Action against unprincipled passenger?
Jul 30, 2018, 1:53 am
#91
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Frensham, Lincolnshire
Programs: RFC
Posts: 5,097
Do *you* find, say, a diner at a restaurant and ask them if they'd like to swap their more expensive meal for you lower cost one, because that's what you're effectively saying there. Asking the airline is one thing. Asking a pax is another thing entirely.
Jul 30, 2018, 2:17 am
#92
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 794
I don’t. But if someone asked another diner to swap his meals, and the diner is willing, either out of stupidity or respectful of adult, it doesn’t matter. I wouldn’t make a big deal about it and tell the restaurant to keep track of the other patron. Don’t create a mountain when there isn’t a molehill.
Jul 30, 2018, 5:22 am
#94
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: BOS/UTH
Programs: AA LT PLT; QR GLD; Bonvoy LT TIT
Posts: 12,764
Jul 30, 2018, 5:51 am
#95
Join Date: May 1998
Location: australia
Posts: 5,762
Or offer to go back to economy and ask the person sitting next to CK's wife if they would mind changing seats with CK in PE so that CK could come back and sit with his family
Jul 30, 2018, 6:24 am
#96
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Stilllwater OK (SWO)
Programs: AAdvantage ExecPlat, World of Hyatt Globalist, plain "member" of Marriott, IHG, enterprise, etc.
Posts: 1,848
Exactly. The acceptable code of conduct is that the person initiating the trade must be the one offering something of equal or BETTER value for the person being asked to move. It is completely rude to ask someone to downgrade for you or your companions' benefit. Even within the back of the plane in coach, it is rude to ask someone to move to your middle seat if they have an aisle (or window) seat. And no, I don't think most 16 year olds yet have fully developed the social grace and guts to stand their ground to an older adult in this type of situation. The social anxiety that defines a teenager's entire mental state is still pretty strong at that age. This is a classical case of bullying, and many kids would rather back down and 'agree' to the downgrade just to avoid having to stand up to a bully.
Jul 30, 2018, 7:00 am
#97
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: PHL
Programs: AA EXP, HH Diamond, Owner of 2,000 TWA shares
Posts: 812
I'm not saying the CK wasn't a jerk, but it seems a little over-the-top to treat a 16-year-old like a 8-year old. A few hundred years ago 16-year-olds were considered full "adults", responsible for providing for their families, protecting their household, etc. It's only our current society that places this magical arbitrary limit that you can't make decisions for yourself at 16 or 17, but you're suddenly in full possession of your faculties at 18. This is just disrespectful to 16-year-olds. Most 16-year-olds are quite capable of making these sorts of decisions on their own. Those that are not probably are not particularly respectful of adults either...
Also, the age of consent in the majority of states in the US is 16. Are you saying a 16-year-old can make decisions about procreation but not about whether they want to sit in premium economy?
Also, the age of consent in the majority of states in the US is 16. Are you saying a 16-year-old can make decisions about procreation but not about whether they want to sit in premium economy?
Ironic that my youngest turns 16 today. My experience of being a 16 year old, being around 16 year olds and raising two that have reached that age tells me that they are far from a finished product. There's a bigger difference from 16 to 18 than there is 18-20. Ever try to take your kid shopping for a car? They won't allow anyone under 18 to test drive or buy one due to the inability to enforce contracts. Yes, there are mature 16 year olds. There are probably more immature 18 year olds.
One lesson I have to continually teach my two kids is to stand your ground and fight for what you feel is right. It's an ongoing battle. Kids this age don't want confrontation with adults (unless with their parents
). They would rather acquiesce than one part of an "embarrassing" scene, regardless of who is right. Bottom line is the CK is a dingus. If sitting with his family mattered so much he would've traded his PE with a Y passenger.
Jul 30, 2018, 7:12 am
#98
Suspended
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: BA
Posts: 609
Ironic that my youngest turns 16 today. My experience of being a 16 year old, being around 16 year olds and raising two that have reached that age tells me that they are far from a finished product. There's a bigger difference from 16 to 18 than there is 18-20. Ever try to take your kid shopping for a car? They won't allow anyone under 18 to test drive or buy one due to the inability to enforce contracts. Yes, there are mature 16 year olds. There are probably more immature 18 year olds.
