Feb 12, 2016, 8:56 am
Last edit by: beltway
This is the general 2016-2019 thread for weighing the relative merits
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.
What's the main reason people product change (PC)?
The benefits offered by a particular card, might suit you better than the card you are holding. Many people, unable to qualify for a new Chase Sapphire Reserve application, upgraded from the Sapphire Preferred to the Sapphire Reserve, because the benefits of the CSR's cash reimbursements made the annual fee a nominal difference the first year. And vice versa- the onerous $450 yearly fee of the CSR makes an appealing case to downgrade to the Sapphire Preferred, and eventually to the no-fee Sapphire or a Freedom card.
Many people product change to avoid the annual fees on the premium versions of the card. Keeping the card open, via a product change, keeps the account open. This allows you to retain the seasoned account, and the banking relationship that the older card has established with Chase.
Why not just cancel the card and be done with it?
This may be the right choice for you, but others want some of the card benefits without having to reapply. Also, Chase has become very restrictive for new card applicants. For Chase cards, you must wait 24- 48 months since the last time you received a bonus before reapplying. Please see the threads on the individual cards for updated overlay rules.
An additional (and more stringent) overlay is the infamous 5/24 rule, which Chase instituted in May 2016 as a counter-measure against churning, or, as they refer to it, "Serial Starters." The 5/24 rule is that you won't be eligible for most Chase card products if you've opened more than 5 credit cards in 24 months. For more on this and other application-related issues, see the current "Applying for Chase Credit Cards " Master thread.
Finally, canceling certain cards--those earning Chase Ultimate Rewards--may deprive you of the ability to exchange UR for miles/points in air & hotel programs. See Ultimate Rewards transfer partners, times & rules.
Is there any way I can keep a card without paying the annual fee?
See Chase Retention Bonuses: June 2015-Present
Are there any restrictions on product changes?
Product changes are only allowed within the same card "family," and are not permitted between business and personal cards. Also, Chase cites the federal CARD Act to deny product changes on any account less that one year old.
Will a product change count as a new card?
No, you will keep your same card number, "opened on" date, credit line, automatic payment arrangements, etc. A product change does not count against Chase's 5/24 limitations on new cards.
Will I get a signup bonus when I change?
No, product changes do not result in point bonuses. Signup bonuses are reserved for new applicants only. For the complete list of public sign up offers, check the Chase sitemap here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap
Is there a place I can look to compare cards?
Go here: https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...D=177087865887
Click: All cards
Place a checkmark in the Compare box for up to three cards.
Click: Compare cards...and you should see a side-by-side display.
I've figured out what I want to switch to. How do I product change my card?
Call the number on the back of your card.
Product changes for the Ultimate Reward Business and Personal Card Family
The UR family of cards includes the Chase Ink business cards, the Freedom Unlimited, the Freedom Card, and the Chase Sapphire Preferred, Reserve and Sapphire.
The Slate (personal) card is also available to downgrade to. It has no annual fee and does not earn any type of reward points. It offers a low fee (currently 0% for the first 60 days) balance transfers and APR.
Personal Cards
- Freedom: 5X points in rotating quarterly categories up to $1500 spend per quarter. If you max out the $1500 every quarter, it totals 7500 UR per quarter, or 30,000 UR per year.
- Freedom Unlimited: 1.5X for all spending, no bonus categories. $20,000 in spend would net 30,000 UR per year.
- Sapphire Reserve: $450 annual fee, $300 annual travel credit, 3X points for travel and dining. Books travel through the UR portal for 1.5 per dollar. Lounge access and other goodies. See the thread here for details.
- Sapphire Preferred: $95 annual fee, 2X points for travel & dining
- For discussion specific to the Sapphire Preferred Card, see Chase Sapphire Preferred - Keep, Downgrade, or Cancel?
- Sapphire: Not available to new applicants. Available as a product downgrade/change only, must tier down from the Sapphire Reserve to Sapphire Preferred to Sapphire or Freedom cards. No annual fee. Some Customer Service Reps are citing that the original product (i.e., the CSR), must be held for one year before downgrading. Please provide data points in the thread if this happens to you.
Business Cards
- Ink Plus: $95 annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and hotels
- Ink Preferred: 3x on travel, shipping, internet/phone/cable, & some online advertising.
- Ink Cash: No annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and restaurants
If you still have a legacy Ink Classic or Ink Bold business card, neither of which is available for new signups, you can product change to one of the other Ink cards.
Considerations for downgrading/upgrading:
Can I combine my UR points?
Yes, UR can be combined freely across the cardholder's own personal and business accounts.
What about transfering my UR to another person's Chase UR account? To their air/hotel partner account?
With restrictions, UR from a personal card can be transferred to a person living at the same address. Business cards allow transfer to owners of the company listed as authorized users.
However, be warned that there are transfer restrictions. Unauthorized transfers have resulted in shut-downs. Review the Chase T&C for details before planning a transfer. For discussion, see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...-accounts.html.
The Freedom cards, no-fee Ink Cash, and no-fee Sapphire cards do not allow UR transfer to airline/hotel partners. If you are downgrading from a premium UR card and will only have no-fee cards left, it may be prudent to transfer your points to the partner of your choice beforehand.
