Apr 9, 2014, 11:05 am
Last edit by: JDiver
Angry about AAdvantage devaluation / vent / what can I do? (April 2014, consolidated)
Thread referred to: Devaluation, new tiers, oneworld Explorer award gone, etc. 8 April 2014
Without any prior notification, American Airlines announced on 8 April 2014 some significant AAdvantage program rescissions and devaluations, effective immediately:
- oneworld Explorer awards can no longer be claimed; (pre-existing awards will be honored)
- Stopovers at North American gateways for international partner award tickets were eliminated
- AAnytime awards now reflect variable, demand-based pricing
- US Dividend Miles North Asia premium awards have repriced
Important Information
AAnytime Awards: Effective April 8, 2014, for tickets issued for travel starting June 1, 2014, we have updated award levels. We will continue to honor any award tickets issued on / before April 7, 2014. For award bookings after April 8 for travel between April 8 and June 1, 2014, these award mileage levels will apply.
oneworld Explorer Awards are no longer available for award booking. We will continue to honor any award tickets issued on / before April 7, 2014.
AAnytime Awards: Effective April 8, 2014, for tickets issued for travel starting June 1, 2014, we have updated award levels. We will continue to honor any award tickets issued on / before April 7, 2014. For award bookings after April 8 for travel between April 8 and June 1, 2014, these award mileage levels will apply.
oneworld Explorer Awards are no longer available for award booking. We will continue to honor any award tickets issued on / before April 7, 2014.
Possibilities for action / communication:
Here's what you can do, as stated by the U.S. Supreme Court in its recent case (Source: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions...2-462_p8k0.pdf page 13)
It is your duty to enter a complaint with the DOT at http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/CP_AirlineService.htm. You can even quote this passage from the U.S. Supreme Court.
Congress has given the Department of Transportation (DOT) the general authority to prohibit and punish unfair and deceptive practices in air transportation and in the sale of air transportation, 49 U.S.C. §41712(a) , and Congress has specifically authorized the DOT to investigate complaints relating to frequent flyer programs. See FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012, §408(6), 126 Stat. 87. Pursuant to these provisions, the DOT regularly entertains and acts on such complaints.
Originally Posted by ooshawn
Just wrote an unhappy letter to AA/USAir execs (all email addresses I could find), if you want to feel free to use/build off of the following:
douglas.parker<at>usairways.com,
sean.bentel<at>aa.com,
tom.horton<at>aa.com ?
Customer.Relations<at>aa.com,
ken.fischer<at>usairways.com,
robert.isom<at>usairways.com,
suzanne.rubin<at>aa.com
douglas.parker<at>usairways.com,
sean.bentel<at>aa.com,
tom.horton<at>aa.com ?
Customer.Relations<at>aa.com,
ken.fischer<at>usairways.com,
robert.isom<at>usairways.com,
suzanne.rubin<at>aa.com
Originally Posted by MyTravels
USPS:
<Executive Name>
P.O. Box 619616
DFW Airport, TX 75261-9616
<Executive Name>
P.O. Box 619616
DFW Airport, TX 75261-9616
Angry about AAdvantage devaluation / vent / what can I do? (April 2014, consolidated)
Apr 10, 2014, 8:35 am
#166
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Austin,TX (AUS)
Programs: AA, UA
Posts: 767
I'm with those who are upset not because of the AAdvantage changes, but because of the the way they were implemented. In addition, it sets the precedent for sneaking in more cutbacks in the future.
My plan now is figure out what to do with my remaining miles. Then consider switching to United as my primary airline.
My plan now is figure out what to do with my remaining miles. Then consider switching to United as my primary airline.
Apr 10, 2014, 8:41 am
#167
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2004
Location: DFW/DAL
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, AS MVPG, HH Diamond, NCL Platinum Plus, MSC Diamond
Posts: 21,422
Background:
I was sitting with my son - who needed an award ticket. I agreed to front the CC and pay the BA "fees". Got to the end and the website said - The names on the ticket and credit card must MATCH. AA needs a work around for that - but that's off topic for here.
