Mid-J 747 Cabin Refresh

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Old Jan 28, 19, 4:29 am   -   Wikipost
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Mid-J 747 Refurbishments

BA announced early April 2018 that they had started a program to refurbish the cabins on its 16 Mid-J 747ís.

As part of the refurbishment ALL 16 aircraft will undergo BASIC refresh which consist of:

* Full aircraft deep clean
* Seats in WT/WTP will be refurbished with new seat foams and cushions as on Super Hi-J aircraft.

9 of the aircraft will receive a ENHANCED refurbishment to bring the cabin up to the exact same standard as on the Super Hi-J. This will consist of what is listed above plus:

* New Carpets fitted throughout
* All Curtains replaced
* LED mood lighting fitted
* New Panasonic IFE fitted

Note: There are currently no plans to install WIFI to any Mid-J configured 747 aircraft

Refurbishment Progress

Note: Aircraft that have undergone or that are to receive a ENHANCED refurbishment are shown in red

Refurbished Aircraft - Aircraft are listed in order that they have been refurbished and show return to service date

G-CIVM - 03 April 2018
G-CIVN - 22 April 2018
G-CIVD - 28 June 2018
G-CIVO - 14 October 2018
G-CIVK - 04 November 2018
G-CIVT - 11 November 2018
G-CIVA - 14 January 2019
G-CIVJ - 28 January 2019

Aircraft Currently Undergoing Refurbishment

G-CIVC - Arrived CWL 08 January 2019. Expected to return to service mid February 2019
G-CIVE - Arrived CWL 27 January 2019. Expected to return to service 12 March 2019

Future Planned Refurbishments - Aircraft in listed in date order based on when refurbishment is planned to be completed (date subject to change)

G-CIVP - 04 April 2019
G-CIVL - 17 April 2019
G-CIVU - September 2019
G-BNLY - October 2019
G-CIVB - December 2019

G-BNLN is the only 747 currently in service that will not receive any cabin refurbishment. This is due to it being planned to be retired in July 2019.
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Old Apr 14, 18, 1:09 pm
  #61  
 
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Originally Posted by shefgab View Post
G-CIVM def still has the Rockwell Collins system, and there have been no changes to the Club cabin. I think it was simply a change of seat covers in Y and Y+, plus a deep clean. No mood lighting.
Well I presume (hope) a deep clean is part of the normal heavy maintenance cycle in Cardiff anyway, so it seems the only 'investment' item for these dying birds is the Y/Y+ covers.
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Old Apr 21, 18, 8:01 am
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Am flying to LAS on Wednesday on BA271, can anyone tell me what aircraft is scheduled yet, or is it too early?
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Old Apr 21, 18, 10:54 am
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Originally Posted by FinnRolo View Post
Am flying to LAS on Wednesday on BA271, can anyone tell me what aircraft is scheduled yet, or is it too early?
Too early, ask again on Monday.
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Old Apr 21, 18, 10:55 am
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Almost definitely a unrefurbised 52J 744!
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Old Apr 21, 18, 5:43 pm
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Originally Posted by mikeyfly View Post
Almost definitely a unrefurbised 52J 744!
That's what I'm expecting,
However, I am just hoping it won't be one of the really old (1990 or 1993 or 1994) birds, as I had a couple of flights on these last year and they really are in an embarrassingly dire state. I would go so far as to say they are literally falling apart internally - I was in the F galley for a while talking to a crew member, and some wall panels were coming apart with insulation material hanging out.
On another flight the well documented IFE issues arose, with the system having to be rebooted several times during the flight.

Last edited by FinnRolo; Apr 21, 18 at 5:53 pm
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Old Apr 22, 18, 2:50 am
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I'll try and make a bit of clarity, here, with regards to this refresh.

The first aircrafts to be refurbished between now and the summer will not have the new IFE. This is because they haven't got enough life, in them, to justify the investment. As others have said, an IFE can potentially be recycled and then put onto another aircraft, but a lot of the wiring is lost and it's a hell of a job. So "all" these birds are getting are a lot of clearing of defects, thorough inspections, an overhaul of every moving part of seats and so on, new foams, new curtains, new seat cushions and that's basically it. Had it been me I'd have worded the communications differently, something on the lines of "9 aircrafts get new IFE and another 7 get a good scrub" but hey, there's a reason why I've always failed marketing classes.

