rumor : new upgrade co-payment effective 01dec04
Oct 5, 2004, 9:34 am
#31
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Dallas
Programs: AA Plat
Posts: 253
Well, this really upsets my plans. I was planning to take one more trip this year to keep Plat but since my main reason to do it was to upgrade I don't know if it is worth it or not now.
Oct 5, 2004, 9:34 am
#32
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: IAD/DCA, USA (MD Suburbs)
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, HH Diamond, Fairmont RIP, Hertz Plat, BA Gold
Posts: 1,624
This "enhancement" would make more sense if the announcement coincided with an announcement to improve the business class (ie: flat seats). I suspect this will not be the case.
Oct 5, 2004, 9:37 am
#33
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
Posts: 31,789
Although I have previously expressed support for a co-payment, I had always assumed that it would start at a small number and work its way up from there - like maybe $100 each way plus miles. $250? Ouch.
Oct 5, 2004, 9:41 am
#34
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Potomac Falls, VA
Programs: AA Plat 2MM, MR Gold, Avis Pref
Posts: 41,109
I left CO for this crAAp???
Someone has been drinking too much koolaid with the Nonepass monkeys
Oct 5, 2004, 9:41 am
#35
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Chicago
Programs: AA EXP Lifetime Platinum, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 9,978
As a DFW flyer forced to pay 2200 for a coach flight into and out of Newark this Friday, I'm actually glad to see AA is planning on gouging some of its other customers.
I'm sure there will be a lot of whinging about this but realistically it means you can still get into Int'l J for less than 1K and some miles. There is the issue of devaluing miles in one of the last places they did much good, but that's another issue.
IMHO, if you're the sort that won't pop 500 more to fly in J, AA doesn't really need your business.
I'm sure there will be a lot of whinging about this but realistically it means you can still get into Int'l J for less than 1K and some miles. There is the issue of devaluing miles in one of the last places they did much good, but that's another issue.
IMHO, if you're the sort that won't pop 500 more to fly in J, AA doesn't really need your business.
Oct 5, 2004, 9:45 am
#36
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Potomac Falls, VA
Programs: AA Plat 2MM, MR Gold, Avis Pref
Posts: 41,109
speak for yourself not AA
If I'm popping 6000 plus per J ticket overseas and when I want a personal trip for 250 to 500 bucks and want to u/g with miles.. i'll betcha that AA still wants my business.. but if they are willing to risk that over 250 bucks then so be it.. I just need to digest what they're doing and what others are doing before making a decision.. but it does make one at least consider other options
Originally Posted by Spyder
As a DFW flyer forced to pay 2200 for a coach flight into and out of Newark this Friday, I'm actually glad to see AA is planning on gouging some of its other customers.
I'm sure there will be a lot of whinging about this but realistically it means you can still get into Int'l J for less than 1K and some miles. There is the issue of devaluing miles in one of the last places they did much good, but that's another issue.
IMHO, if you're the sort that won't pop 500 more to fly in J, AA doesn't really need your business.
I'm sure there will be a lot of whinging about this but realistically it means you can still get into Int'l J for less than 1K and some miles. There is the issue of devaluing miles in one of the last places they did much good, but that's another issue.
IMHO, if you're the sort that won't pop 500 more to fly in J, AA doesn't really need your business.
Oct 5, 2004, 9:46 am
#37
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Bay Area
Programs: AA, Hilton, Hyatt
Posts: 544
Originally Posted by LLZ
And now AA's gone and made liars out of us....<<<------ya hear that AA!
Oct 5, 2004, 9:48 am
#38
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Ireland
Programs: AA PLT 2MM, IHG Plat
Posts: 3,566
Originally Posted by JonNYC
A co-pay of $250 will be required to claim mileage Upgrade Awards used with most Discount and Deep Discount Economy fares when traveling between North America and Europe, Japan and Deep South America, effective December 1.
I'm not clear at this moment if the above is round-trip or each-way ( I was afraid to ask.) Additionally, I don't know applicability to VIP upgrades.
Also effective December 1 will be the discontinuance of the upgrade awards between Latin America and Europe.