I called reservations and the PLT agent was delightful. And agreed that they have also been adversely affected by the changes. And she wondered why the Explorer awards disappeared as she understood the interest for those who took the time to book them. As son is non-elite, the computer charged us US$25. Which the agent did agree should have been $35
My remaining 2014 flights may be credited as leading to:
QF Emerald - CX ruby - anything left over to AA?
or
AA Emerald? (with no soft landing)
AT least I have till mid May to consider the final answer.
Unhappily wandering (at the moment)
Fred
I was sitting with my son - who needed an award ticket. I agreed to front the CC and pay the BA "fees". Got to the end and the website said - The names on the ticket and credit card must MATCH. AA needs a work around for that - but that's off topic for here.
I called reservations and the PLT agent was delightful. And agreed that they have also been adversely affected by the changes. And she wondered why the Explorer awards disappeared as she understood the interest for those who took the time to book them. As son is non-elite, the computer charged us US$25. Which the agent did agree should have been $35
My remaining 2014 flights may be credited as leading to:
QF Emerald - CX ruby - anything left over to AA?
or
AA Emerald? (with no soft landing)
AT least I have till mid May to consider the final answer.
Unhappily wandering (at the moment)
Fred
1. The fee also applies to Elites who are not Executive Platinum
2. The telephone fee is $25 for domestic/$35 for International
Apr 10, 2014, 8:51 am
#168
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: country Western Australia
Programs: QF SG(LTS) - AA LTG(1MM)
Posts: 2,771
It was an international SIN-LHR-TXL ticket.
Otherwise noted.
Happy wandering
Fred
Apr 10, 2014, 9:33 am
#169
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: San Diego, Ca
Programs: AA 2MM LT PLT; AS MVP Gold75k; HHonors Diamond; IHG PLT
Posts: 3,502
While not happy with airlines, hotel chains these days, I have even LESS sympathy for banks - particularly Citi. They are one of the major offenders who helped drive the economy over a cliff, now making billions by borrowing money from the Fed at zero interest.
Apr 10, 2014, 10:05 am
#170
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 1,309
???
You really think re-regulating the industry is the answer? You really think the government of all things knows how to run a business? No. Get ready for much much higher fares if that were to ever happen.
What is happening in the airline industry is the antithesis of a "competitive environment." In a competitive environment, businesses seek to attract new customers and retain existing customers with economic benefits superior to those offered by their competitors. Reducing benefits because others are doing so is plainly emblematic of an anti-competitive environment. Indeed, we can all agree, there is nowhere to turn.
The remaining apologists for the airlines industry among the frequent flyer community, and their opposition to long overdue re-regulation of this wreck of a business model, are facilitating the bad acts of Messrs. Parker, Smisek et al. and the so-called "race to the bottom." Sad to say.
--mcz
"We don't care because we don't have to."
--The Phone Company
http://snltranscripts.jt.org/76/76aphonecompany.phtml
The remaining apologists for the airlines industry among the frequent flyer community, and their opposition to long overdue re-regulation of this wreck of a business model, are facilitating the bad acts of Messrs. Parker, Smisek et al. and the so-called "race to the bottom." Sad to say.
--mcz
"We don't care because we don't have to."
--The Phone Company
http://snltranscripts.jt.org/76/76aphonecompany.phtml
Apr 10, 2014, 10:12 am
#171
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 789
I think re-regulating airlines would be a bad move. However the whole area of loyalty schemes seems to skirt so much law and legislation specifically on loyalty schemes including the employer employee ownership question, taxable benefit, the correct way to calculate provisions and what rights of expectation a consumer may have if acting based on promises in loyalty schemes.
Apr 10, 2014, 11:06 am
#173
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 385
And, no, I was not trying to make any sort of equivalency. Just using it as an example to counter the posts saying something along the lines of, Ļit doesn't affect me so I donīt careĻ The point is to speak up against the actions because you will care about the next set of actions.
Apr 10, 2014, 11:33 am
#174
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: FIND ME ON TWITTER FOR THE LATEST
Posts: 27,730
Apr 10, 2014, 11:35 am
#175
Join Date: Aug 2008
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,714
Wow!!! You seriously want to compare the plight of the over-entitled frequent flyer to those who perished in the Holocaust? Classic! 