These birds, even those receiving the IFE, won't get the new-er, 380/787/74S, Club seat (the one grey and white). Not entirely sure about mood lightning either. This piece of work has been authorised as a simple, stop-gap solution since the introduction of the 74S has really revealed what a massive gap exists, in customer's perception, between those and the Mid-Js, chiefly for the IFE and cleanliness.

Some have mentioned that the time to re-fit these planes is quite a long time indeed, but the truth is that it's done to fit in the normal calendar of maintenance. There isn't a) the space at BAMC b) the downtime and c) the extra aircrafts to cover for those birds if it was done quicker; in fact, I'm personally finding it surprising it's still going ahead, given the bad news coming out of Derby with regards to the 787. For instance -BJE has been in "paperweight" mode since, well, God knows when and even more planes will need to have their powerplants checked.

Wi-Fi is a separate piece of work, I'm afraid. I think it does happen, when it's possible, in conjunction with scheduled maintenance (don't quote me on that but I believe that the 380s doing their heavies over in Manila by Lufthansa Technik are having it fitted) but sometimes it's too much to fit into a packed maintenance schedule, or the necessary spares/infrastructure cannot be mobilised, so it's done separately. I know there's a tendency, on these pages, to think BA Engineering is rather bureaucratic and that lateral thinking doesn't abound but it really isn't. If it makes sense, saves money/time/effort and helps the customers they'll do their damnedest to make it happen.

All this is based on my knowledge and it's not BA's opinion.
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Old Apr 22, 18, 2:56 am
  #67  
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Originally Posted by 13900 View Post
"9 aircrafts get new IFE and another 7 get a good scrub"
Indeed this makes it a lot clearer, thank you for that. Do you have a list of the 9? If not @Globaliser can perhaps work it out....
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Old Apr 22, 18, 3:07 am
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Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave View Post
Indeed this makes it a lot clearer, thank you for that. Do you have a list of the 9? If not @Globaliser can perhaps work it out....
Apologies, no.
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Old Apr 22, 18, 3:08 am
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Originally Posted by 13900 View Post
I'll try and make a bit of clarity, here, with regards to this refresh.

The first aircrafts to be refurbished between now and the summer will not have the new IFE. This is because they haven't got enough life, in them, to justify the investment. As others have said, an IFE can potentially be recycled and then put onto another aircraft, but a lot of the wiring is lost and it's a hell of a job. So "all" these birds are getting are a lot of clearing of defects, thorough inspections, an overhaul of every moving part of seats and so on, new foams, new curtains, new seat cushions and that's basically it. Had it been me I'd have worded the communications differently, something on the lines of "9 aircrafts get new IFE and another 7 get a good scrub" but hey, there's a reason why I've always failed marketing classes.
Huge thanks for the very informative post.

What I donít understand is why BA let them get into such a state in the first place. I flew to DFW and back over Easter and put simply they were decrepit, bordering on disgusting. I filled in the survey I got after the flight so hopefully it will get noted.
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Old Apr 22, 18, 3:20 am
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Firstly thanks @13900 for the detail and clarification.

Originally Posted by 13900 View Post
This piece of work has been authorised as a simple, stop-gap solution since the introduction of the 74S has really revealed what a massive gap exists, in customer's perception, between those and the Mid-Js, chiefly for the IFE and cleanliness.
The view I would take is that such a gap shouldn't have been allowed to arise in the first place. We have known the state of these aircraft for a long time, and I think a decision should have been taken to make at least some improvements to them some years ago. Even if that was just the minimal 'scrub' they're doing now. As it is, they have left it so late that the damage is already done - perception of BA's product in markets served by these aircraft I would guess is pretty bad.

[ETA: as Dave_C said!]
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Old Apr 22, 18, 3:34 am
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Originally Posted by Dave_C View Post
Huge thanks for the very informative post.

