Nov 26, 2014, 4:51 am
Last edit by: IADCAflyer
Speculation: New Routes, Hubs, Flights (2017 Onward)
Because there is community interest in having a purely speculative discussion about whether other airports will pop up to become focus cities or hubs, new routes, etc. the following new thread has been amalgamated on this topic.Note:
Going: 9 A330-300, ER190, some older 757-200 and 8 767-300ER (leaving 17), MD-80
Coming: Remainder of 16 Boeing 26 787-8, 22 Boeing 787-9 (began later 2016). A320 family - 100 A321neo, and B737-800 (100 737-MAX8) aircraft.
See Cranky Flier article on 2016 fleet changes, AA-HP-US. Link.
Also see: HELP DESK: General questions about aircraft equipment, fleet, seats, IFE, etc.
Speculation fun time: Will xxx be the next AA focus city / hub? (consolidated)
Obsolete posts from 2015 on have been moved to ARCHIVE: Speculation: Possible Routes (Flights) and Hubs, Discussion - 2015 on
All posts prior to 2015 have been moved here: ARCHIVE: Routes (Flights) and Hubs (Speculation, News and Discussion)
Speculation: Possible Routes (Flights) and Hubs, Discussion - (2017 on)
Aug 21, 2017, 10:47 pm
#691
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: los angeles, calif.
Programs: Alaska Airlines Gold MVP
Posts: 7,170
The problem with Milan is that travelers overwhelmingly prefer Linate, even when flying long-haul. MXP only supports year-round service to New York and Miami in the States (and Atlanta seasonally. That's it.), and both are massive local markets with strong premium demand due to the business connections Milan has with those cities. I don't see Philadelphia working.
Aug 21, 2017, 11:00 pm
#692
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Plano, TX, USA
Programs: AA: PPro, 4MM; HH: Lifetime Diamond; MAR Life Titanium Hertz: Prez Circle
Posts: 547
That of course assumes AA had the slots to go into LGA instead of JFK
Aug 22, 2017, 1:38 am
#693
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PHL
Programs: AA EXP, Marriott Lifetime Plat, SPG Plat, AMEX Plat, Hertz PC, Travels too Much Platinum
Posts: 3,290
The problem with Milan is that travelers overwhelmingly prefer Linate, even when flying long-haul. MXP only supports year-round service to New York and Miami in the States (and Atlanta seasonally. That's it.), and both are massive local markets with strong premium demand due to the business connections Milan has with those cities. I don't see Philadelphia working.
Aug 22, 2017, 2:44 am
#694
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 276
US Airways launched PHL-FCO in 1996, PHL-VCE in 2005 and PHL-MXP in 2006.
While they have been operating Rome & Venice since then (well nowadays as AA flights), the Milan route only lasted 3 years till S09.
Back to late October 2009 this was the reason cited by the carrier for the Milan suspension (along with other 4 "weak" destinations).
Originally Posted by US AIRWAYS
US Airways is making the following changes to facilitate the realignment strategy, which dictates matching the airline's schedule and operation to customer demand:
.....
* Suspending five European destinations from US Airways' international gateway in Philadelphia, given the weakness in trans-Atlantic revenue: Birmingham, U.K. (BHX); London Gatwick, U.K. (LGW); Milan, Italy (MXP); Shannon, Ireland (SNN); and Stockholm, Sweden (ARN). Seasonal service to Brussels, Belgium (BRU) and Zurich, Switzerland (ZRH) will transition to year-round service in late 2010.
.....
* Suspending five European destinations from US Airways' international gateway in Philadelphia, given the weakness in trans-Atlantic revenue: Birmingham, U.K. (BHX); London Gatwick, U.K. (LGW); Milan, Italy (MXP); Shannon, Ireland (SNN); and Stockholm, Sweden (ARN). Seasonal service to Brussels, Belgium (BRU) and Zurich, Switzerland (ZRH) will transition to year-round service in late 2010.
A bit curious, 1 month later the PHL-MXP suspension announcement, US Airways announced CLT-FCO to begin in S10.