I'm not clear at this moment if the above is round-trip or each-way ( I was afraid to ask.) Additionally, I don't know applicability to VIP upgrades.
Also effective December 1 will be the discontinuance of the upgrade awards between Latin America and Europe.
I would hope/expect that it doesn't apply to VIPs earned by EXPs. If it does it would seem to reverse this year's points earning changes to encourage people to go for EXP. If they do then the following figures don't make it look so good on AA.
R/T upgrade to business LHR-US
Airfare + 50,000 miles + $500 => No thanks!
R/T upgrade to business LHR-South America
Airfare + 100,000 miles + $1,000 => Definitely No thanks!!!
R/T award in business LHR-South America
140,000 miles => No thanks
Star Alliance award LHR-South America using BMI miles.
75,000 miles, or 37,500 miles + GBP255 => Not bad
If the charges apply to VIPs then EXP will no longer be worth it and the UK status match may have come at an opportune time. Shame as I've converted two good friends from Air France to AA for our Brazil trips. Hopefully I won't have to persuade them again.
Indeed if the fee is $250 e/w then incredibly BA may start to look better value for transatlantic upgrades. Spend the the extra to $500 to guarantee yourself a WT+ seat and then MFU i.e. 25,000 miles to upgrade round trip to J.
Aside from personal considerations this will p*ss a lot of AA fliers off. For me it's a very bad move by AA. Whether it's a bad move for AA only the number crunchers know.
Last edited by oiRRio; Oct 5, 2004 at 9:54 am
Oct 5, 2004, 9:51 am
#39
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: DFW, USA
Programs: AA EXP, Hyatt Diamond, Starwood Platinum
Posts: 141
Devaluation of my miles...
I currently have a flight booked from DFW to LGW on 1/7 and returning 1/9(starting my run for EXP early). My airfare is $492.
If I wanted to fly Business roundtrip my costs would include the original fare plus 50,000 miles. Value those miles at .02 per mile and I am looking at spending $1,492 total for this trip.
The cheapest I Fare during those dates is $3,392. So my 50,000 miles bought me $2,900 in value or $.058 per mile.
With the new fee I am spending $992 out of pocket + 50,000 miles. With the .02 valuation for my miles then I am looking at really spending $1,992 for this trip now. I am only getting $2,400 in value for my miles now or .048 per mile.
This devalues the value of this award considerably. In fact, it becomes the only major award that requires you to pay out of your pocket. I have watched my mileage costs go from 100,000 for 2 to OGG, to 120,000, to 150,000 in a short amount of time. Not happy but I can live with that. Why this award is different and just does not increase in miles(5,000 each way is the comparable cost) I just don't know. Looks like coach for me on this route if I am having to pay.
If I wanted to fly Business roundtrip my costs would include the original fare plus 50,000 miles. Value those miles at .02 per mile and I am looking at spending $1,492 total for this trip.
The cheapest I Fare during those dates is $3,392. So my 50,000 miles bought me $2,900 in value or $.058 per mile.
With the new fee I am spending $992 out of pocket + 50,000 miles. With the .02 valuation for my miles then I am looking at really spending $1,992 for this trip now. I am only getting $2,400 in value for my miles now or .048 per mile.
This devalues the value of this award considerably. In fact, it becomes the only major award that requires you to pay out of your pocket. I have watched my mileage costs go from 100,000 for 2 to OGG, to 120,000, to 150,000 in a short amount of time. Not happy but I can live with that. Why this award is different and just does not increase in miles(5,000 each way is the comparable cost) I just don't know. Looks like coach for me on this route if I am having to pay.
Oct 5, 2004, 9:55 am
#40
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: PIT
Posts: 10,986
Originally Posted by TrojanHorse
If I'm popping 6000 plus per J ticket overseas and when I want a personal trip for 250 to 500 bucks and want to u/g with miles.. i'll betcha that AA still wants my business..
This change should not surprise anyone. Just look at AA's income statements for the last few years.
Would it be better to have no options for upgrades?