What I don’t understand is why BA let them get into such a state in the first place. I flew to DFW and back over Easter and put simply they were decrepit, bordering on disgusting. I filled in the survey I got after the flight so hopefully it will get noted.
Originally Posted by Ldnn1 View Post
Firstly thanks @13900 for the detail and clarification.



The view I would take is that such a gap shouldn't have been allowed to arise in the first place. We have known the state of these aircraft for a long time, and I think a decision should have been taken to make at least some improvements to them some years ago. Even if that was just the minimal 'scrub' they're doing now. As it is, they have left it so late that the damage is already done - perception of BA's product in markets served by these aircraft I would guess is pretty bad.

[ETA: as Dave_C said!]
You're both welcome.

As with most things, there are multiple reasons. Bureaucracy aside - as with many large corporations, getting money and spending it requires a lot of time & effort - it's a mixture of different factors behind the state the Mid-Js are in. For starter they fly some of the 'worst' routes; I don't wish to offend anyone, but the Vegas route ought to be served with a plane just made of stainless steel, to be washed with a high-pressure hose after each flight. I worked six months as an aircraft cleaning supervisor and the amount - and diversity! - of bodily fluids we've seen after a rowdy LAS-LHR is astounding. It's unfortunately true, but I've seen - day in day out - situations where the same aircraft type goes to Japan and returns spotless; goes elsewhere and it returns good for the scrap heap.

Secondly, they don't get a lot of downtime. Believe it or not, just shampooing (yes, it's called shampooing!) the carpets of an aircraft takes six hours, and can't be done with engineers on board. It's the same issue of the LGW birds, by the way. Then there's the old issue of cost. Keep the OPEX as little as possible and, inevitably, you'll have to invest a hell of a lot of CAPEX to recover the crappy situation that the small expenditure on OPEX has led to.

All this is based on my experience and is my view, not BA's.
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Old Apr 22, 18, 3:34 am
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Originally Posted by Ldnn1 View Post
Firstly thanks @13900 for the detail and clarification.



The view I would take is that such a gap shouldn't have been allowed to arise in the first place. We have known the state of these aircraft for a long time, and I think a decision should have been taken to make at least some improvements to them some years ago. Even if that was just the minimal 'scrub' they're doing now. As it is, they have left it so late that the damage is already done - perception of BA's product in markets served by these aircraft I would guess is pretty bad.

[ETA: as Dave_C said!]
The other thing that I hope will get noted is that as a six year GGL and LTG, I have zero BA revenue bookings so far. I fully intend to get as few tier points as possible this collection year.

I’ve even gone so far as to have a United Polaris booking (on a 77W) which I have some quite low expectations of. LH and LX first is outstanding, and I’m looking forward to my first AC sectors in a long time in June, especially with the new signature service they’ve introduced.

But I’ll be SEN by September, and so far not regretting my decision in the slightest.

WW always wanted people to show him the money, well that’s what I’m doing now.

Last edited by Prospero; Apr 22, 18 at 6:30 am Reason: to comply with Rule 16
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Old Apr 22, 18, 4:57 am
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Originally Posted by 13900 View Post
I worked six months as an aircraft cleaning supervisor and the amount - and diversity! - of bodily fluids we've seen after a rowdy LAS-LHR is astounding.
Oh joy. I'm on the 191 tomorrow, G-BNLP, which just operated (gulp) LAS-LHR.
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Old Apr 22, 18, 5:22 am
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Originally Posted by superweak View Post
Oh joy. I'm on the 191 tomorrow, G-BNLP, which just operated (gulp) LAS-LHR.
Thanks for your hugely informative posts @13900
Bringing your own plastic seat cover, antiseptic wipes and rubber gloves would seem to be the new order of the day when flying this sub-fleet @superweak!
Perhaps BA could provide aircraft specific amenity kits

Last edited by gcuk; Apr 22, 18 at 5:28 am
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Old Apr 22, 18, 5:43 am
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Have you seen the new BA sleeper suit for these birds?

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