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-   -   Complaints about Customs (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/canada/810328-complaints-about-customs.html)

CBSAguy Apr 15, 2008 1:16 pm


Originally Posted by yyz_atc_qq (Post 9576717)
I think the best way to avoid the interrogations at Primary is to get a NEXUS or CANPASS Air Card. Since I've had mine I no longer worry about getting asked questions that frustrate me. Now if AC could just get my bags out quicker then the whole system would work like clockwork!

I'd get Nexus if I was travelling every week. Though, oddly enough, every time a flight arrives, if the hall is empty, I seem to always get a Nexus user at my counter "because it's faster than using the machine".

CBSAguy Apr 15, 2008 1:32 pm


Originally Posted by cur (Post 9567934)
The 10k rule is so horribly misunderstood. It's for MONEY LAUNDERING PURPOSES ONLY. It's not for the tax man, it's not for the EI investigators. It's for FINTRAC. Nothing else. Asking the 10k question via the air stream is stupid, and you should reply by telling them to read the card. Then you should ask them if they are new. They're obviously new if they're asking you a question that was asked and documented on the piece of paper in front of them.

People smuggle large amounts of currency through the airports all the time. It's not stupid; it's enforcing the law as enacted by Parliament.

There is no declaration card for export purposes, so when we rove departing flights, you can't really tell the officer to look at the card. And, as for asking the question at primary, I do it sometimes (depending on the flight), even if it's answered on the card. A large percentage of people either do not read the questions or cannot read the questions due to a language barrier. I've saved a few people from currency seizures.

zorn Apr 15, 2008 1:36 pm


Originally Posted by CBSAguy (Post 9577107)
Having said that, I have found from experience that those who have a real hate on for CBSA are primarily those who have had some enforcement action taken against them.

I've never had an enforcement action taken against me, but the immigration-related questions (not the duty ones - I just declare what I brought and would be happy to pay any duty if asked to, and I've never been asked to even when I've been over the limit).

The longest conversation I've ever had with a CBSA agent was when the whole family was coming back, and the lady just gave us a quick reminder to have a letter if one of us travels alone with the kids.

But I still hate the process of re-entering my country. I just find it offensive that you want to know why I was away. I was away because I felt like it. I'm returning because it's my right.

If you want to see if I need to pay duty, just ask me what I bought. I'll tell you if I'm over. If you don't believe me, search my dirty underwear and dusty second-hand books I bought in London to your heart's content.

CBSAguy Apr 15, 2008 1:42 pm


Originally Posted by cur (Post 9567934)
i never knew that putting my suitcases down in secondary, going beyond the requests of the BSo by emptying my pockets, and then grabbing a magazine (lawfully purchased in canada, of course, because those american magazines full of heinous non-canadian ads are of threat to our nation), sitting on a bench, and reading said magazine until the inspection is completed, OR standing there and not answering a single question a BSo asked all constituted "molesting" "hindering" or "preventing" a BSo from inspecting MY GOODS.
....until we had a BSo interpret the law, of course. I still wonder why cBSa constantly blow drug seizure cases in court?

Standing there and "not answering a single question a BSO asked" would definitely consistute hindering. I refer you back to Section 11(1) of the Customs Act, specifically the part that states: "...and answer truthfully any questions asked by the officer in the performance of his or her duties under this or any other Act of Parliament." Besides, your original post was talking about leaving Secondary without the examination being completed.

yyz_atc_qq Apr 15, 2008 2:01 pm


Originally Posted by CBSAguy (Post 9577192)
I'd get Nexus if I was travelling every week. Though, oddly enough, every time a flight arrives, if the hall is empty, I seem to always get a Nexus user at my counter "because it's faster than using the machine".

I don't travel every week. I usually do at least 1 int'l a month tho. Sometimes more. The process to get my CANPASS Air card took a while, but now that I have it I have trouble accepting that I've ever lived without it.

nolens volans Apr 15, 2008 2:32 pm


Originally Posted by daeira (Post 9576542)
What bothers me is being called old and that in his attempt to prove that I was indeed a student, insulted the very basis of my research. More importantly what disturbed me is that at no time during that questioning did he even ask about the nature of the goods I brought back. The questions he posed didn't even seem relevant to assessing whether I should be given a secondary or whether I had duties or taxes to pay. It seems as he was on a fishing expedition to make me feel purposely lousy about myself and my profession.