For all of those out there who held on to the belief that a stand-alone AA was going to leave its FF program unchanged, you were living in a fantasy world. When the FF programs were at their most generous, airlines were bleeding billions of dollars. But hey! If I still get into F on my Y ticket, it's all good! Well, the industry figured out how to be profitable. Moreover, it was less than a decade ago that oil trading at $60 a barrel was considered the threashold point from when an airline would move from the black into the red. Today, airlines are doing quite well with oil hovering around $100 per barrel. And this is an inveitable consequence of that. And I'll use the demise of MRTC as a prime example of this. Passengers loved it; but not enough to pay more for it. So it went bye-bye. Now, if AA wanted to continue being "different" than the rest, and it wasn't costing them money to do so, they would have kept it.
For all of those out there who held on to the belief that a stand-alone AA was going to leave its FF program unchanged, you were living in a fantasy world. When the FF programs were at their most generous, airlines were bleeding billions of dollars. But hey! If I still get into F on my Y ticket, it's all good! Well, the industry figured out how to be profitable. Moreover, it was less than a decade ago that oil trading at $60 a barrel was considered the threashold point from when an airline would move from the black into the red. Today, airlines are doing quite well with oil hovering around $100 per barrel. And this is an inveitable consequence of that. And I'll use the demise of MRTC as a prime example of this. Passengers loved it; but not enough to pay more for it. So it went bye-bye. Now, if AA wanted to continue being "different" than the rest, and it wasn't costing them money to do so, they would have kept it.
Apr 10, 2014, 12:43 pm
#177
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 58
Bait and Switch by American - Lessons Learned
What AA has done is quite simply a "bait and switch". I have been successful at not paying for our annual July summer trips to Canada as a family of 3 by using airmiles for the last 4-5 years. I am not a "frequent" flier - perhaps 2 trips a year but we spend a lot as a family and charge things to those mileage affiliated credit cards.
I live in AUS, which has many AAdvantage members, just like other Texas "non-hub" cities like SAT and ELP. I would be willing to bet that a majority of AAdvantage members do not live in the five AA hub cities - Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami, Dallas, New York. This means they are often connecting in
a hub city to get to their final destination. More often that not, these AAdvantage members also are enrolled in other loyalty programs, like United Mileage Plus in my case.
The weekends surrounding July 4 have always been considered "peak summer" travel. Over the years, one way MileSAAver tickets were available from AUS to YYC for 12,500 miles in peak summer travel. Then they became more scarce and you eventually had to use 25,000 miles for a
one-way ticket from AUS to YYC in peak summer. I would envy someone living in Dallas; one ways from DFW- YYC could still be snagged for 12,500 miles in peak summer. Alas, I didn't live there, and it certainly was not worth the time (or money) to drive there just to get that 12,500 MileSAAver
ticket. The perils of living in a non-hub city.
Like many of you I play the game, but for the express purpose of getting from Point A to Point B. I don't use miles to "upgrade" etc. I have an Citi Aadvantage card and a Chase United Mileage Plus card that have annual fees of $85 and $95. I justify keeping these cards because of savings on bag fees, and priority boarding and the lounge access (thank-you, UNITED!)
What AA did on April 8 was an outrage. In a feeble attempt to raise revenue, they actually ended up losing a lot of revenue - to UNITED. Here is my experience:
1. My AA miles finally posted above 75,000 in March. Enough for 3 AAnytime awards (one-way) between
AUS and YYC. (25,000 each pior to April 8).
2. I decided to wait, in the hope I could snag a Business MileSAAver award or a reduced Economy award seeing that I could wait at least 21 days out. Big Mistake - On April 8 they changed the rules without sufficient notice for those planning a summer vacation. They knew it would force people like me
to actually purchase a ticket on AA. Or so they thought!
3. A new AAnytime one way reward for a Saturday departure the week before July 4 now costs 40,000 miles! I was sad. I had followed the rules throughout the past year, and in ONE day I lost the ability
to afford, miles-wise, a trip to see family in Canada. I was baited, then switched upon.