I know I can use UR to pay for travel directly (as opposed to transfering points into a travel partner program). Do the Chase UR cards differ on this?
Only the Sapphire Reserve books travel on the UR portal for 1.5. So you can stack your card bonus opportunities when your UR points are combined into your CSR account and used for booking travel. If, for instance, you earned 5x on your Ink Plus on your phone bill, and combine those 5x Ink earned points into your CSR's UR account, you'll now get an additional .5 in value when you redeem them on the travel portal.
Product Changes for United Airlines Cards
There are options to downgrade or upgrade UA cards.
- United Mileage Plus Card- no annual fee, 1 UA mile per $2 in spend
- United Mileage Plus Explorer Card- $95 annual fee, 1 mile per dollar earning, additional award inventory on UA, free checked bag, 25% bonus on the shopping portal.
- United Plus Club Card- $450 annual fee, 1.5 miles per $1, many additional premium card benefits
- Business Cards for the Mileage Plus and Club Card give you a choice to upgrade or downgrade between those two.
Southwest Airlines Cards
The difference here is a nominal $30/3000 points per year.
Personal cards
- Plus Card- $69 annual fee, 3000 bonus points upon renewal
- Premiere Card- $99 annual fee, 6000 bonus points upon renewal
Chase Product Change/Card Conversion: Downgrade, Upgrade, Keep or Cancel? (2016-2019)
Jan 5, 2017, 12:47 pm
#376
Join Date: May 2004
Programs: AA EXP, UA MM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 101
Thank you for all of the valuable information in this thread. FYI, had CSP for a little over a year with AF posted 11/1, approved for CSR two days ago, transferred UR points from CSP to CSR using combine feature, called Chase, downgraded CSP to FU and received full refund of AF from CSP.
Jan 7, 2017, 9:32 am
#377
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: Amex Platinum, Chase Sapphire Reserve
Posts: 811
What to do with CSP after acquiring CSR?
My old CSP has a $15K credit line and I'm strongly considering closing it now that I have a CSR. (I also have a CF). I had a few questions:
1. Is there anything that the CSP does better than the CSR? My understanding is that the CSR is equal to or better than the CSP in every aspect (other than a higher AF) - is this accurate?
2. I would like to transfer a chunk of my credit line (9-10K worth) to CSR and then downgrade to CFU (which would have a 5-6K credit line). This is to prevent my credit score from taking a hit. Anyone done something like this?
1. Is there anything that the CSP does better than the CSR? My understanding is that the CSR is equal to or better than the CSP in every aspect (other than a higher AF) - is this accurate?
2. I would like to transfer a chunk of my credit line (9-10K worth) to CSR and then downgrade to CFU (which would have a 5-6K credit line). This is to prevent my credit score from taking a hit. Anyone done something like this?
Jan 7, 2017, 10:18 am
#378
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 8
I just did this today. I was planning on downgrading to the regular Sapphire, leaving like a $500 credit limit, and transferring the rest of my available credit on that card to my Freedom. However, to keep the account open, I would have needed to keep at least a $5k limit. Instead, I was able to merge the Sapphire and Freedom accounts and then close the Sapphire. All of the credit transfers and it doesn't show up as a closed account on my credit report.
Jan 7, 2017, 10:26 am
#379
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Snohomish, WA
Programs: AS MVP Gold, HHonors Diamond
Posts: 2,793
Downgrade it to a Freedom or Freedom Unlimited card.
Neil
Neil
Jan 7, 2017, 10:32 am
#380
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Intermountain West
Programs: Too many to list
Posts: 12,082
I just did this today. I was planning on downgrading to the regular Sapphire, leaving like a $500 credit limit, and transferring the rest of my available credit on that card to my Freedom. However, to keep the account open, I would have needed to keep at least a $5k limit. Instead, I was able to merge the Sapphire and Freedom accounts and then close the Sapphire. All of the credit transfers and it doesn't show up as a closed account on my credit report.
Jan 9, 2017, 3:39 pm
#381
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 24
I'm guessing I'll be stuck with paying for a cheap revenue flight, since it'd be very expensive to simply pay to reinstate all miles.
Jan 13, 2017, 9:27 pm
#382
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: PHL
Programs: UA 1K 1MM, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum, Raddison Platinum, Avis Presidents Club
Posts: 5,271
My parents have a UA Club card which will expire in march but dont want to pay fees.
Questions:
1. When is the latest they can cancel the card? On the MPE card, I recall they will refund the fee if they cancel within 60 days. but I've read 30days or prorated
2. From what I read, its better to apply for a MPE then cancel the club card to avoid the fee because downgrading won't waive the annual fee for the MPE, is that correct?
3. When I tried cancelling my MPE, they usually offer another United card with no fee or club cards but still earns some miles, maybe free bags, not sure. They said it wasnt on their site and would never give me any info on it. Could they switch to this card? Would it still count towards PQD waiver?