Never, ever tell them you're a student unless you're prepared to give a mini-seminar on what you're studying. They seem to love making people explain all about what molecular biology or knot theory or morphosyntax is - and then of course you get sent to secondary anyway because everybody knows students are dodgy people who use drugs and so on.

This 'explain your discipline and the nature of your research in 30 seconds' happened to me numerous times until I had a good enough day job to disguise my studentry, so your experience was not an isolated incident by any means (and I occasionally got 'you don't *look* like a student' too). It doesn't serve any Customs-related purpose as far as I can tell and is really freaking annoying.

nolens volans Apr 15, 2008 2:39 pm


Originally Posted by CBSAguy (Post 9577107)
I suppose it should come as no surprise that someone who has had a seizure (commodities, drugs, etc.) against them and who now takes a trip into Secondary on each trip into Canada would be bitter.

Indeed, though I can tell you it's nothing compared to the bitterness of someone who has never had any seizures or other enforcement action taken against them nor indeed has ever been in violation of any customs rules or regulations, but who still gets a trip to secondary every time they enter Canada. :rolleyes:

This was the case for me - though only ever at YYZ - until I had the sense to get my NEXUS card. Can people somehow be black-flagged for special harrassment without having committed any violations ? :confused: At any rate if I had any such 'black flag' on my record it doesn't seem to have interfered with my obtaining the NEXUS card.

CBSAguy Apr 15, 2008 2:42 pm


Originally Posted by cur (Post 9574080)
uh huh :(

cur: I found the following post you made on May 20th, 2006. Just curious as to what's changed your opinion since then.




My friend is in CBSA training and he says that it is made extremely clear that the CBSA is mandated to go after
-Terrorism
-Money laundering
-Weapons smuggling
-Drugs
-Missing children

Not residents bringing in extra clothes. The reason why they changed them from CCRA to CBSA (you'll see their new uniforms on the 1st of June) is because they're now enforcers, not tax collectors.

It costs $7 for the CBSA to collect tax/duty/penalties. While people say the agents are lazy, the same people are also saying that they're keen to process paperwork over stupid things like t-shirts.

Agreed with the OP over YVR though. It's pathetic. Although blaming front-liners is easy and requires no effort, I'd blame the airport authority's poor usage of your AIF and the 4 or so AZN flights and 2 from the EU over 2 hours, rather than bashing the agents who "go on lunch breaks right in front of me". You don't know why they are getting out of their station, and I'm sure you didn't see them go to the lunch room to microwave lunch.

Take into account that the BSA probably keeps the numbers of people in the front stations at 80% in order to control the flow of people through the baggage hall. If you pump people through as quickly as possible, you're going to have the whole bag hall full beyond reason and threads coming up on FT whining about how full the hall is.

tomh009 Apr 15, 2008 2:45 pm


Originally Posted by why fly (Post 9575340)
WOW after reading this i guess i have been very lucky........ Other than the land crossing 10 years ago i have never been hassled......^

Right ... somehow you and I are "lucky" every time, whereas Simon has problems every time. :confused: :rolleyes: :confused:

tomh009 Apr 15, 2008 2:48 pm


Originally Posted by yyz_atc_qq (Post 9576717)
I think the best way to avoid the interrogations at Primary is to get a NEXUS or CANPASS Air Card. Since I've had mine I no longer worry about getting asked questions that frustrate me. Now if AC could just get my bags out quicker then the whole system would work like clockwork!

Alas, that's YYZ rather than AC. T3 is just as bad as T1 for luggage. YYZ is one of the worst airports (that I have ever waited luggage for at) for luggage delivery speed.

Sanosuke Apr 15, 2008 2:49 pm

I think CBSAguy's doing a great job at helping soothe the criticism towards the CBSA agents.

I remember one other time when I was coming home from LAX with a new suit in my baggage back in the mid 90s. They asked me for the reciepts for the suit. Then they waved me on through after they saw the suit.

Not anymore. They ask you to hand over your laptop and digital camera when you just got back from a visit to a friend across the border. Times have changed and if we can't get used to the changes, we better be prepared for an alternative means of transportation that is less invasive of our space by the border officials.

Like it or not, they carry those searches in the interest of our national security and enforcement of the Criminal Code of Canada as well.

Cur, you have done a great job at defending yourself pretty well as well but we sometimes have to yield to authority if they ask nicely and professionally as they have in my case of secondaries.

Sanosuke!

daeira Apr 15, 2008 4:02 pm


Originally Posted by nolens volans (Post 9577721)
Never, ever tell them you're a student unless you're prepared to give a mini-seminar on what you're studying. They seem to love making people explain all about what molecular biology or knot theory or morphosyntax is - and then of course you get sent to secondary anyway because everybody knows students are dodgy people who use drugs and so on.