4. I checked that the one way retail fare on AA from AUS-YYC for that day was just $234 all-in. If you do the math it is a BAD deal to use miles, even if I had the miles for all three tickets - 40,000 miles on a fare that costs just $234!! I was prepared to pay instead, meaning revenue would come American's way.
5. I waited till the evening to book, and the retail fare on AA had escalated to a whooping $398. Thank-you, American! Not only did you have to screw me with miles, but on the retail cost of the ticket. There was a comparable fare on United at $236. Revenue was about to come American's way, but in their greedy attempt
to better align fare structure to miles required, they made no money, at least with me.
6. Enraged, I used my CITI Thank-you points (accrued on a no annual fee Citi Forward card) to get these tickets free of charge (I had over 75,000 Citi Thank-you points) on UNITED airlines.
Conclusions:
A. American is engaged in a "bait and switch" scheme, that will only get worse over time. Think 40,000 miles (one way) for a $234 coach ticket was bad?? Wait till you see redemption levels at 60,000 and
80,000 for one way domestic coach tickets. Its coming. Aadvanatage miles won't become SKy"pesos", they'll become AA"lira".
B. UNITED ended up being a winner, as Citi ended up paying them $236 on each of those tickets. United still offers
one ways on this route during peak summer at 25,000 miles. Still a deal, if you have UNITED miles.
C. Citibank offers other products which now may make even more sense to acquire, especially for travel. The cards that allow you to earn Thank-you points allow you to charge the full fare, including
taxes. This is significant since a round-trip ticket from the US to Canada results in over $60 of taxes that would still come out of your pocket, no matter which airline card you used. The bag fees that
one would have to pay are still less than the money forked out for the taxes.
D. The little guy (me) who tries to play by the rules always gets screwed. Thank-you, American!
I recall when I signed up for the Citibank AAdvantge card way back in the mid-90's. It came with 5,000 bonusmiles, or 7,500 if you "snagged" a deal. The one on offer is now 30,000 miles, and there's another one for 60,000 miles.Think your miles haven't devalued? Think again!!
I live in AUS, which has many AAdvantage members, just like other Texas "non-hub" cities like SAT and ELP. I would be willing to bet that a majority of AAdvantage members do not live in the five AA hub cities - Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami, Dallas, New York. This means they are often connecting in
a hub city to get to their final destination. More often that not, these AAdvantage members also are enrolled in other loyalty programs, like United Mileage Plus in my case.
The weekends surrounding July 4 have always been considered "peak summer" travel. Over the years, one way MileSAAver tickets were available from AUS to YYC for 12,500 miles in peak summer travel. Then they became more scarce and you eventually had to use 25,000 miles for a
one-way ticket from AUS to YYC in peak summer. I would envy someone living in Dallas; one ways from DFW- YYC could still be snagged for 12,500 miles in peak summer. Alas, I didn't live there, and it certainly was not worth the time (or money) to drive there just to get that 12,500 MileSAAver
ticket. The perils of living in a non-hub city.
Like many of you I play the game, but for the express purpose of getting from Point A to Point B. I don't use miles to "upgrade" etc. I have an Citi Aadvantage card and a Chase United Mileage Plus card that have annual fees of $85 and $95. I justify keeping these cards because of savings on bag fees, and priority boarding and the lounge access (thank-you, UNITED!)
What AA did on April 8 was an outrage. In a feeble attempt to raise revenue, they actually ended up losing a lot of revenue - to UNITED. Here is my experience:
1. My AA miles finally posted above 75,000 in March. Enough for 3 AAnytime awards (one-way) between
AUS and YYC. (25,000 each pior to April 8).
2. I decided to wait, in the hope I could snag a Business MileSAAver award or a reduced Economy award seeing that I could wait at least 21 days out. Big Mistake - On April 8 they changed the rules without sufficient notice for those planning a summer vacation. They knew it would force people like me
to actually purchase a ticket on AA. Or so they thought!
3. A new AAnytime one way reward for a Saturday departure the week before July 4 now costs 40,000 miles! I was sad. I had followed the rules throughout the past year, and in ONE day I lost the ability
to afford, miles-wise, a trip to see family in Canada. I was baited, then switched upon.
