BlueThroughCrimp

Can you tell if it has yet? I'd imagine year on year would be a better comparison, and we've not had that cycle yet.
And load factors? All well and good, but if the yield is down, then that's a different matter.
Its far too early to tell what the direct cost of BoB is.

nallison

I gave a very detailed answer above, perhaps you could comment on the actual points I made. It doesn't serve the forum to ask people to repeat themselves. Please bear in mind this isn't a court of law, I don't think anyone enjoyed that Ryanair exchange!

If you're genuinely unaware of the potential conflict between short and long-term profits in business, and that it takes several years for brand damage to manifest in results, I can only recommend going and doing some reading. That's a bit harsh a comment but I know you won't mind given some of your comments in threads related to the law

In any case the brand damage is already showing quite clearly in the public domain. Their next results will include the cost of the IT fiasco. So I believe profits are already lower than they would be with and alternative strategy. Nether of us can prove we're right though can we? But I personally wouldn't recommend BA stock right now as a long term investment.

nallison

Exactly right, business 101 really!

tamalien

There seems to be more in the way of last minute cancellations this morning from LHR including 3 domestics, NCL, GLA and ABZ. Fewer cabin crew showing up than expected?

Expert flyer is also giving the codes for these cancellations as INDU. Cancellations that were announced a few days ago have cancelation code INDN.

Up to now it seems BA have been (on the whole) on top of cancellations usually giving plenty of notice. Exceptions have been a couple of Saturdays where some TATL cancelled at short notice. Are things beginning to bite?

KARFA

But the evidence you pointed to is conjecture, I doubt BA would change strategy based on TripAdvisor reviews or skytrax. What do the actual numbers say?

KARFA

So are you saying we don't have any evidence yet of drops in load factors or yields, or that it it is too early to see whether BoB has been detrimental to BA? If so it seems premature to suggest BA should change if you don't know whether the current strategy isn't working.

EDIT: just as a reminder, this point came out of a suggestion BA needed to stop choosing between profit and customer satisfaction and I suggested to BA it seems currently no such choice needs to be made as they are getting both. Until one of the two changes why would BA change?

ahmetdouas

I think it’s because after they were obviously Europe’s biggest airline, they had enough confidence and finances to make passengers happier and be more aggressive in increasing market share.

Ryanairs low cost model is now so well oiled they do not need to focus on cutting costs, more on making passengers happy. It’s a very important transition.


And everyone please stop talking about profits and passenger numbers , it would take at least a year since BA’s reduction of service to show on the books!

BlueThroughCrimp

At least you've adopted a better tone in this post.
So we have a different opinion. I'll leave it at that.

nallison

Your point is also conjecture, no? There is considerable, unanimous evidence showing a decline in customer satisfaction and none saying otherwise. Every single source I am aware of shows a decline. That's what the numbers say. People here have reported meeting BA bosses who said they were aware they've gone too far. I would suspect that conclusion was reached from looking at the numbers no?

And it has been explained several times now that it takes time for these kind of strategy changes to feed through it revenue results so please stop asking that question. This is a forum for discussion and debate, or conjecture perhaps. Some think that this straregy will cause those outcomes, but obviously will not do yet. If you have little knowledge of business maybe listen to those who have considerable experience in the area?

KARFA

I haven't actually advanced my own opinion on what BA should do so I am not sure what evidence it is, conjecture or otherwise, you think I have referred to in order to back up an opinion I haven't posted?

nallison

So you actually have no opinion, why do you care so much about mine? But actually you did post an opinion, I'm not sure why you do this:

"If so it seems premature to suggest BA should change if you don't know whether the current strategy isn't working. just as a reminder, this point came out of a suggestion BA needed to stop choosing between profit and customer satisfaction and I suggested to BA it seems currently no such choice needs to be made as they are getting both. Until one of the two changes why would BA change?[/B][/I]

You're doing your courtroom thing again. Are you aware it really doesn't add to threads, it's incredibly tedious when discussions are dragged round in circles so you can try and score points rather than engage in a discussion?

I've made my points. You asked what the numbers say, I've explined all the nunbers we have available show a decline in customer satisfaction. Your conjecture that there are no numbers to support a decline in customer satisfaction is wrong. If you don't want to accept that and actually discuss the issue, and are more interested in playing games, I'm not going to engage anymore either. Everyone else can read the responses and make their conclusions about who backed up their points.

I have a good detailed reply from my perspective as an economist to try and provide a bit of information for you, it's rather rude that you ignored it and continue with this kind of childish game.

KARFA

I was suggesting how BA may see things, and testing the arguments of those who propose BA change, I am totally lost as to where you see me expressing my own opinion on whether the current BA strategy is right or wrong, and what BA should do going forward. There is a considerable amount of obvious word twisting in your post which is rather unfortunate, for example I never said there are no numbers to show a decline in customer satisfaction, just that what you referred to in terms of evidence of such a decline was conjecture.

In any case I think it is a good idea to end this one when you seem to be adding more and more personal comments to your posts.

nallison

Well hopefully you've had your queries answered by several people who've been kind enough to explain something about business cycles and when we can expect to begin to get an idea of whether the strategy is a success or not. Hopefully you can acknowledge at some point, that people took time out of their day to asnwer questions you raised.

There was no word twisting, I don't really understand the point of posting an opinion on a discussion forum, and then rather than backing it up or engaging with new information provided by others (that you had asked for), instead denying ever having posted an opinion and repeatedly asking the same thing that has already been answered. This isn't a court and it doesn't serve the forum.

And yes, I posted actual evidence, not conjecture. I stated my opinion, and have various sources to back it up. If you have others that contradict it, be my guest.

Just to recap for anyone who hasn't long gone by now, this discussion does have some relvance to the cabin crew dispute, as it came out of an opinion expressed to a cabin crew member that as long as BA are making profit why they should change tack? Which I personally find quite distasteful, the idea that as long as you're making profit shafting your staff is completely justified.

rossmacd

Can we put the brakes on BAFT's High Court proceedings please?

NWIFlyer

Folks, personal spats are unedifying and unwelcome in this forum, and we respect each other's opinions. We also make our point and then move on to allow others to contribute to the debate rather than attempt to dominate it ourselves. I am disappointed that I need to do so, but this is a reminder of perhaps the most relevant section of rule 12:

Time to step away from the keyboard on this one, perhaps?

/mod