Last edit by: JDiver
Be sure to check the lengthy http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...elections.html and oneworld and Other Airline (Partner) Awards info, rules 2014 on threads, as many members have posted questions - and useful answers - there. See the wiki posts for informative summaries.
Also be aware - AA have reduced capacity and apparently chosen to make MileSAAver flights significantly less available during predicted periods of high demand and high demand flights, undoubtedly keeping seats available for those willing to pay higher fares and use the new tiered AAnytime awards.
Older posts as of 1 Jan 2015 and later may be found in thd archived thread ARCHIVE: MileSAAver / SAAver award reduction discussion post 2015 AAdvantage merger
Older posts may dating from Aug 2011 through the AAdvantage program merger January 2015 be found in the archived thread here.
MileSAAver / SAAver award reduction / scarcity discussion
#1591
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: YYF/YLW
Programs: AA, DL, AS, VA, WS Silver
Posts: 6,036
Trying to use BA points, and 1) they're not sharing the saver availability on the flight to their "partner" BA, and 2) you can't do that with BA points, you have to pay for both flights individually. Now, if they'd show the availability to their "partner" for the first half of the "saver" award I'd be set. I know there are seats...this has become such a joke.
AA is now using married segment logic for Saver award availability (whether booked with AA or with any partner, including BA). Just like with revenue tickets, AAA-BBB and AAA-CCC via BBB are priced as separate markets, so there may well be Saver award availability on AAA-BBB-CCC but not AAA-BBB.
They say they increased award availability with this (ie in the past, neither AAA-BBB nor AAA-BBB-CCC would have been available, whereas now at least AAA-BBB-CCC is available even though AAA-BBB still isn't), and I think there's even some evidence that that's true. But it's still frustrating to see. And AA award availability has gone down the toilet in a dramatic way over the last few years. I'm one of many in this forum who no longer uses AAdvantage for that reason.
#1592
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: AUH
Programs: EY Guest Gold, Hilton HHonors Gold, Le Club Accor Silver, AAdvantage Gold
Posts: 552
AAadvantage no longer serves its purpose for myself anymore. I credit all my segments on QR, UL and rarely AA to JAL mileage bank now.
#1593
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 398
No question that last minute awards on DL are high. On the other hand, for someone like me with a family of four who generally plans their vacation trips ahead and looks for coach awards, there are some values on DL. I'm seeing SFO-JFK from 9K miles one-way in coach on DL (10K in the summer) which I would consider a decent value. I realize I'm probably an outlier here on FT with a family, but not everyone's priorities are the same for their mileage redemptions.
BTW - I save actual AA miles for trips to europe, that's about the only good redemption left. If a ticket is 12.5k, its probably on sale for $109 anyways.
#1594
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 398
There is an extended thread about this: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...-segments.html.
AA is now using married segment logic for Saver award availability (whether booked with AA or with any partner, including BA). Just like with revenue tickets, AAA-BBB and AAA-CCC via BBB are priced as separate markets, so there may well be Saver award availability on AAA-BBB-CCC but not AAA-BBB.
They say they increased award availability with this (ie in the past, neither AAA-BBB nor AAA-BBB-CCC would have been available, whereas now at least AAA-BBB-CCC is available even though AAA-BBB still isn't), and I think there's even some evidence that that's true. But it's still frustrating to see. And AA award availability has gone down the toilet in a dramatic way over the last few years. I'm one of many in this forum who no longer uses AAdvantage for that reason.
AA is now using married segment logic for Saver award availability (whether booked with AA or with any partner, including BA). Just like with revenue tickets, AAA-BBB and AAA-CCC via BBB are priced as separate markets, so there may well be Saver award availability on AAA-BBB-CCC but not AAA-BBB.
They say they increased award availability with this (ie in the past, neither AAA-BBB nor AAA-BBB-CCC would have been available, whereas now at least AAA-BBB-CCC is available even though AAA-BBB still isn't), and I think there's even some evidence that that's true. But it's still frustrating to see. And AA award availability has gone down the toilet in a dramatic way over the last few years. I'm one of many in this forum who no longer uses AAdvantage for that reason.
As I said before, I just use my points for euro redemptions, some on AA metal, some on partners. The only value I can ever find (my family doesn't fly first class.)
#1595
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 398
Apples and oranges; WN uses a quasi-revenue-based calculation for award seats, while AA is essentially flat, region based. Your 3500 WN point example is for a relatively short, cheap flight - generally less than $100. I just randomly checked WN's WGA redemption for SAN-BWI on 3/27: 10,784 - 28,008 points, BS jumps to a whopping 69,509 - 70,514. In contrast: saaver coach starts at 12,500, unrestricted, fully refundable first class on AA ,maxes out at 45,000 miles.
WN will also jack up its WGA redemption rate for higher demand travel days.
WN will also jack up its WGA redemption rate for higher demand travel days.
nonstop 13,174
1 stop 8,774
SAN-BWI AA 3/27:
nonstop NOPE
1 stop 12,500
BTW, you picked 3/27 because every other single day that week has NO AVAILABILITY on AA for savers. NONE. Only 30k points. WN has a ton of availability multiple days that week. And the only available tickets could be purchased for $201. Notice that all the other days start at $250+? There is nothing "flat" about the AAdvantage program. As soon as tickets reach a certain price, they take all saver availability away, regardless if a single award ticket was issued, so now they are 30k points. I see this constantly on routes out of MIA. 7+ tickets if $109, $170 "sorry no saver awards." (Cut off for SAN-BWI/DCA seems to be in the low 2's.) They're doing the same damn thing as WN but at least WN gives you the option to use points at the higher price and I can't tell you how many times its STILL less than 12.5k pts for a domestic ticket. In fact I never pay 12.5k on any airline for any domestic ticket unless its MIA-LAX or MIA-LAS. 10k max if I'm going ORD etc. Much less on WN to LA and LAS many times. 12.5k should be a "worst case scenario" and for AA I can just buy the ticket for $109 anyways if its available at 12.5k.