One lesson I have to continually teach my two kids is to stand your ground and fight for what you feel is right. It's an ongoing battle. Kids this age don't want confrontation with adults (unless with their parents). They would rather acquiesce than one part of an "embarrassing" scene, regardless of who is right. Bottom line is the CK is a dingus. If sitting with his family mattered so much he would've traded his PE with a Y passenger.
One lesson I have to continually teach my two kids is to stand your ground and fight for what you feel is right. It's an ongoing battle. Kids this age don't want confrontation with adults (unless with their parents
). They would rather acquiesce than one part of an "embarrassing" scene, regardless of who is right. Bottom line is the CK is a dingus. If sitting with his family mattered so much he would've traded his PE with a Y passenger.I dont need to know many more details to understand that the CK likely has cluster B tendencies and as others have pointed out does not have the insight or empathy to really grapple with their behavior. People like that must be consequenced (as the FA did very appropriately) with firm, direct limits.
Jul 30, 2018, 7:17 am
#99
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: BOS/UTH
Programs: AA LT PLT; QR GLD; Bonvoy LT TIT
Posts: 12,764
No, anyone can ask for anything. The person being asked is free to decline. But I'm under no obligation to verify that my offer will provide the person I ask with something of equal or greater value. And what are the criteria for determining value? Different people value different things differently. When AA used to fly that older configuration (767s?) with 2-3-2 in J, I would often prefer to sit on an aisle in Y rather than a center seat in J.
Jul 30, 2018, 8:18 am
#101
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: AA EXP; 1W Emerald; HHonors Diamond; Marriott Gold; UA dirt
Posts: 7,819
Wonder what percentage of CKs are FT users/readers .....
Jul 30, 2018, 9:29 am
#103
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: UA 1K 1MMer & LT UC (when flying UA); Hyatt Credit Cardist; HHonors Diamond; Marriott Gold via UA 1K
Posts: 6,956
Jul 30, 2018, 10:12 am
#104
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: stl
Programs: AA LT Plat/8.1mm now with 1350 miles left in my account and proud of it.. SPG LT Titanium.
Posts: 3,082
Ironic that my youngest turns 16 today. My experience of being a 16 year old, being around 16 year olds and raising two that have reached that age tells me that they are far from a finished product. There's a bigger difference from 16 to 18 than there is 18-20. Ever try to take your kid shopping for a car? They won't allow anyone under 18 to test drive or buy one due to the inability to enforce contracts. Yes, there are mature 16 year olds. There are probably more immature 18 year olds.
One lesson I have to continually teach my two kids is to stand your ground and fight for what you feel is right. It's an ongoing battle. Kids this age don't want confrontation with adults (unless with their parents). They would rather acquiesce than one part of an "embarrassing" scene, regardless of who is right. Bottom line is the CK is a dingus. If sitting with his family mattered so much he would've traded his PE with a Y passenger.
One lesson I have to continually teach my two kids is to stand your ground and fight for what you feel is right. It's an ongoing battle. Kids this age don't want confrontation with adults (unless with their parents
). They would rather acquiesce than one part of an "embarrassing" scene, regardless of who is right. Bottom line is the CK is a dingus. If sitting with his family mattered so much he would've traded his PE with a Y passenger.
Jul 30, 2018, 11:16 am
#105
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Stilllwater OK (SWO)
Programs: AAdvantage ExecPlat, World of Hyatt Globalist, plain "member" of Marriott, IHG, enterprise, etc.
Posts: 1,848
No, anyone can ask for anything. The person being asked is free to decline. But I'm under no obligation to verify that my offer will provide the person I ask with something of equal or greater value. And what are the criteria for determining value? Different people value different things differently. When AA used to fly that older configuration (767s?) with 2-3-2 in J, I would often prefer to sit on an aisle in Y rather than a center seat in J.