4. I checked that the one way retail fare on AA from AUS-YYC for that day was just $234 all-in. If you do the math it is a BAD deal to use miles, even if I had the miles for all three tickets - 40,000 miles on a fare that costs just $234!! I was prepared to pay instead, meaning revenue would come American's way.
5. I waited till the evening to book, and the retail fare on AA had escalated to a whooping $398. Thank-you, American! Not only did you have to screw me with miles, but on the retail cost of the ticket. There was a comparable fare on United at $236. Revenue was about to come American's way, but in their greedy attempt
to better align fare structure to miles required, they made no money, at least with me.
6. Enraged, I used my CITI Thank-you points (accrued on a no annual fee Citi Forward card) to get these tickets free of charge (I had over 75,000 Citi Thank-you points) on UNITED airlines.
Conclusions:
A. American is engaged in a "bait and switch" scheme, that will only get worse over time. Think 40,000 miles (one way) for a $234 coach ticket was bad?? Wait till you see redemption levels at 60,000 and
80,000 for one way domestic coach tickets. Its coming. Aadvanatage miles won't become SKy"pesos", they'll become AA"lira".
B. UNITED ended up being a winner, as Citi ended up paying them $236 on each of those tickets. United still offers
one ways on this route during peak summer at 25,000 miles. Still a deal, if you have UNITED miles.
C. Citibank offers other products which now may make even more sense to acquire, especially for travel. The cards that allow you to earn Thank-you points allow you to charge the full fare, including
taxes. This is significant since a round-trip ticket from the US to Canada results in over $60 of taxes that would still come out of your pocket, no matter which airline card you used. The bag fees that
one would have to pay are still less than the money forked out for the taxes.
D. The little guy (me) who tries to play by the rules always gets screwed. Thank-you, American!
I recall when I signed up for the Citibank AAdvantge card way back in the mid-90's. It came with 5,000 bonusmiles, or 7,500 if you "snagged" a deal. The one on offer is now 30,000 miles, and there's another one for 60,000 miles.Think your miles haven't devalued? Think again!!
Apr 10, 2014, 12:55 pm
#178
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: SFO/OAK
Programs: AA EXP 3.4MM, BAEC, UAMP, Skyteam (<10k) HH Gold, IHG Plat, Hertz Gold, GE/TSA TT
Posts: 2,723
that was my plan starting last fall, and Mrs.G and I spent a total >375k RDMs on various award tickets between last Dec. and this October. that's around 10% of all the AA miles we've earned since 1990!
Apr 10, 2014, 1:06 pm
#179
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: SFO/OAK
Programs: AA EXP 3.4MM, BAEC, UAMP, Skyteam (<10k) HH Gold, IHG Plat, Hertz Gold, GE/TSA TT
Posts: 2,723
I suppose I shouldnīt be shocked at the amount of time it took to receive such a reply. Pretty much explains how the US finds itself in a quasi-fascist bank-corporate-military industrial complex-totalitarian condition.
And, no, I was not trying to make any sort of equivalency. Just using it as an example to counter the posts saying something along the lines of, Ļit doesn't affect me so I donīt careĻ The point is to speak up against the actions because you will care about the next set of actions.
And, no, I was not trying to make any sort of equivalency. Just using it as an example to counter the posts saying something along the lines of, Ļit doesn't affect me so I donīt careĻ The point is to speak up against the actions because you will care about the next set of actions.
However, lots of people are rather sensitive about such comparisons, not unreasonably.
On the other hand, the US Federal govt has indeed become the "quasi-fascist bank-corporate-military industrial complex-totalitarian" entity (that Pres. Eisenhower warned us about), and if folks don't see that they are truly trapped in The Matrix.
All of these comparisons are definitely OTT though when talking about changes to a frequent flyer program ... jeez!
Apr 10, 2014, 1:28 pm
#180
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY, United States
Programs: AA, BA, UA, Spirit, Delta, PC Plat, SPG Gold, HHonors Diamond, Club Carlson Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,735
In the grand scheme of things, this lack of teeth displayed by ever regulatory agency in existence is terrible for the country, although for our little hobby, it's beyond fabulous.