A distressing embarrassment on BA249 LHR-GIG
Sep 8, 2019, 2:52 pm
#46
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Economy, mostly :(
Programs: Skywards Gold
Posts: 7,801
What a ridiculous thing to say and you should be embarrassed of this. Are you suggesting that people who have ANY disabilities should confine themselves to be home bound? Apparently it seems that a person who may require any extra provisions should just stay home, according to your statement.
A person who suffers from a disability is likely to require some sort of extra provisions, whether it is access whitin a few minutes to a toilet or a lift to take them on an aircraft. We as a society need to make these provisions a reality; not telling them "You're too much of an inconvenience - stay home".
A person who suffers from a disability is likely to require some sort of extra provisions, whether it is access whitin a few minutes to a toilet or a lift to take them on an aircraft. We as a society need to make these provisions a reality; not telling them "You're too much of an inconvenience - stay home".
Last edited by NWIFlyer; Sep 8, 2019 at 10:51 pm Reason: Rule 16
Sep 8, 2019, 2:57 pm
#47
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC GGL/GFl, HH Diamond, BW Diamond, Virgin Voyages Deep Blue Extra, Blue Peter Badge Holder
Posts: 3,937
My conditoon is covered by the Equality Act 2010; it is a lifelong condition that affects my ability to do day to day activities like going to the toilet. As a business they are required to make reasonable adjustment. Had they done so, as they had promised they would, I would not be in this situation.
There is one thing for posters to say that perhaps I shouldn’t have travelled, but quite another to blame me as you have decided to take it upon yourself to do so, and clearly without any understanding of the law and business requirements with respect to disabled passengers.
I fully disclosed my condition in advance to BA, if they weren’t able to meet my needs by making reasonable adjustment, then they should have offered to refund me and cancel the trip. Instead, they said we can accommodate your needs and it is a non-refundable ticket.
Perhaps the issue is less never travelling, but maybe the OP could have taken a bit more time to acclimatize to this newly diagnosed condition, maybe travelled on some shorter routes first to get a better idea of his needs during travel, etc. Jumping straight into a 10h+ flight a couple weeks after such a big life changing diagnosis is perhaps ill advised (I'm interpreting what I think the poster you quoted may have meant, but also what I think may have been a good approach. That being said I enjoy taking risks and in OP's situation probably would have travelled, because f*ck it, YOLO).
Last edited by navylad; Sep 8, 2019 at 3:03 pm
Sep 8, 2019, 2:59 pm
#48
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Honors Diamond, Mucci de buveur de gin
Posts: 3,060
If a wheelchair bound person found themselves in the situation of having an immediate dose of the sh!ts which caused them to require immediate access to the bathroom then yes, they should also not travel. So don't try and twist my argument mario. Very unbecoming of you.
Sep 8, 2019, 3:01 pm
#49
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Honors Diamond, Mucci de buveur de gin
Posts: 3,060
I’m sorry but I take issue with that response.
My conditoon is covered by the Equality Act 2010; it is a lifelong condition that affects my ability to do day to day activities like going to the toilet. As a business they are required to make reasonable adjustment. Had they done so, as they had promised they would, I would not be in this situation.
There is one thing for posters to say that perhaps I shouldn’t have travelled, but quite another to blame me as you have decided to take it upon yourself to do so, and clearly without any understanding of the law and business requirements with respect to disabled passengers.
I fully disclosed my condition in advance to BA, if they weren’t able to meet my needs by making reasonable adjustment, then they should have offered to refund me and cancel the trip. Instead, they said we can accommodate your needs and it is a non-refundable ticket.
The points made before still stand. What if there was severe turbulence and you needed to go? What if you got swept to the front of the queue but someone was in there spewing their guts up? What would you have done in that situation? Still threatened to take BA to court because there weren't enough bathrooms on the plane?
Sep 8, 2019, 3:04 pm
#50
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 16
And are you also not required to take your own reasonable adjustments?
The points made before still stand. What if there was severe turbulence and you needed to go? What if you got swept to the front of the queue but someone was in there spewing their guts up? What would you have done in that situation? Still threatened to take BA to court because there weren't enough bathrooms on the plane?
The points made before still stand. What if there was severe turbulence and you needed to go? What if you got swept to the front of the queue but someone was in there spewing their guts up? What would you have done in that situation? Still threatened to take BA to court because there weren't enough bathrooms on the plane?