This 'explain your discipline and the nature of your research in 30 seconds' happened to me numerous times until I had a good enough day job to disguise my studentry, so your experience was not an isolated incident by any means (and I occasionally got 'you don't *look* like a student' too). It doesn't serve any Customs-related purpose as far as I can tell and is really freaking annoying.

It's somehow comforting to learn that there are others who have experienced the same 'legitimize your research and methodology to me' question that I've been subject to. What's infuriating to me (and here's my own personal thorn) is that I look young. I typically look about 10 years younger than I am and am constantly mistaken for a late teen or early 20s gal. His, 'you look old' comment really hit a nerve because I was quite aware that after a 9 hour flight, I wasn't looking my best and perhaps the bags under my eyes could have contributed to the general haggard appearance I seemed to be carrying that day. But, as a customs agent, he really should have known better than to insult me and tell me I look too old to be a student.

So if I should never say I'm a student, what might be a more appropriate response? Professional gadabout? Procrastinator? Aimless wanderer? I'm quite certain all of those would lead me to a lovely secondary.

ylwae Apr 15, 2008 5:33 pm


Originally Posted by Sanosuke (Post 9577843)
I think CBSAguy's doing a great job at helping soothe the criticism towards the CBSA agents.

Yes. I'll feeled very soothed the next time I have to waste time in secondary because I declared a small overage.

Denizen Apr 15, 2008 5:34 pm


Originally Posted by Sanosuke (Post 9577843)
I think CBSAguy's doing a great job at helping soothe the criticism towards the CBSA agents.

I remember one other time when I was coming home from LAX with a new suit in my baggage back in the mid 90s. They asked me for the reciepts for the suit. Then they waved me on through after they saw the suit.

Not anymore. They ask you to hand over your laptop and digital camera when you just got back from a visit to a friend across the border. Times have changed and if we can't get used to the changes, we better be prepared for an alternative means of transportation that is less invasive of our space by the border officials.

Like it or not, they carry those searches in the interest of our national security and enforcement of the Criminal Code of Canada as well.

Cur, you have done a great job at defending yourself pretty well as well but we sometimes have to yield to authority if they ask nicely and professionally as they have in my case of secondaries.

Sanosuke!

I am still waiting for CBSAguy to answer the question I (and others) posed a few days ago - Why do Canadian customs agents ask more intrusive questions and are generally ruder than almost all other countries (in the world not just the US by the way)? Will CBSAguy please face the fact that a remarkable number of people in a very short time on this forum have reported this - doesn't this indicate something in itself? We aren't just inventing these stories and complaints and we are just the people who speak up - note the number of reading hits this forum point has evoked in such a short time.

Leaving NEXUS and US/Canada aside, many of us have visited many countries other than the US or Canada and know that there is a DEFINITE DIFFERENCE between Canada and almost every other country in how they treat returning CITIZENS. That is what I would like CSBA to explain.

When I go to Communist China or Russia(as a visitor of course - not as a citizen), I give them my passport, they run it through the system, they look at my face, stamp the passport and that's it. I have even got angry with them for inefficiency once and they just apologized.

When I come back, my own country gives me the third degree, looks at me like I just killed my parents, sneers at my responses and if I complain (did that once), then it is off to the secondary with me. I challenged them that I was only being taken to secondary because I complained and they said "Oh no sir, this is only random". What a lot of BS - you are all on a power trip and Canadian citizens are afraid to speak up because they don't need the hassle. But that does not make it right!

By the way, SINOSUKE - could you stop your grovelling to authority? It is really getting sickening - yes, we know you read 1984 and you LOVED it - all that big brother stuff - fits right in with your slavish agreement with whatever the authorities dish out. You need to read some Ayn Rand, my friend and try developing an individual personality - all that 'groupthink' of yours is why you love your CSBA friends.

ylwae Apr 15, 2008 5:38 pm


Originally Posted by Denizen (Post 9578763)
By the way, SINOSUKE - could you stop your grovelling to authority? It is really getting sickening - yes, we know you read 1984 and you LOVED it - all that big brother stuff - fits right in with your slavish agreement with whatever the authorities dish out. You need to read some Ayn Rand, my friend and try developing an individual personality - all that 'groupthink' of yours is why you love your CSBA friends.

Not really called for--he is entitled to his opinion.


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