4. Will the money they spend towards the PQD waiver on the club card still count after it is cancelled/converted?
Questions:
1. When is the latest they can cancel the card? On the MPE card, I recall they will refund the fee if they cancel within 60 days. but I've read 30days or prorated
2. From what I read, its better to apply for a MPE then cancel the club card to avoid the fee because downgrading won't waive the annual fee for the MPE, is that correct?
3. When I tried cancelling my MPE, they usually offer another United card with no fee or club cards but still earns some miles, maybe free bags, not sure. They said it wasnt on their site and would never give me any info on it. Could they switch to this card? Would it still count towards PQD waiver?
4. Will the money they spend towards the PQD waiver on the club card still count after it is cancelled/converted?
1. Are there any restrictions from Chase regarding having more than one UA card open at once aside from the credit line amount? (Club + MPE) Can I apply for the MPE before cancelling the Club?
2. If I just call and ask to downgrade from Club to MPE, am I immediately charged the $95 or will the first year still we waived (I've ready mixed reports)
3. If I apply for the MPE before cancelling the Club card and am declined, will that negatively affect my ability to downgrade the card later? (ie. extra hard pull). This would seem to be the optimal approach to ensure getting the annual fee waived and bonus miles except there is a risk of being declined.
Jan 15, 2017, 6:42 pm
#383
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 495
My old CSP has a $15K credit line and I'm strongly considering closing it now that I have a CSR. (I also have a CF). I had a few questions:
1. Is there anything that the CSP does better than the CSR? My understanding is that the CSR is equal to or better than the CSP in every aspect (other than a higher AF) - is this accurate?
2. I would like to transfer a chunk of my credit line (9-10K worth) to CSR and then downgrade to CFU (which would have a 5-6K credit line). This is to prevent my credit score from taking a hit. Anyone done something like this?
1. Is there anything that the CSP does better than the CSR? My understanding is that the CSR is equal to or better than the CSP in every aspect (other than a higher AF) - is this accurate?
2. I would like to transfer a chunk of my credit line (9-10K worth) to CSR and then downgrade to CFU (which would have a 5-6K credit line). This is to prevent my credit score from taking a hit. Anyone done something like this?
of course, try not to cancel your oldest 2 accounts since many credit models calculate the "average age of accounts"/average age of credit history based on the length of your "active" accounts (although a few models base it on the length of active + closed accounts on your credit report.
Last edited by edealinfo12345; Jan 15, 2017 at 7:08 pm
Jan 16, 2017, 6:24 am
#384
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,857
Followup questions:
1. Are there any restrictions from Chase regarding having more than one UA card open at once aside from the credit line amount? (Club + MPE) Can I apply for the MPE before cancelling the Club?
2. If I just call and ask to downgrade from Club to MPE, am I immediately charged the $95 or will the first year still we waived (I've ready mixed reports)
3. If I apply for the MPE before cancelling the Club card and am declined, will that negatively affect my ability to downgrade the card later? (ie. extra hard pull). This would seem to be the optimal approach to ensure getting the annual fee waived and bonus miles except there is a risk of being declined.
1. Are there any restrictions from Chase regarding having more than one UA card open at once aside from the credit line amount? (Club + MPE) Can I apply for the MPE before cancelling the Club?
2. If I just call and ask to downgrade from Club to MPE, am I immediately charged the $95 or will the first year still we waived (I've ready mixed reports)
3. If I apply for the MPE before cancelling the Club card and am declined, will that negatively affect my ability to downgrade the card later? (ie. extra hard pull). This would seem to be the optimal approach to ensure getting the annual fee waived and bonus miles except there is a risk of being declined.
2. I would expect a pro-rated refund of the Club AF and the MPE AF to be charged on the first day of the month following the downgrade.
3. No effect on your ability to product change to the card.
Jan 19, 2017, 9:14 am
#385
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: PIT-SCE-AOO-PHL-NYC-WAS
Programs: free agent
Posts: 1,036
Want to check with you guys to see if I'm right or wrong. I used to have CSP before downgrade to Chase Freedom Unilimited. I will fall under 5/24 this year, and does it mean I'm able to apply for new freedom unlimited and earn bonus?
Jan 19, 2017, 9:33 am
#386
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,958
Do you still have the Freedom Unlimited card?
$150 Bonus
This product is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this credit card within the last 24 months
This product is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this credit card within the last 24 months
Jan 22, 2017, 4:52 am
#387
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 495
Pro-Rate Refund on Chase Annual Fee Card
If someone has the Chase Sapphire Preferred with a $95 fee and is mid-way through the year the fee applies and then cancels the card, does that person get a pro-rated refund for half the year (i.e., half of the $95)?
Thanks in advance
Thanks in advance
Last edited by edealinfo12345; Jan 22, 2017 at 8:29 am
Jan 22, 2017, 5:45 am
#388
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 199
Definitely not. The fee is not a per-day fee charged all at once, it's an annual fee. Once you've paid it, you've paid it, and you're not getting it back.
Jan 22, 2017, 7:56 am
#389
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: Hilton Gold
Posts: 44
However you are right that the OP is out of luck if he is halfway trough the year.
Jan 22, 2017, 8:05 am
#390
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 10
Mine was refunded at prorated value when I PC'd to a second Freedom earlier this month though...