#1596
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 398
That's a bit different. You are talking about using Avios for a ticket. That is NOT the same as "AAdvantage"
BA doesn't (or "don't, depending on your version of English) make all award seats open to AA customers, and vice versa.
There is no requirement that award availability be the same among OW members.
BA doesn't (or "don't, depending on your version of English) make all award seats open to AA customers, and vice versa.
There is no requirement that award availability be the same among OW members.
But no worries, I booked a worse flight that day, and when one of the next 2 or 3 schedule changes (oh god the schedule changes...) come in the next few months I'll force them to put me on the flight I really want.
#1597
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 398
Several key dates that led to AAdvantage downfall over the years:
December 9, 2013:takeover by merger with US Airways closed
April 8, 2014: stopovers eliminated, Anytime Award prices raised (with no notice)
March 22, 2016: many sAAver award prices raised
May 11, 2016: Suzanne Rubin announces resignation
August 1, 2016: earnings become spend based
January 1, 2017: PQD added
December 9, 2013:
April 8, 2014: stopovers eliminated, Anytime Award prices raised (with no notice)
March 22, 2016: many sAAver award prices raised
May 11, 2016: Suzanne Rubin announces resignation
August 1, 2016: earnings become spend based
January 1, 2017: PQD added
For example, the day I was looking at, there were 3 flights from FLL to ORD where they were giving away tickets at $109, 7+ savers available on each flight. Schedule change comes out, cancel 2 flights, jack rates on the last flight left, and 0 award tickets available. 7 people didn't book award tickets on that last flight. It's the price increase. And you can see it across routes everywhere - some routes the cutoff is between $100-$150 where they take all the availability away, some its $200-$250, but there's a pattern here. If they're going to do this they should go to a full WN revenue based redemption program instead of hidden hard stops. 1.8 pts/$ at 1.7 cents guarantees me 3 cents on WN (double when I had companion pass!) Good luck finding those $300+, 12.5k domestic saver awards!
#1599
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: AA EXP; 1W Emerald; HHonors Diamond; Marriott Gold; UA dirt
Posts: 8,083
I've booked a number of AA flights recently using reward redemption options - 12,500 mile and 7,500 mile variety. What I've noticed with AA is you need to book well in advance or take advantage of last minute award openings. I've flown my mother out from California at least three or four times in the past year to DCA or IAD or BWI and my cousin from SLC or SEA to DCA or BWI or IAD. Sometimes booked 24 hours before departure.
Don't expect holiday time flights for AA with a few exceptions though.
Don't expect holiday time flights for AA with a few exceptions though.
#1600
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
That can be true for short-haul flights, and isn't new. It's different for medium to long-haul flights. A BOS-ORD-DEN flight prices as 15,000 Avios or can be 12,500 AAdvantage miles. There are also lots of AA flights at Saver levels that Avios doesn't offer, so Avios for travel on AA isn't the magic bullet, even for short haul. You really need to know the program architectures - region based vs. distance-based is a key element - before offering generalizations that can be of value to others.
#1602
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: AA Gold, Amex Plat
Posts: 4,008
No question that last minute awards on DL are high. On the other hand, for someone like me with a family of four who generally plans their vacation trips ahead and looks for coach awards, there are some values on DL. I'm seeing SFO-JFK from 9K miles one-way in coach on DL (10K in the summer) which I would consider a decent value. I realize I'm probably an outlier here on FT with a family, but not everyone's priorities are the same for their mileage redemptions.
Also, I just discovered today that the $75 close-in booking fee is waived for Golds. I know in the past this was not the case and only EXP got the fee waived. There was still at least one seat at 12,500 miles from DFW-LGA on Friday 3/9, prime Spring Break travel for some colleges in Texas, that I booked for a family member just now. Score!
#1603
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: OKC
Programs: IHG Spire, National Exec, AA Plat
Posts: 2,326
I was able to grab a Saver for LHR/OKC late last week which was great. The only problem is the DFW/OKC segment is the next morning - the last 2 flights that night have no availability as of now. I've got EF alerts setup and hopefully inventory will open up on them to get me back that night.
#1604
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Not here; there!
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold
Posts: 31,144
I concur. For my usual mid-con domestic route, I did an award search recently... Last minute one way costs around $500. Delta wanted 60,000 miles for that $500 ticket. AA and UA only 12,500 miles. Even with the $75 "expedite fee" the grass is greener for many awards on AA.
Or, if you have a Citi or Barclays AA credit card, check to see if your destination is on the list of reduced-mileage-award destinations:
https://www.aa.com/i18n/aadvantage-p...age-awards.jsp
#1605
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 398
That can be true for short-haul flights, and isn't new. It's different for medium to long-haul flights. A BOS-ORD-DEN flight prices as 15,000 Avios or can be 12,500 AAdvantage miles. There are also lots of AA flights at Saver levels that Avios doesn't offer, so Avios for travel on AA isn't the magic bullet, even for short haul. You really need to know the program architectures - region based vs. distance-based is a key element - before offering generalizations that can be of value to others.