Sep 8, 2019, 3:05 pm
#51
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2010
Programs: AA
Posts: 14,741
navylad, you don’t have to apologize for trying to take advantage of the services offered (and required by law). Last Monday I had an issue with wheelchair assistance on AA and tweeted them about it. When I landed at my destination I had a voice mail from AA corporate that wanted to discuss it, It wasn’t about compensation, as it obviously isn’t in your case either, it was about making sure that access is made available to as many people as possible. BA should be doing their best to make sure that all their passengers are taken care of, and it’s not your fault that someone failed to follow policies and procedures.
Best of luck to you in this new journey, from someone else who has just set out on a new journey.
Best of luck to you in this new journey, from someone else who has just set out on a new journey.
Sep 8, 2019, 3:06 pm
#52
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Honors Diamond, Mucci de buveur de gin
Posts: 3,060
Yes, yes but we have been over the point that communication isn't exactly BA's strongest point lol. Which is why I suggested it may have been an idea for the OP (if at some point there was an immediate requirement to reach the toilet bowl) to notify the CSD.
I guess people would deal with these situations differently if, God forbid, they found themselves in that position.
I guess people would deal with these situations differently if, God forbid, they found themselves in that position.
Sep 8, 2019, 3:07 pm
#53
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: BA Blue, IHG Spire, Marriott Gold
Posts: 402
Sep 8, 2019, 3:07 pm
#54
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC GGL/GFl, HH Diamond, BW Diamond, Virgin Voyages Deep Blue Extra, Blue Peter Badge Holder
Posts: 3,937
And are you also not required to take your own reasonable adjustments?
The points made before still stand. What if there was severe turbulence and you needed to go? What if you got swept to the front of the queue but someone was in there spewing their guts up? What would you have done in that situation? Still threatened to take BA to court because there weren't enough bathrooms on the plane?
The points made before still stand. What if there was severe turbulence and you needed to go? What if you got swept to the front of the queue but someone was in there spewing their guts up? What would you have done in that situation? Still threatened to take BA to court because there weren't enough bathrooms on the plane?
You are starting to come across as insensitive here, you made your point that there are risks associated with anyone flying that anyone could need to use the toilet medically with urgency and there are times when that is not possible on a plane, but quite frankly your attitude and unnecessary use of colourful language is not being helpful and may I request you desist unless you have any actual further constructive points to make.
Last edited by navylad; Sep 8, 2019 at 3:13 pm
Sep 8, 2019, 3:10 pm
#55
Join Date: Apr 2009
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Honors Diamond, Mucci de buveur de gin
Posts: 3,060
Quite simply no your wrong, there is no requirement in the Act that negates the actions of the business because of the actions of the individual.
You are starting to come across as insensitive here, you made your point that there are risks associated with anyone flying that anyone could need to use the toilet medically with urgency and there are times when that is not possible on a plane, but quite frankly your attitude and unnecessary use of colourful language is not being helpful and may I request you disuse unless you have any actual further constructive points to make.
Insensitive? I've said that I hope your condition improves and that I wouldn't want to be in your situation. I suggest you read posts first before angrily tapping away on your keyboard. My opinion differs from yours for quite valid reasons. That's life.
Sep 8, 2019, 3:12 pm
#56
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: UK - Hampshire & London
Programs: Mucci de Guardian des Celliers des Grands Crus 1e Classé, plus BAEC.
Posts: 2,737
Thanks, and whilst yes I am aware that the sunflower lanyard has been around only for a couple of years, of which it more recently got introduced to LHR, one would hope that CC received sufficient training (I’m informed you get disability training on an annual basis) to know what it means. This is clearly a lesson that BA could take away and had they put that in their reply, it may of indeed sounded less disingenuous a response, friends are telling me to go down the media route as it is more likely to have a response across the company, but this would also perpetuate the embarrassment.
At the end of the day, I’m not compo hungry, I want to be suitable reassured that my flight back will be less risky of which some of the advice received here will help, but I do think a reasonable response from BA would be to allow me to cut short my holiday by two days in order that I can take them up on their uograde offer and travel with less anxiety.
One could of course take legal action, they have breached the Equality Act after all and get a reasonable pay out to donate to a suitable charity if they are totally unwilling to actually be flexible and supportive in their response.