Originally Posted by US AIRWAYS
US Airways to Offer New Nonstop Flight to Rome from Charlotte Hub
New Daily Service to the Italian Capital from the Airline’s Largest Hub Begins in May 2010
CHARLOTTE, N.C.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Dec. 4, 2009
New Daily Service to the Italian Capital from the Airline’s Largest Hub Begins in May 2010
CHARLOTTE, N.C.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Dec. 4, 2009
Aug 22, 2017, 9:26 am
#695
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Newton Centre, MA, USA
Programs: DL 2MM Gold, AA Plat Pro; Hilton Lifetime Diamond, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium (via SPG), IHG Plat
Posts: 2,192
I think something shifted about six years ago with a lot of traffic moving from MXP to FCO. For example, Alitalia used to fly BOS-MXP and although it was always pretty full it shifted to FCO a handful of years ago. Did FCO get more capacity or something?
Aug 22, 2017, 9:54 am
#696
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 2,506
I didn't see this posted here, but it looks like PHL-AMS is upgraded to a 767 as well next summer. I think this will leave GLA and SNN as the only 2 TATL cities with 757 service from PHL in S18, everything else is in a widebody.
It also surprised me how much JFK TATL service is on 757s (DUB, EDI) and 767s (CDG, MAD) next summer. MAD especially, being a OW hub with a JV partner, only has 1 flight/day.
It also surprised me how much JFK TATL service is on 757s (DUB, EDI) and 767s (CDG, MAD) next summer. MAD especially, being a OW hub with a JV partner, only has 1 flight/day.
Aug 22, 2017, 12:39 pm
#697
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 167
The Shift occurred in 2009 when Alitalia closed its MXP Hub and and restarted FCO as a hub. I remember reading at the time that US lost about 40 passengers on average that connected at MXP, the hub shift and soaring fuel costs in 08-09 led to the closure of the MXP route from PHL.
Aug 22, 2017, 12:54 pm
#698
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AA Platinum, Marriott Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 136
The problem with Milan is that travelers overwhelmingly prefer Linate, even when flying long-haul. MXP only supports year-round service to New York and Miami in the States (and Atlanta seasonally. That's it.), and both are massive local markets with strong premium demand due to the business connections Milan has with those cities. I don't see Philadelphia working.
Aug 22, 2017, 1:25 pm
#699
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 167
You are correct there are no long haul flights outside of the EU but lots of business travelers prefer Linate even though they are connecting in Fra, MUC, CDG, LHR etc. This is because it is very close to the city center versus MXP that is about 40 minutes north of the city. Milan is very under served because LIN takes traffic that would otherwise flow into MXP. There have been proposals to close LIN and force all traffic to MXP but that will never happen. So until this problem is solved MXP will be under served internationally- especially on the North Atlantic.
Aug 22, 2017, 1:36 pm
#700
Suspended
Join Date: May 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: DL Diamond, AAdvantage EXP, Hyatt Explorist, HHonors Diamond, Avis First
Posts: 7,344
You are correct there are no long haul flights outside of the EU but lots of business travelers prefer Linate even though they are connecting in Fra, MUC, CDG, LHR etc. This is because it is very close to the city center versus MXP that is about 40 minutes north of the city. Milan is very under served because LIN takes traffic that would otherwise flow into MXP. There have been proposals to close LIN and force all traffic to MXP but that will never happen. So until this problem is solved MXP will be under served internationally- especially on the North Atlantic.
Skip Milan and just spend your time in the lake region ^
Last edited by AANYC1981; Aug 22, 2017 at 2:25 pm
Aug 22, 2017, 1:46 pm
#701
Join Date: May 2007
Programs: UA 1K, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 5,453
Yes, but also don't forget IB, which has two daily A346s serving the route (at least in the summer; not sure if they draw it down to one daily or downgauge one of the frequencies). Not sure if JFK-MAD needs more OW capacity than that.
Aug 22, 2017, 2:21 pm
#702
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Colorado
Programs: UA Premier Silver, AA Executive Platinum, Marriott Lifetime Platinum
Posts: 813
Aug 22, 2017, 10:04 pm
#704
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MCO
Programs: AA, B6, DL, EK, EY, QR, SQ, UA, Amex Plat, Marriott Tit, HHonors Gold
Posts: 12,809
Aug 23, 2017, 3:09 am
#705
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 276
The Shift occurred in 2009 when Alitalia closed its MXP Hub and and restarted FCO as a hub. I remember reading at the time that US lost about 40 passengers on average that connected at MXP, the hub shift and soaring fuel costs in 08-09 led to the closure of the MXP route from PHL.