bonus down the line, if possible.
I'm passed 5/24, so can't get the sign up bonus, but see the value in the card and my CSP fee is upcoming. Could I product change up to the CSR, hold it for a year to clear the 5/24, downgrade back to CSP or Freedom, and then apply for the CSR and still get a sign up bonus ( whatever it is then )?
Is there any limit to how much you can product change up or down the "same" card?
Just looking for options here. This would give me the opportunity to cancel my Prestige and Premiere, as well, and still pick up a sign up bonus down the line, if possible.
Sep 2, 2016, 11:15 pm
#236
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: On strike
Posts: 8,135
Well, Chase did convert all the old Amtrak cards to Freedom when that affinity program moved over to BofA. Perhaps that crossover from affinity to UR is possible only with involuntary conversions.
Sep 3, 2016, 3:07 am
#237
Join Date: Jun 2009
Programs: GE
Posts: 247
I asked this in the main thread but I guess it got lost. I PC'd my Slate to the CSR but I had a 0% balance transfer offer active. I paid off the balance in full but I am wondering when my interest-free grace period on purchases comes back so I can start using the CSR? My next statement closes in a few days with a $0 balance.
Sep 3, 2016, 4:04 am
#238
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 468
But can one normally keep the number? The phrase "even when" sounds like one cannot rely on keeping the number when PCing.
I ask as I had planned to request a PC from CSP that I have had several years to Freedom this weekend, but I need to cancel 2 BA award tickets that had been charged to CSP. Fees typically refund to card, which I hope would still be ok if number remains same.
(As an aside, complicating matters, BA site is generating errors when I try to cancel right now. Not sure how long before that situation is corrected.)
Thanks!
I ask as I had planned to request a PC from CSP that I have had several years to Freedom this weekend, but I need to cancel 2 BA award tickets that had been charged to CSP. Fees typically refund to card, which I hope would still be ok if number remains same.
(As an aside, complicating matters, BA site is generating errors when I try to cancel right now. Not sure how long before that situation is corrected.)
Thanks!
Sep 3, 2016, 8:35 am
#239
Moderator: Travel Buzz
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Sunny San Diego
Posts: 3,099
I asked this in the main thread but I guess it got lost. I PC'd my Slate to the CSR but I had a 0% balance transfer offer active. I paid off the balance in full but I am wondering when my interest-free grace period on purchases comes back so I can start using the CSR? My next statement closes in a few days with a $0 balance.
If you're asking whether or not the 0% balance transfer offer has moved from your Slate card to the new CSR card, I would think it wouldn't. That particular Slate offer is a moot point for you, because you've paid it to zero.
I've never seen a data point on this question, though. I would imagine that anybody doing a product change that includes a balance transfer offer with an outstanding balance, should double or triple check (because of the margin of error with Customer service information) to make sure that offer migrates, along with the balance, to the new product.
Many FTers don't carry a balance on their cards, ever, because the fees/interest charged offset the benefits of the points or rewards. Minimal fee balance transfer offers or checks drawn on the credit card accounts do have a place in financial arbitrage. I've used them myself occasionally.
Sep 3, 2016, 3:17 pm
#240
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 7
Need advice: CSR, Ink+, Southwest...
I currently have the Ink Plus card, and next month my $95 fee will hit when I hit 2 years with the card. I don't have any other cards (since my wife got the 2 southwest cards in late 2014 to get the companion pass). I had the SPG Amex but I opened it in 6/2014 and closed it in 6/2015. Chase will know I have the Ink Plus, but no other cards opened within 2 years show on my TransUnion report. Not sure about the other 2 reports.
The looming $95 fee and launch of the CSR with the 100k points is making me wonder if I should pick up the CSR and cancel the Ink Plus. I want to keep my 100k UR points obviously, and picking up another 100k would be killer. We spend more than 300/yr on travel, so that would make my fee essentially $195, which is still a lot. But generally, would that transition be seamless?
Also, I plan to get both personal Southwest cards in a couple of months if I can to go for a companion pass earned as early in 2017 as possible. Obviously these are both Chase cards. I would probably cancel the plus card as soon as I was allowed to after earning the bonus. I know closing accounts isn't the greatest on my credit though, but the fees really add up.
Any advice or warnings on these thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
The looming $95 fee and launch of the CSR with the 100k points is making me wonder if I should pick up the CSR and cancel the Ink Plus. I want to keep my 100k UR points obviously, and picking up another 100k would be killer. We spend more than 300/yr on travel, so that would make my fee essentially $195, which is still a lot. But generally, would that transition be seamless?
Also, I plan to get both personal Southwest cards in a couple of months if I can to go for a companion pass earned as early in 2017 as possible. Obviously these are both Chase cards. I would probably cancel the plus card as soon as I was allowed to after earning the bonus. I know closing accounts isn't the greatest on my credit though, but the fees really add up.
Any advice or warnings on these thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!