I’ve asked them to escalate the complaint if necessary outside of CR if they are unable to deal with supporting my safe travel home and will await their response before considering any further action required. I will also speak to the accessibility team again once they are open on Monday (phone line permitting).
With respect to security lines, I was straight through at LHR without any issues (circa 3 minutes) and could have always explained and backtracked to a toilet if required. And I was at the airport 4 hours before the flight, used the facilities on arrival to limit the risk.
Oh and to address the suggestion that I just carry on to the toilet, the )6ft CC (male) was stood wide standard in the aisle shouting, there was no way I could get around him without getting physical, and quick-curffs was the last thing I needed.
Thanks so far for everyone’s understanding (mostly) and suggestions.
The incident, however awful for you, was caused by discreet errors by individuals on the flight. I think you must resist the temptation to equate the seriousness of the result with the seriousness of the error.
It’s frustrating that BA has not let you change the date of your flight in order to use the upgrade certificate. I think that’s the best thing BA could do for you now.
Keep going 👍 🙂
Sep 8, 2019, 3:35 pm
#58
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 858
Navylad,
I've enjoyed your many posts on FT.
I'm saddened to hear you have the diagnosis, especially coming just days before your flight and the consequences of that.
And your bravery in sharing on FT - you have made many posts and must have been expecting some of the replies! So well done for talking about your problems so as some (cabin crew and passengers) can learn from your experiences. I am now going to be sunflower lanyard spotting whenever I go to the loo ;-)
Keep the chin up, I look forward to many more of your FT posts.
I've enjoyed your many posts on FT.
I'm saddened to hear you have the diagnosis, especially coming just days before your flight and the consequences of that.
And your bravery in sharing on FT - you have made many posts and must have been expecting some of the replies! So well done for talking about your problems so as some (cabin crew and passengers) can learn from your experiences. I am now going to be sunflower lanyard spotting whenever I go to the loo ;-)
Keep the chin up, I look forward to many more of your FT posts.
Sep 8, 2019, 3:36 pm
#59
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: The greatest wee nation on earth.
Programs: Iron Maiden FC, GE, Rapidly falling down the Tiers to oblivion.
Posts: 2,604
Op, one thing you’ll soon realise is this happens. I go...a lot, and sometimes you just get caught out. I have no condition I am aware of as can’t be arsed finding a trigger nor seeing a doc to be told no idea....anyway....sorry to hear you have been diagnosed with something....but i have...well...followed through...on planes before. One time I swear the entire cabin on an AA 757 in F laughed at me as I crept along the wall to the loo where turbulence was my downfall; and the connections through dfw and mia were challenging in my khaki shorts (i lived in the carib at the time)....yet I laugh at it. I call it “doing a 1A”, and chuckle at the fact it was beige eisenhower seats. I’ve done same while eyeballing a giraffe at a wildlife park and in other equally unexpected places. I don’t blame anyone else; I don’t blame myself, I just accept it. Whatever happens, try to keep your head up, be as prepared as you can be and get on with your life. Don’t look to blame others, sometimes you simply can’t get to a can and being prepared helps as mentioned above. This reads like a joke post, but I assure you it isn’t (i’ve posted about doing a 1A on here before!); my wife gives me constant grief about me tearing off to the loo mid push of a swing with the kids...but don’t let it get you down. As per the post above, enjoy where you are; if you do have anxiety, let the csd know you may need a loo in an emergency (and you have taken steps to help With this). This is all very rambling but know you aren’t the only one!
Last edited by jcm9000; Sep 8, 2019 at 3:42 pm
Sep 8, 2019, 3:38 pm
#60
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 804
I have only read the main post and a few post underneath it and it is absolutely shocking how the staff treated you. Just makes me wonder sometimes if these cabin crews hate thier jobs or something. I mostly travel in J and thier service is definately subpar - I remember at least twice they forgotten to bring me my meal... Serving less passangers and forgotten to serve a meal I would say is just not acceptable. Wonder if it is the staff (who just doesn't give a **** or thier training is poor - I guess just a combination of both. I'd have thought that if CS confirmed that the CC will "know" of your needs with your lanyard... so either they are just ignorant or just not trained to indentify passangers who need special attention. Hope your journey back is better. If I were you, I'd definately make a complain. No one should be treated like that regardless of the class of travel.