Oct 5, 2004, 9:59 am
#41
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Chicago
Programs: AA EXP Lifetime Platinum, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 9,978
Originally Posted by TrojanHorse
If I'm popping 6000 plus per J ticket overseas and when I want a personal trip for 250 to 500 bucks and want to u/g with miles.. i'll betcha that AA still wants my business.. but if they are willing to risk that over 250 bucks then so be it.. I just need to digest what they're doing and what others are doing before making a decision.. but it does make one at least consider other options
If on the other hand you fly for 'business' in J because it's the best value for the money, I doubt very much that you'll be taking your travel elsewhere.
(The emphasis on the word business is added to reflect that for those of us who work for ourselves, personal and professional travel are not so neatly defined.)
Oct 5, 2004, 10:01 am
#42
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: London, UK
Programs: AA EXP 1MM, HH Gold, dirt loads of places.
Posts: 1,657
Well, at the moment a lot of my personal trips are LHR to CAE and back. Because AA doesn't serve CAE, I endure the Eagle flight ORD-CLT and the hour and a half drive just so I can upgrade the LHR-ORD bit.
If AA are going to gouge me an extra $500 then I'm going to start thinking "Hey, UA fly into CAE, and LHR is just as good for UA as it is for AA..." and, as TrojanHorse says, I'll take my business travel with me. Heck, if US survive I might remember that they fly direct from LGW to CLT.
I'll need to study closely tomorrow to find out if the fee is only for miles or if it also includes VIPs. If the former, my best strategy might be to burn up my miles on upgrades before Dec 1, use my VIPs afterward, burn what's left on free trips and ask UA for a status match in the new year. If the latter, a lot of my buddies might get unexpected presents
If AA are going to gouge me an extra $500 then I'm going to start thinking "Hey, UA fly into CAE, and LHR is just as good for UA as it is for AA..." and, as TrojanHorse says, I'll take my business travel with me. Heck, if US survive I might remember that they fly direct from LGW to CLT.
I'll need to study closely tomorrow to find out if the fee is only for miles or if it also includes VIPs. If the former, my best strategy might be to burn up my miles on upgrades before Dec 1, use my VIPs afterward, burn what's left on free trips and ask UA for a status match in the new year. If the latter, a lot of my buddies might get unexpected presents
Oct 5, 2004, 10:04 am
#43
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 538
Originally Posted by JonNYC
A co-pay of $250 will be required to claim mileage Upgrade Awards used with most Discount and Deep Discount Economy fares when traveling between North America and Europe, Japan and Deep South America, effective December 1.
I'm not clear at this moment if the above is round-trip or each-way ( I was afraid to ask.) Additionally, I don't know applicability to VIP upgrades.
Also effective December 1 will be the discontinuance of the upgrade awards between Latin America and Europe.
I'm not clear at this moment if the above is round-trip or each-way ( I was afraid to ask.) Additionally, I don't know applicability to VIP upgrades.
Also effective December 1 will be the discontinuance of the upgrade awards between Latin America and Europe.
Oct 5, 2004, 10:13 am
#44
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
I'm going to use a technique I was taught by my Rescue Diver instructor - when someone appears to be panicking, stop, breathe, think and act. OK, I breathed, now I have to wait for the actual information, rather than speculation, and then decide how to act...
I presume most of us expected some "revenue enhancement" activity from AA so they can survive - and think their survival will bode my FF status much better than Chapter 11 and adios. So, I'm going to relax, settle in and see how this actually works out before I start making major changes or getting upset.
Cheers, and take care, friends...
I presume most of us expected some "revenue enhancement" activity from AA so they can survive - and think their survival will bode my FF status much better than Chapter 11 and adios. So, I'm going to relax, settle in and see how this actually works out before I start making major changes or getting upset.
Cheers, and take care, friends...
Oct 5, 2004, 10:17 am
#45
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: NYLON - AA EXP 1MM, SPG Gold
Posts: 1,234
This is such a let down.
This totally devalues AAdvantage to non US residents. I am about to become EXP this year but I travel almost exclusively trans-atlantic so free domestic upgrades is not an AAdvantage for me. If this is true, I will be asking BA to comp my AA status.
This totally devalues AAdvantage to non US residents. I am about to become EXP this year but I travel almost exclusively trans-atlantic so free domestic upgrades is not an AAdvantage for me. If this is true, I will be asking BA to comp my AA status.